Fuel Pump Failure FYI:

[JasonF1234]

We know that the fuel pump boosters that are on the market aren't the reason for the failure they have been out since the 90s and for the most part almost everyone I know including me has had them on multiple cars without issue's. Now if the issue is due to a design flaw in the hat that it doesn't like the added pressure well that's a diff story but if I had to guess that's not the problem either.
I know no one wants to admit it but it's the E85 doing the damage and in the next 6-12 months u will see even more failures. This so called magic fuel loves to attracts moisture and that water loves to corrode the inside of the pumps and anything metal in the fuel system. There has been talk that the new pumps in our cars can handle it but I'm not taking the chance.
I'm sticking with what I know works Torco accelerator to keep it safe on the street and race fuel at the track.

Amen brother! Torco and race gas it's been good to me too!

 

[JUIC3D]

"No E85" has to do with the size of injectors and fuel pump, not to mention the ECU programming.

Materials used in the fuel system are compatible with Ethanol, at any level.

F150 Flex Fuel fuel pumps, lines, tank, injectors are all the same materials as 5.0 Mustangs.

This is great news. Do you have any literature or pictures to support it? I've been running E85 in the car for awhile now with no issues so I'm not surprised.

 

[SC_Terminator]

I've been running E85 in the car for awhile now with no issues so I'm not surprised.

JUIC3D,

How many miles/months have you been running E85....also, do you swap back and forth between Gas and E85 or has it been nothing but E85?

 

[JUIC3D]

Always E85, I never switch back to gas. I do splash in lucas E85 conditioner with my fill ups for peace of mind though.

I've been on E85 for about 7-10k miles and 6-7 months if I remember correctly. My car currently has 16k miles on it.

 

[Shaun@AED]

FYI I measured the outlet port of the stock fuel hat the other day.
Inner diameter measured .185". (Less than 1/5th of an inch)
By contrast the 2007 GT500 hat we measured was .250" ID at the hat.

Volume = area x length
So we can calculate the added volume in % by using the area of each and dividing them by each other.
The math says .250" will flow 82% more than .185" ID.

IMO we are pushing a rediculous amount of fuel thru a .185" ID fuel fitting. 700 on E85 is enough fuel for 1000 on gasoline. I can't see how we would not have excessive pressure before this restriction in the hat when a BAP added.

I think the BAP + E85 = fuel pump failure is due to added head pressure of running more than 17.5v from the BAP's, which you would never need to do on gasoline.

And no all-motor E85 coyote that I have tuned has had fuel pump failure as far as I know.

 

[D.T.R]

Yeah when i pulled my fuel hat out of the tank this past weekend, i was amazed at how small the outlet port was and how much power we've been making on these pumps.
Looks like a -4an line if that lol

 

[nonliberal]

FYI I measured the outlet port of the stock fuel hat the other day.
Inner diameter measured .185". (Less than 1/5th of an inch)
By contrast the 2007 GT500 hat we measured was .250" ID at the hat.

Volume = area x length
So we can calculate the added volume in % by using the area of each and dividing them by each other.
The math says .250" will flow 82% more than .185" ID.

IMO we are pushing a rediculous amount of fuel thru a .185" ID fuel fitting. 700 on E85 is enough fuel for 1000 on gasoline. I can't see how we would not have excessive pressure before this restriction in the hat when a BAP added.

I think the BAP + E85 = fuel pump failure is due to added head pressure of running more than 17.5v from the BAP's, which you would never need to do on gasoline.

And no all-motor E85 coyote that I have tuned has had fuel pump failure as far as I know.

Sounds like the same bottleneck fix mentioned in the other thread would benefit this platform as well.

 

[corysmach1]

Great. Ive been on E85 tuned by AED for 6k miles and 7 months. Im just a bolt on car but i do apin it to 7700. This sucks.

 

[Shaun@AED]

Great. Ive been on E85 tuned by AED for 6k miles and 7 months. Im just a bolt on car but i do apin it to 7700. This sucks.

no all-motor E85 coyote that I have tuned has had fuel pump failure as far as I know.

:rolling:

 

[04compgt]

FYI I measured the outlet port of the stock fuel hat the other day.
Inner diameter measured .185". (Less than 1/5th of an inch)
By contrast the 2007 GT500 hat we measured was .250" ID at the hat.

Volume = area x length
So we can calculate the added volume in % by using the area of each and dividing them by each other.
The math says .250" will flow 82% more than .185" ID.

IMO we are pushing a rediculous amount of fuel thru a .185" ID fuel fitting. 700 on E85 is enough fuel for 1000 on gasoline. I can't see how we would not have excessive pressure before this restriction in the hat when a BAP added.

I think the BAP + E85 = fuel pump failure is due to added head pressure of running more than 17.5v from the BAP's, which you would never need to do on gasoline.

And no all-motor E85 coyote that I have tuned has had fuel pump failure as far as I know.

Hey Shaun, when you did these measurements, did you by any chance measure ID of the stock fuel line going to the hat? Not the 90* fitting that goes into the hat, but the actual feed line on a mustang GT.

 

[04compgt]

Great. Ive been on E85 tuned by AED for 6k miles and 7 months. Im just a bolt on car but i do apin it to 7700. This sucks.

I wouldn't worry Cory, I have been on e85 on my daily driver for 30K+ miles and a lot of passes. A shoe box full of timeslips to be exact. No issues here, but I also refuse to put a boost a pump on my fuel system. I also spin my car 7700+ on motor, I need more fuel for what I want to do, but I am going to do a fuel system instead.

 

[SC_Terminator]

Are there any fixes (mods) for this, other than replacing the Hat?

 

[Shaun@AED]

Hey Shaun, when you did these measurements, did you by any chance measure ID of the stock fuel line going to the hat? Not the 90* fitting that goes into the hat, but the actual feed line on a mustang GT.

I measured the OD and it is identical to the GT500's.

 

[04compgt]

I measured the OD and it is identical to the GT500's.

So its a 1/4" feed line?

 

[Shaun@AED]

So its a 1/4" feed line?

3/8th OD

 

[04compgt]

3/8th OD

Thanks for clarifying. I am buying some fittings and needed the measurements for the stock fuel line.

 

[nosscort]

What about na cars with a Bap because of nitrous? And running e85 but sometimes switch to 93 because of either weather or availability when traveling? Bap is a non programmable vortech unit with 47lbs in..

 

[Aaron@JPCRacing]

"No E85" has to do with the size of injectors and fuel pump, not to mention the ECU programming.

Materials used in the fuel system are compatible with Ethanol, at any level.

F150 Flex Fuel fuel pumps, lines, tank, injectors are all the same materials as 5.0 Mustangs.

The fuel pump in a Flex Fuel 5.0 F150 is NOT the same as a 5.0 Mustang.

See fuel pumps below. The hat assembly is out of a 2013 FFV 5.0 F150 and the pump sitting next to it is a 5.0 Mustang. Clearly these are not the same pumps.

 

[SteveG@Lethal]

And to add to Aaron's post along with our phone call today,

Here is also the parts #s for the Mustang and F150 fuel pumps.

Mustang 5.0L
Fuel Pump #
CR3Z9H307A - 2011
CR3Z9H307B - 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014


F150 EcoBoost
Fuel Pump(S)
High Pressure Pump:
BL3Z9350C - 2011, 2012, 2013

In-Tank Pump:
CL3Z9H307A - 2012, 2013

 

[beefcake]

And to add to Aaron's post along with our phone call today,

Here is also the parts #s for the Mustang and F150 fuel pumps.

Mustang 5.0L
Fuel Pump #
CR3Z9H307A - 2011
CR3Z9H307B - 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014


F150 EcoBoost
Fuel Pump(S)
High Pressure Pump:
BL3Z9350C - 2011, 2012, 2013

In-Tank Pump:
CL3Z9H307A - 2012, 2013

ecoboost is not "e85" rated

the 5.0 is