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Discussion in 'Engine/Tuning' started by 1Quick4.6, May 3, 2011.
link or it didn't happen.
I'll try to dig it up tomorrow at work.
I can help, I've been following this topic on some forums. Post number 172 starts the FRPP tune failure discussion. Post 178 he says Ford reinstalled the tune on the new engine.
Are aftermarket tunes causing the #8 cylinder to take a dump? - Page 12 - Ford Mustang Forums
yep. that's the thread. I have it bookmarked at work along with a couple of posts by "2011GrabberGT" basically saying how after working with the Ford ECU's, they can tell that you've had a tune even if you reflash to stock, let the battery die, do the drive cycles, etc..
allfordmustang is one of the worst sites for lies and BS. More to this story.
Thanks. I've been following it too in my search for stock untuned blown #8 (still yet to be found). This is closest yet so I'll read looking for discrepancies.
That is possible, just like Ford having issues with some engines is possible. I agree that there are some odd threads on that site.
He is an active member there, and doesn't talk bad about Ford that I can see, he even says they treated him great. Would be odd for him to be lying. He said his car is running great now.
He did say his engine was one of the oil consuming ones. He also drives a lot more than most people. His car had 20k miles on it when it died. Could be a sign of things to come for more cars. Could just be bad luck, which is what I'm hoping.
I haven't seen a post first hand by someone with a stock setup losing #8. Of course that doesn't mean there aren't, but it is significant that none have been posted.
/agree absolutely. That's what I've been saying all along. It's not a substandards part issue if they live in factory conditions.
I've read numerous people burning astonishing amounts of oil very early in the life of the engine and also reading that dealers are saying this is "normal".
After 3100 miles, my car's dip stick shows oil level covering 3/4 of the "oil level ok" area of the stick.
I wonder if this has any correlation with the #8 failures or if it's just another random isolated issue?
Ya, try 3.75 quarts in 4,100 miles
Your car was probably low from the get go. Otherwise you would be blowing blue smoke when you start up and during WOT/
That's what the dealer is saying too...
The oil burning thing is interesting. With all my troubles with engine ticking, I never lost one drop of oil between 5000 oil changes. I mean it didn't move a hair on the dipstick.
I thought the ticking/knocking when cold sound guys are having was an issue with the timing chain or tensioner or something like that?
But you are forgetting something according to the law...Ford MUST PROVE it was the tune or modification that you did was what caused the engine damage. I don't think people are realizing this.
And I hear people saying, "Well it states CLEARLY in Ford Warranty if you mod the car the warranty is gone."
Thing is it does NOT MATTER if the Ford warranty says this. Ford can put this in the warranty as much and as clear as they want. THE LAW takes presence and has rule OVER what Ford says.
Whether fair or not, this is what the law says so this is what goes. Morally correct or not. The problem for the person stating this law to ford is that they have to barf up the money to actually take Ford to court.
While I agree on moral terms in a way that you must pay to play and if you mod you take a risk. I also agree morally that you should not have to pay for an engine going boom if your mods were not the cause and it was a faultly design by Ford.
This whole thing can be looked at with some legitimacy on BOTH sides as far as morals go and what should or should not be covered.
But we must also remember that the LAW is what stands. Not what is morally right or wrong in our land. Again I think both sides have legit claims on what they think should be covered or not morally. That is what is so hard about this whole thing to swallow.
Hopefully this is not going to turn into a HUGE widespread problem.
It seems the MAJORITY of people are modding with no problems. We gotta remember that the reason it seems so widespread is the majority of people that actually start threads on the issue are those that have problems. Thus most of what you read comes from that small amount of people... which in turn makes it seem bigger than it may be.
But it is obviously happening enough to cause some worry. If it was not Ford would not take the trouble to release a TSB on the subject and re remind people of where Ford stands on the issue.
While there is a pay to play to consider and as a whole mods can cause damage even in a properly manufactured car so we must realize the whole idea of if your mods did not cause the damage why should you pay to play... also has a point to be considered.
I do feel for the people that are having this happen IF it is not the mod that is causing the underlying problem. Especially given the fact that the Mustang community has a HUGE history of loving the Mustang due to the fact that you can personalize it and mod it.
If it is indeed a Ford default causing the 5.0 not to be able to handle mods on a widespread scale, these people are going to feel left out as far as enjoying one of the big perks the Mustang has had in the fact that it has been so easy to mod and had such a huge following of being able to mod. It will feel as if their 5.0's are somehow not part of the real Mustang community or that the 5.0 becomes some sort of bastard child when the history books are closed.
Hopefully the problem will not continue to grow and IF it IS a Ford defect causing the car not to handle mods, they will be able to find the problem and fix it. Even if they choose to do so quietly. Because of the fact that there is legitimacy morally on both sides of the argument, it really makes this whole thing sad for everyone. Again regardless of whether it ends up being a Ford defect in being able to handle mods, or it ends up being a problem with the WAY the car is modded, and ends up being that instead of the engine just having a problem taking mods as a whole.
Something I wanted to add. After going through this ENTIRE thread although the issue could go widespread right now it seems like it is not HUGE.
I think that I would hold off on the tunes and mods personally until the issue was worked out BUT If my car was running fine and I had already put mods on and had been
running it for a while I think I would feel pretty comfortable.
The law is nice and all but court can get nearly as expensive as a new engine and a lot more time consuming. They can deny all they want and it would be up to you to force their hand.
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I agree with this Chris.
I know Chris Rose is a great tuner and I'm sure those of you that know his work know this too.
interesting read here.
Speed:Sport:Life » Don
btw, anyone get the name of cobras tooner yet?
I don't read what he believed to be true, but either he did not prove it, or I missed where he proved it.
I'm not sure if this shows the Mag Act does not mean aftermarket parts like we are referring to have to be proved to be the fault of the damage to the part before warranty can be voided.
He says in his write up, "this shows an OEM can deny a warranty claim or outright void the related warranty, in the event of modification or abuse of the product, damage caused by the consumer, or failure of the consumer to properly maintain the product."
I don't see where JUST modding is in this clause and proves his point. He seems to put the modification part in there. I see the damaged caused by consumer or failure of the consumer to properly maintain it... I dont see where it says modification. I also am not reading this to the meaning that he is saying it means.. I'm reading this to almost enforce the Mag act as we understand it.
Perhaps I am misinterpreting this somehow and he is right?
I am not trying to argue on this. I would just like to know IF in fact the Mag Act was somehow misunderstood by so many. I just could not find where it meant air boxes only etc. like he said.