Oil cooler for Coyote and best oil for piston jets

[twistedneck]

I'm about to purchase an oil cooler. I was reading a couple threads here where people put an oil temp gage on the 2011-12 Mustangs that have piston jets and it was way hot, like 250-260F even when water temp was in the 190 range. This is due to the pistons heating up the oil and that is a great thing to reduce detonation and add more timing but i'm surprised Ford didn't put a factory cooler in every v8 with the Jets.

I cant afford one of those $1600 thermostat type but that's OK since I run thin oil and don't drive in winter.

How about this one from Mishimoto?

http://www.americanmuscle.com/mishimoto-oil-cooler-1114gt-silver.html about $580

Or this one from MMR that's a lot cheaper not sure why. $400
PN#444832
http://www.modularmotorsportsracing.com/2011_parts.htm about half way down the page.

If you know of any others post em please.

Finally, is there a way to run an oil temp gage w/o drilling into the oil pan? maybe a washer type thermocouple probe on the oil pan drain plug?


For oil, I'm switching from Mobile 1 extended life 5w-20 and Royal Purple 10w-30 xpr to Redline 20Wt (5w-20) racing oil because that has the most zddp I can find.

 

[mattaglover]

Does the bolt on boss cooler not cut it? It is cheaper and bolts right up.

 

[mycroft]

An oil to air will be significantly better than the stock Boss oil to water cooler.

 

[Swiss Boss]

Read this :
http://bossmustangsonline.com/index.php?topic=7462.100

The Boss oil cooler does a better job than what people think it does.

 

[twistedneck]

Read this :
http://bossmustangsonline.com/index.php?topic=7462.100

The Boss oil cooler does a better job than what people think it does.

Thanks for that Swiss Boss. Glad I posted this thread.. the Mishimoto is not large enough or efficient enough. The MMR might be OK but it looks small compared to the Cooltech / Setrab setup.

http://www.cooltechllc.com/ford-boss-302-parts-accessories/25-2011-302-oil-cooler-no-thermostat.html

Cooltech uses the high performance NASCAR type Setrab heat exchanger. $1295. They don't seem to carry the thermostat version anymore, its was an extra $200. I would probably opt for that if they had it.

 

[5.0GT]

I'm thinking of the Mishimoto, and I think it has a thermo. Look at their website it opens at 180 degree

 

[Serpent]

From what i understand the boss oil cooler just reroutes the oil and eventually puts the hot oil back in.

Op, how is the mishimoto oil cooler not efficient enough? They claim to lower temps by more than 30F.
Also, will you be road course racing your car?

 

[twistedneck]

From what i understand the boss oil cooler just reroutes the oil and eventually puts the hot oil back in.

Op, how is the mishimoto oil cooler not efficient enough? They claim to lower temps by more than 30F.
Also, will you be road course racing your car?

Doing a lot of reading the Mishimoto does seem to be 'enough'.. but maybe not enough for me. The setrab cooler is more efficient and has less oil pressure drop and that's why i'm looking at it. However, it depends on funds as the cooltech is twice as expensive. I'm sure both will do the Job, but the Cooltech / Setrab will do a better Job.

I am slowly turning my GT into a weekend road course warrior so the idea is to beat on it for 20min w/o overheating the oil, yet still use a thin oil to keep the pressures in check especially with piston Jets. Given the piston Jets heat up the oil a lot more i plan to go full bore and get the Cooltech.. if i had a non piston jet motor the Mishimoto would get the nod.

 

[F.D.Sako]

Once you start tracking you definitely want to go for a thicker oil (5w50, which is what's recommeneded by Ford, I believe).

Also, from previous discussions, the boss cooler is a lot more efficient than anticipated, and it should be good enough for 20min sessions.

You could consider running the mishimoto in series with the boss cooler.

 

[Swiss Boss]

+1
Unless you go with the Setrab 948 monster(my winter project) or similar, you should run any smaller cooler in series with the boss cooler

 

[twistedneck]

Once you start tracking you definitely want to go for a thicker oil (5w50, which is what's recommeneded by Ford, I believe).

Also, from previous discussions, the boss cooler is a lot more efficient than anticipated, and it should be good enough for 20min sessions.

You could consider running the mishimoto in series with the boss cooler.

I will run a thicker oil if needed but not all the way up to 5w-50. Ford never spec'd out that thick of oil with a piston jet coyote.. all of them had the jets deleted.. track pack i.e. brembo cars in 2012 that had the jets (i have one) stayed with the 5-20 spec. i am open to a slightly thicker oil with high zddp, but i'd like some of the oil guru's like unleashed beast to chime in.

as far as the boss cooler, i need a boss radiator or a mishimoto, and for now i'm keeping my GT radiator. that's why i want a big ass cooler like the cooltech.

 

[DSG2003SVT]

I wonder why Cooltech stopped selling the one with the thermostat. Maybe you should contact them and see if that would still be an option. I'd think you'd want to have a thermostat on that type of cooler or your temps would take forever to get to operating temp.

 

[Voltwings]

I run Amsoil ATM 10w-30 in my '13, which does not have the piston jets, so i'm not sure if it will be right for you. Doing a lot of looking and reading, it appears the GT does not suffer from the same Oil temp issues as the Boss because we operate at much lower RPMS. very rarely do i go over 7k, and often times will shift a hair before that for the sake of heat, and i still have PLENTY of passing power and grunt on track. I have yet to get out to the track when it was over 90*, but my coolant temps never even get past the middle ... not sure how that correlates to oil, but it seems like the motor is staying cool.

Here is what unleashed Beast sent me when i was asking him about oil for road courses:


Use this list. You need Amsoil ATM 10W-30, assuming you are not performing 20-30 minute road course sessions.

This recommendation list will cover all seasons for your car, from the harshest winter days, to the hottest summer days. The best part is, the oil only has to be changed once a year, or 15,000 miles, whichever occur first. *RD30 must be changed every 6 months or 5,000 miles*

8 quart fill – GT
8.5 quart fill – Boss 302 and Track Pack GT

Amsoil ALM 5W-20 – If your car is 100% stock, never raced, driven like a grandma, or short trip driven, no matter the climate….use this.

Amsoil AZO 0W-30 - If your car is driven year round up north in very cold temperatures with bolt on mods, raced during the summer, and you want one oil for year round use....use this.

Amsoil ATM 10W-30 - If your car is moderate to heavily modded, used in hotter climate states, or never driven during winter months in northern states...use this. *If you always short trip the car, use Amsoil AZO or ALM instead (never get the oil up to full temperature)*

Amsoil AMO 10W-40 - If you have a Boss 302 or Track Pack GT, and you road race your car....use this.

*Boss 302 and Track Pack GT owners - If you do not road race your car, use Amsoil ATM 10W-30. 5W-50 spec for this engine is overkill and results in excessive oil pressure.*

Amsoil RD30 10W-30 - If your car is modded to the max and producing HP beyond 600 rwhp, especially E85 fuel engines...use this.

Amsoil EaO17 - This oil filter outperforms any filter on the market.

Amsoil Synchromesh - requires 3 quarts. Use this if you road race your car, or you are experiencing grinding.

If you have the Auto 6 speed, this stuff will survive the worst torture.

Amsoil LV Synthetic ATF - 12 quart total fill

and for the rear differential

Amsoil 75W-140 - requires 3 quarts

Don't forget the friction modifier

Amsoil Slip Lock - use all four ounces

*Boss 302 and Track Pack GT owners. If you have the Torsen differential in your car, do not use friction modifier.*



According to this, i should be using a 10w-40 (even though i am a Base GT), but since i only track every other month, i figure the ATM 10w-30 is still a "good enough" Oil for light track duty.

 

[Budwise]

During 20 minutes sessions I almost always see my oil temp needle get into the "red zone" after around 15 minutes and I have to start short shifting and backing down to 6-7/10ths. I upgraded to the Boss Oil Cooler and also the thick Mishimoto Radiator and still on the track I see high oil temps. My understanding is that the oil temp gauge in our cars is actually just a guess based on other measurements so at this point I've kinda stopped worrying about it. If I decide to add an air-oil cooler it'll probably be the MMR for the best performance per dollar. You dont really need a thermostat when you have the Boss cooler too since the Boss Cooler will bring the oil temp up to operating temp faster so you dont have to worry about the oil cooler making the oil take too long to heat up.

 

[twistedneck]

I wonder why Cooltech stopped selling the one with the thermostat. Maybe you should contact them and see if that would still be an option. I'd think you'd want to have a thermostat on that type of cooler or your temps would take forever to get to operating temp.

I agree totally and i live in Michigan and drive from April to end of October. I hope they have the t-stat version still.

I run Amsoil ATM 10w-30 in my '13, which does not have the piston jets, so i'm not sure if it will be right for you. Doing a lot of looking and reading, it appears the GT does not suffer from the same Oil temp issues as the Boss because we operate at much lower RPMS. very rarely do i go over 7k, and often times will shift a hair before that for the sake of heat, and i still have PLENTY of passing power and grunt on track. I have yet to get out to the track when it was over 90*, but my coolant temps never even get past the middle ... not sure how that correlates to oil, but it seems like the motor is staying cool.

Here is what unleashed Beast sent me when i was asking him about oil for road courses:


Use this list. You need Amsoil ATM 10W-30, assuming you are not performing 20-30 minute road course sessions.

This recommendation list will cover all seasons for your car, from the harshest winter days, to the hottest summer days. The best part is, the oil only has to be changed once a year, or 15,000 miles, whichever occur first. *RD30 must be changed every 6 months or 5,000 miles*

8 quart fill – GT
8.5 quart fill – Boss 302 and Track Pack GT

Amsoil ALM 5W-20 – If your car is 100% stock, never raced, driven like a grandma, or short trip driven, no matter the climate….use this.

Amsoil AZO 0W-30 - If your car is driven year round up north in very cold temperatures with bolt on mods, raced during the summer, and you want one oil for year round use....use this.

Amsoil ATM 10W-30 - If your car is moderate to heavily modded, used in hotter climate states, or never driven during winter months in northern states...use this. *If you always short trip the car, use Amsoil AZO or ALM instead (never get the oil up to full temperature)*

Amsoil AMO 10W-40 - If you have a Boss 302 or Track Pack GT, and you road race your car....use this.

*Boss 302 and Track Pack GT owners - If you do not road race your car, use Amsoil ATM 10W-30. 5W-50 spec for this engine is overkill and results in excessive oil pressure.*

Amsoil RD30 10W-30 - If your car is modded to the max and producing HP beyond 600 rwhp, especially E85 fuel engines...use this.

Amsoil EaO17 - This oil filter outperforms any filter on the market.

Amsoil Synchromesh - requires 3 quarts. Use this if you road race your car, or you are experiencing grinding.

If you have the Auto 6 speed, this stuff will survive the worst torture.

Amsoil LV Synthetic ATF - 12 quart total fill

and for the rear differential

Amsoil 75W-140 - requires 3 quarts

Don't forget the friction modifier

Amsoil Slip Lock - use all four ounces

*Boss 302 and Track Pack GT owners. If you have the Torsen differential in your car, do not use friction modifier.*



According to this, i should be using a 10w-40 (even though i am a Base GT), but since i only track every other month, i figure the ATM 10w-30 is still a "good enough" Oil for light track duty.

I also short shift my car but I've only been max 5min at a time so i don't know if would start getting too hot. I wish i could spin to 7500 every shift but that seems like needless torture on a stock GT rod / Piston, even with E85.

I plan to run the redline racing oil 5w-20.. its got a ton of zddp and it does not get super hot here in Michigan. I plan on installing an oil temp gage with the oil cooler so i can see how hot the oil gets going into the cooler. if it gets hot i'll step up to the next viscosity. I also like the Amsoil 10W30 so that's probably what i'd try next if the oil still gets hot.

Based on Budwise's comment i think the boss radiator / cooler setup is not sufficient although its a good start. The MMR is a good price but the other kits come with the hoses and bracket that makes the install easy. I wont decide between the two until i find out which one has the thermostat option available and the proper adapter for an oil temp gage.

 

[DSG2003SVT]

I'd highly recommend accurate oil temp and oil pressure gauges for any person that road races. I would definitely not want something that was just a guess based on other measurements.

 

[Voltwings]

Often times its not a true measurement, but a valve. Once "x" temperature is reached, needle moves to "Y." Once "x" temperature is exceeded temperature moves to "z." Theres no scale or axis on the dash anyways, so what Ford is calling "hot" may not indeed be critical.

 

[DSG2003SVT]

Just like the coolant temp gauges from ford. I say accurate gauges for those things are pretty crucial to road racing.

 

[twistedneck]

http://www.lethalperformance.com/ford-racing-boss-302-oil-cooler-kit.html

Setrab based oil cooler from Lethal performance looks pretty good. No t-stat and does not specify if it as a provision for the oil temp gage hook up.

 

[DSG2003SVT]

Contact Steve@Tasca if you go with that one. He can probably get that cheaper since it's an FRPP product.