More 9-11 Consiracy explained....

[MarlboroMan]

You know after Ive seen so many of these videos and people trying to convince (explain maybe) that our upper government has a hand in it somehow, it makes you think. Not because they have that influence, but because everyone should keep in mind that all our past US Presidents were far from Saints. The government is a business. Some of the most crooked people in America run our government. And because of the "crooked" things they have done, America is the way it is today. And were thankful for this. But until they kill 3000 of our own people (figuratively speaking), we never asked for answers before on how we got these freedoms or why we fight these wars. And if Bush had something to do with 9/11 because of oil, then he took it too far this time.

Im not going to say that there were controlled demolitions. Or the aircraft was empty and they were military aircraft. Or that the reason they wont give us answers or have a "legit investigation" is because they have no answers other than guilt. Even though these expert opinions make you wonder. But what amazes me, is that the American people are so gullible in believing that our government is not capable or would not do that to their own people. They are fully capable and there are many reasons to support why the American people would have a wondering as of why the Bush Administration would have a hand or EVERYTHING to do with the attacks on 9/11.

Think about that last part.

 

[.n0b.]

Im not going to say that there were controlled demolitions. Or the aircraft was empty and they were military aircraft. Or that the reason they wont give us answers or have a "legit investigation" is because they have no answers other than guilt. Even though these expert opinions make you wonder. But what amazes me, is that the American people are so gullible in believing that our government is not capable or would not do that to their own people. They are fully capable and there are many reasons to support why the American people would have a wondering as of why the Bush Administration would have a hand or EVERYTHING to do with the attacks on 9/11.

Think about that last part.

Perfectly said MarlboroMan. You know how easy this would benefit the Bush Administration? Lets go mess up Iraq without any hesitiation. all you one sided people need to open your doors and just THINK about.

i used to think, "no way our govt. could/would do this, absolutely ridiculious that these supposed "americans" can even put together conspiracy video about and how the govt. plotted the 9/11 attacks." until i watched that Loose Change one on google and how everything seems to be idk, freakishly real.

seriously, its the American Govt., whos going to question them?

 

[.n0b.]

Im not going to say that there were controlled demolitions. Or the aircraft was empty and they were military aircraft. Or that the reason they wont give us answers or have a "legit investigation" is because they have no answers other than guilt. Even though these expert opinions make you wonder. But what amazes me, is that the American people are so gullible in believing that our government is not capable or would not do that to their own people. They are fully capable and there are many reasons to support why the American people would have a wondering as of why the Bush Administration would have a hand or EVERYTHING to do with the attacks on 9/11.

Think about that last part.

Perfectly said MarboloMan. You know how easy this would benefit the Bush Administration? Lets go mess up Iraq without any hesitiation. all you one sided people need to open your doors and just THINK about.

i used to think, "no way our govt. could/would do this, absolutely ridiculious that these supposed "americans" can even put together conspiracy video about and how the govt. plotted the 9/11 attacks." until i watched that Loose Change one on google and how all everything seems to be idk, pretty freakishly real.

seriously, its the American Govt., whos going to question them? we will never question them nor will we get answers for all these questions. we will never know the truth.

 

[notfastenuf]

You guys make my days in intel worth living. I love passing this stuff around the office.

 

[broke7]

WTC 7 collapsed due to small fires and debris hitting it.....if that isnt a controlled demo im not sure wtf is, how the hell do you setup a demolition in the middle of a major metropolis directly after one of the largest mishaps in the world has just occured..... unless it was already planning to be demo'd......

WTC 7 videos
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5848378758602000405&q=WTC+7+collapse&hl=en

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5269602441702932631&q=WTC+7+collapse&hl=en

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8403741864603265979&q=WTC+7+collapse&hl=en

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9184329400593634920&q=WTC+7+collapse&hl=en

Hell im even in the military and im not to proud to admit facts and science do add up, im entitled to my opinions, and call me whatever you want..I could careless. The official story dont look to trusty anymore,

 

[MarlboroMan]

Perfectly said MarboloMan. You know how easy this would benefit the Bush Administration? Lets go mess up Iraq without any hesitiation. all you one sided people need to open your doors and just THINK about.

i used to think, "no way our govt. could/would do this, absolutely ridiculious that these supposed "americans" can even put together conspiracy video about and how the govt. plotted the 9/11 attacks." until i watched that Loose Change one on google and how all everything seems to be idk, pretty freakishly real.

seriously, its the American Govt., whos going to question them? we will never question them nor will we get answers for all these questions. we will never know the truth.

Right. Like I said........IT AMAZES ME THAT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ARE SO GULLIBLE IN BELIEVING THAT OUR GOVERNMENT WOULD NOT CONDUCT TREASONOUS ACTS ON THEIR OWN PEOPLE.

People say dont be judgemental. But sometimes judging someone on his previous actions can give you an insight on the future. Like I said before too, NONE of our previous Presidents are Saints. What makes them any different from other countries leaders? What? Because we are the USA and we have come this far?

People also question the fact as of why we are fighting the war in Iraq. At almost a 100 years, we have used over 40% of the oil nature has provided this planet. Where is the remainder of that oil left? Right where our US military is fighting right now. Put this little piece of the puzzle with the rest and THEN tell me that the American people are insane for justifying these "conspiracies".

Again, I am not by any means saying that I believe any of these supposed conspiracies are true, but I am not close-minded either. When I think of close-minded people (the ones who think the 9/11 deniers are lunatics) I think of the same kind of people who believe that their spouse would never commit adultery. These people are too afraid to imagine the unimaginable.

 

[YesterdayAgain]

Another conspiracy f**ktard thread? Sweet, these act as a monthly roll call of all the morons in the site.

 

[notfastenuf]

Alright, this is going to be my last post in this thread, cause honestly no one is going to change their mind from a thread on a Mustang board.

Has anyone thought of the logistics that would go into an operation (conspiracy) like this? Lest we forget that the US gov't would need to kill 3,000 of it's own innocent citizens. Let's talk demo - okay, how did these explosive charges get into the building? Did they just walk them through the front door? "Excuse me, don't mind me while I take this backpack of C4 or semtex up to level 88." Or maybe they were teleported in. Or possibly, you know how in The Recruit; that woman snuck out that flash drive in the bottom of her coffee mug?... maybe they suck explosives in that way.... Hmmmm... And lastly with demo would be the bribing those individuals that set it up - maybe they were dressed in electricians outfits and carried it in lunchboxes or hardhats. I'm referring movies because that seems to be all you people can relate to. Rationalize that for a sec - first, you would need someone trained enough to install the explosives while staying covert. That means military or some kind of black ops group. So you're saying that a Spec Ops type person (possibly a demo contractor) is going to agree to killing 3,000 Americans (which it could have been tons more dead) for what?... money? Get real.

Second, Agencies... do you have any idea how many intelligence and investigative professionals there are? Granted, there are substanitally more now, after 9/11 - that's obvious. They were hired and created in order to kill / capture / prevent future terrorist attacks (simplistically put). So what did we do conspire with AQ to fly the planes? If that's true and we continue to kill them in the mid-east why isn't AQ / Taliban talking about how G.W. has stabbed them and America in the back? What their OPSEC is just that good? Let me guess, these Americans were killed to create more federal jobs? lol.

Thirdly, legacy. You really think G.W., a prior service member and son of a previous US President is going to betray America in this way? You may dislike his politics, religious views, and the way he speaks, but think about it. That's just retarded - I can't think of any President thinking of that.

Lastly, Reasons. Okay, I'll be the first to admit - I hate politics, red tape, and beuarcracy as much as the next tax payer. Can't stand it. You have to admit that we all stay safe and happy because of the operators, the cops, the investigators, the Port Authority, the ground pounders - the trigger pullers. Besides, the ever popular answer of "Oil" (which we don't have)... what are the reasons behind these dillusions? You guys do realize that Saudi has most of the oil right? Why didn't we attack them?

I'm not a structural engineer and I'm pretty certain y'all aren't either and thus I'm not going to comment on that - but as far as I can remember I don't recall ever seeing footage or hearing about an airliner ramming into a one of a kind building and the way it should fall in the past. Do you?

Bottom line - conspierers have no hard evidence, period. And, anything that is considered media can be manipulated, we all know this. "Researchers who advocate the conspiratorial view claim that most major events in history have been dominated by conspirators who manipulate political happenings from behind the scenes." Basically, with all the pieces and people needed for this kind of operation it would be impossible to keep it under wraps.

 

[UCBeau]

Alright, this is going to be my last post in this thread, cause honestly no one is going to change their mind from a thread on a Mustang board.

Has anyone thought of the logistics that would go into an operation (conspiracy) like this? Lest we forget that the US gov't would need to kill 3,000 of it's own innocent citizens. Let's talk demo - okay, how did these explosive charges get into the building? Did they just walk them through the front door? "Excuse me, don't mind me while I take this backpack of C4 or semtex up to level 88." Or maybe they were teleported in. Or possibly, you know how in The Recruit; that woman snuck out that flash drive in the bottom of her coffee mug?... maybe they suck explosives in that way.... Hmmmm... And lastly with demo would be the bribing those individuals that set it up - maybe they were dressed in electricians outfits and carried it in lunchboxes or hardhats. I'm referring movies because that seems to be all you people can relate to. Rationalize that for a sec - first, you would need someone trained enough to install the explosives while staying covert. That means military or some kind of black ops group. So you're saying that a Spec Ops type person (possibly a demo contractor) is going to agree to killing 3,000 Americans (which it could have been tons more dead) for what?... money? Get real.

Second, Agencies... do you have any idea how many intelligence and investigative professionals there are? Granted, there are substanitally more now, after 9/11 - that's obvious. They were hired and created in order to kill / capture / prevent future terrorist attacks (simplistically put). So what did we do conspire with AQ to fly the planes? If that's true and we continue to kill them in the mid-east why isn't AQ / Taliban talking about how G.W. has stabbed them and America in the back? What their OPSEC is just that good? Let me guess, these Americans were killed to create more federal jobs? lol.

Thirdly, legacy. You really think G.W., a prior service member and son of a previous US President is going to betray America in this way? You may dislike his politics, religious views, and the way he speaks, but think about it. That's just retarded - I can't think of any President thinking of that.

Lastly, Reasons. Okay, I'll be the first to admit - I hate politics, red tape, and beuarcracy as much as the next tax payer. Can't stand it. You have to admit that we all stay safe and happy because of the operators, the cops, the investigators, the Port Authority, the ground pounders - the trigger pullers. Besides, the ever popular answer of "Oil" (which we don't have)... what are the reasons behind these dillusions? You guys do realize that Saudi has most of the oil right? Why didn't we attack them?

I'm not a structural engineer and I'm pretty certain y'all aren't either and thus I'm not going to comment on that - but as far as I can remember I don't recall ever seeing footage or hearing about an airliner ramming into a one of a kind building and the way it should fall in the past. Do you?

Bottom line - conspierers have no hard evidence, period. And, anything that is considered media can be manipulated, we all know this. "Researchers who advocate the conspiratorial view claim that most major events in history have been dominated by conspirators who manipulate political happenings from behind the scenes." Basically, with all the pieces and people needed for this kind of operation it would be impossible to keep it under wraps.

:beer: Well said. Conspiracy theorists cannot accept the reality that due to lax immigration policies and interagency rivalries, terrorists were able to infiltrate the country, receive flight training, hijack jets, and fly them into buildings. Hell, before 9/11, I was able to board planes with a Swiss Army Knife! The terrorists used boxcutters, which have an even smaller blade. After the jets (fully loaded with fuel) hit their respective targets, the hot fires WEAKENED the structural supports of these buildings, causing them to collapse. In the case of the Pentagon, simply looking at the photographic evidence proves a 757 did hit the building and punched a hole in it. Alas, the PCT's simply won't accept those photos and instead expect us rational individuals to accept "the truth" as told by THEIR photos, which truly don't show anything at all. They are the ones being manipulated, being spoon fed whatever they want to hear, being told that they are somehow smarter than the rest of us (much to the delight of their egos).
It's sad to see the American public so fractured by this, and it's sad to see folks let themselves drift into fantasy land where everything is a conspiracy.

 

[broke7]

:beer: Well said. Conspiracy theorists cannot accept the reality that due to lax immigration policies and interagency rivalries, terrorists were able to infiltrate the country, receive flight training, hijack jets, and fly them into buildings. Hell, before 9/11, I was able to board planes with a Swiss Army Knife! The terrorists used boxcutters, which have an even smaller blade. After the jets (fully loaded with fuel) hit their respective targets, the hot fires WEAKENED the structural supports of these buildings, causing them to collapse. In the case of the Pentagon, simply looking at the photographic evidence proves a 757 did hit the building and punched a hole in it. Alas, the PCT's simply won't accept those photos and instead expect us rational individuals to accept "the truth" as told by THEIR photos, which truly don't show anything at all. They are the ones being manipulated, being spoon fed whatever they want to hear, being told that they are somehow smarter than the rest of us (much to the delight of their egos).
It's sad to see the American public so fractured by this, and it's sad to see folks let themselves drift into fantasy land where everything is a conspiracy.

nice

what photographic evidence you talking about?? post it up.... Ive researched the topic pretty heavily, and havent found anything that resembles and aircaft or wreckage. I guess aircraft incinerate themselves when they only crash into government buildings these days.

I keep an open mind about anything......Im around aviation enough to know what happens when planes crash into the ground, let alone buildings.

 

[zerocool]

And this changes my mind how?? It just makes me laugh. Conspiracy theorist are here for one reason and one reason only, to make me laugh.

 

[zerocool]

hahah, you crack me up


what photographic evidence you talking about?? man up and post it.... Ive researched the topic pretty heavily, and havent found anything that resembles and aircaft or wreckage. I guess aircraft incinerate themselves when they only crash into government buildings these days.

First of all, you happen to be a great driver, now back on topic.

Did you ever view the film that the two french brothers made over 9/11? They literally filmed a jet engine lying on the street a block away from the WTC. Now honestly, I wanna hear you say it, do you actually believe the French were in it too?? From their actions since we started the war, I would highly doubt it.

 

[broke7]

First of all, you happen to be a great driver, now back on topic.

Did you ever view the film that the two french brothers made over 9/11? They literally filmed a jet engine lying on the street a block away from the WTC. Now honestly, I wanna hear you say it, do you actually believe the French were in it too?? From their actions since we started the war, I would highly doubt it.

No I havent seen the video?? Not denying what hit the WTC's, it was plain and simple what hit it, I have always just found it odd from even the day I watched it on TV that things happened the way they did, so I have always kept an open mind over it.

I could careless about the french, dont want to comment on the subject. Im not sure what your referring to. I think there is things that go on this country that are left unmentioned and unturned, and sometimes un-noticed, all for reasons not phathomed by most people, this may or may not be one of them.

 

[notfastenuf]

First of all, you happen to be a great driver, now back on topic.

Did you ever view the film that the two french brothers made over 9/11? They literally filmed a jet engine lying on the street a block away from the WTC. Now honestly, I wanna hear you say it, do you actually believe the French were in it too?? From their actions since we started the war, I would highly doubt it.

I have that dvd - best one made on 9/11. Live vid of the incident - only thing that can beat that is being there.

 

[UCBeau]

nice

what photographic evidence you talking about?? post it up.... Ive researched the topic pretty heavily, and havent found anything that resembles and aircaft or wreckage. I guess aircraft incinerate themselves when they only crash into government buildings these days.

I keep an open mind about anything......Im around aviation enough to know what happens when planes crash into the ground, let alone buildings.

Dude seriously, the pics are out there all over the place. There are even a ton of them on this forum. There are pics from the Pentagon clearly showing 757 landing gear, P&W turbines, fueslage pieces, seat pieces..There are also pieces of debris at the WTC however, due to the fact that the buildings collapsed, it's harder to get any pics from there. If you are actually doubting things, I am very suspect about how much you are around aviation, especially commercial aviation.

Then again, a member of my family witnessed the 757 hit the Pentagon. He happens to be a former crash investigator, airline pilot, and Navy pilot. His word suffices for me.

 

[broke7]

Dude seriously, the pics are out there all over the place. There are even a ton of them on this forum. There are pics from the Pentagon clearly showing 757 landing gear, P&W turbines, fueslage pieces, seat pieces..There are also pieces of debris at the WTC however, due to the fact that the buildings collapsed, it's harder to get any pics from there. If you are actually doubting things, I am very suspect about how much you are around aviation, especially commercial aviation.

Then again, a member of my family witnessed the 757 hit the Pentagon. He happens to be a former crash investigator, airline pilot, and Navy pilot. His word suffices for me.

well I havent seen them, I guess I will refine my search results some more. I said I was in the military, you are correct I dont work on commerical aircaft.

Not denying that planes hit the WTC at all, I would just expect there to be ALOT more wreckage when something like this happens especially the pentagon, thats all WTC is totally explainable. I would like to ask an experienced pilot if they thinks it possible to fly a 757 in a controlled flight at that angle of attack and speed into a fixed object at a controlled speed at about 5ft off the ground. You would be hard pressed to do it in a military style aircaft with (TFR) terrain following radar at those speeds without overloading the airframe severely ort crashing prematurely.


People died, we are at war, soldiers are dieing, ( could be me) I will STFU and color now. Thanks for the insight........////

 

[MarlboroMan]

Alright, this is going to be my last post in this thread, cause honestly no one is going to change their mind from a thread on a Mustang board.

Has anyone thought of the logistics that would go into an operation (conspiracy) like this? Lest we forget that the US gov't would need to kill 3,000 of it's own innocent citizens. Let's talk demo - okay, how did these explosive charges get into the building? Did they just walk them through the front door? "Excuse me, don't mind me while I take this backpack of C4 or semtex up to level 88." Or maybe they were teleported in. Or possibly, you know how in The Recruit; that woman snuck out that flash drive in the bottom of her coffee mug?... maybe they suck explosives in that way.... Hmmmm... And lastly with demo would be the bribing those individuals that set it up - maybe they were dressed in electricians outfits and carried it in lunchboxes or hardhats. I'm referring movies because that seems to be all you people can relate to. Rationalize that for a sec - first, you would need someone trained enough to install the explosives while staying covert. That means military or some kind of black ops group. So you're saying that a Spec Ops type person (possibly a demo contractor) is going to agree to killing 3,000 Americans (which it could have been tons more dead) for what?... money? Get real.

Second, Agencies... do you have any idea how many intelligence and investigative professionals there are? Granted, there are substanitally more now, after 9/11 - that's obvious. They were hired and created in order to kill / capture / prevent future terrorist attacks (simplistically put). So what did we do conspire with AQ to fly the planes? If that's true and we continue to kill them in the mid-east why isn't AQ / Taliban talking about how G.W. has stabbed them and America in the back? What their OPSEC is just that good? Let me guess, these Americans were killed to create more federal jobs? lol.

Thirdly, legacy. You really think G.W., a prior service member and son of a previous US President is going to betray America in this way? You may dislike his politics, religious views, and the way he speaks, but think about it. That's just retarded - I can't think of any President thinking of that.

Lastly, Reasons. Okay, I'll be the first to admit - I hate politics, red tape, and beuarcracy as much as the next tax payer. Can't stand it. You have to admit that we all stay safe and happy because of the operators, the cops, the investigators, the Port Authority, the ground pounders - the trigger pullers. Besides, the ever popular answer of "Oil" (which we don't have)... what are the reasons behind these dillusions? You guys do realize that Saudi has most of the oil right? Why didn't we attack them?

I'm not a structural engineer and I'm pretty certain y'all aren't either and thus I'm not going to comment on that - but as far as I can remember I don't recall ever seeing footage or hearing about an airliner ramming into a one of a kind building and the way it should fall in the past. Do you?

Bottom line - conspierers have no hard evidence, period. And, anything that is considered media can be manipulated, we all know this. "Researchers who advocate the conspiratorial view claim that most major events in history have been dominated by conspirators who manipulate political happenings from behind the scenes." Basically, with all the pieces and people needed for this kind of operation it would be impossible to keep it under wraps.

I could reply to everything you just said because it is apparent you havent done enough research or even watched the little bit of news there was on the "conspiracy theorists", but I dont want to drag this out anymore than you do. Even though I was trying to grasp the concept of what you are saying I finally got it. Not to undermine you by saying your vocabulary and specific point making is on a 8th grade level.

With that being said, if your post is in response to my posts, you would have known that I am neutral to this or better yet, I lean on the favortism side of it not involving our government. I agree totally that this sounds absurd, but I am also not close-minded. Keep in mind, that you are in the lower percentile of Americans, 5 yrs later worth of research and investigations on 9/11, that believe OUR GOVERNMENT WAS NOT INVOLVED OR WAS NOT AWARE. And that is a fact.

By looks of your signature you are(were) Army.......thats all Im going to say about that. Im serving too by the way.


Im going to post these videos and websites. Now I know you probably wont look at them. Some you may already have seen. But I encourage you to at least view the Loose Change video. One of the most well put together videos out there. The makers were interviewed by CNN, FOXNEWS, etc. and changed the views of Americans who were in doubt of the Bush Administration being involved in 9/11. They are very interesting. There is also many other interesting videos out there and books by well respected authors. These are the same men who experienced more generations of US government before you were even born. So their point of views are more understanding than kids who live in denial. Their opinion has no influence. They couldnt tell the difference in a democrat and a republican. I encourage you to look at these. IF you do, I am not asking you to become a crazy psychotic 9/11 denier. Just come back and tell me that it isnt possible. Disregard all the evidence in the videos that could be tampered with, i.e. pictures, voices without videos etc. Just be realistic and open-minded when you view them. Then feel free to watch some of the very few sites out there that try and "debunk" these myths, as they call it, but fail to provide any factual evidence in their rebuttals. Also pay particular attention to the majority who call bullshit on these 9/11 deniers evidence. Their from Canada and other countries. :lol: Not to mention, IP addresses were recorded on some of the 9/11 denier websites from our upper government. Wonder why they are so curious what were talking about?


(Ill admit some of the stuff in here maybe be a little stretched out, but you cant hide from facts. And ALOT of this is factual information we knew before 9/11. Maybe 20% of the video cant be proven. But that 80% is more than enough for Americans to arise with questions and investigations the government wont allow.)

Again Im not asking you to believe. Think possibilities.

LOOSE CHANGE
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7866929448192753501&q=Loose+Change&hl=en

Link to random videos.

EDIT-Unfortunately the other site is down. Just one of the more popular. Do some searches.


I also wanted to emphasize this a little bit. This is pretty relative. And is the epitome of the ones who have the "NO WAY THEY WOULD DO SUCH A THING" attitude.

When I think of close-minded people (the ones who think the 9/11 deniers are lunatics) I think of the same kind of people who believe that their spouse would never commit adultery. These people are too afraid to imagine the unimaginable.

I believe we have a few of these individuals in this thread. How sad.

 

[92lxhatchback]

http://911research.wtc7.net/pentagon/evidence/photos/yardparts.html
http://911research.wtc7.net/pentagon/evidence/photos/parts.html

those are the first 2 crappy links i found, searching google. There are better pictures out there.

I know what happened on 9/11. some of you conspiracy fools might not be ready for this but here i go.

Islamic fundamentalist attacked us. A son of a wealthy Saudi family who has nothing better to do than to sit around and plan the demise of me and you, successfully completed an attack on U.S. soil. He had been attacking us for years, and big surprise he finally did so on our soil. He wrote up a "formal" document that declared war on us back in 97. and we all ignored it.
Our government did not have anything to do with the attacks on 9/11. At least not in the manner you all think they did.
What our government is guilty of, is failing to protect us. failing to see all the warning signs, and over looking evidence. failing to do what we pay them to do. The only "conspiracy" (if u want to call it that) is the goverment trying to cover its ass because they all knew, the moment that first plane hit, that they dropped the ball. Anyone who thinks the planes were empty, or there were not planes, or that the buildings were brought down demolishin style is a complete tool. That loose change video is rather ridiculous. I'm sure someone could fabricate a video saying a UFO flew into the pentagon, and people would believe it.

 

[notfastenuf]

Not to undermine you by saying your vocabulary and specific point making is on a 8th grade level.

It was obviously needed for the crowd. By the way, your grammar in that sentence was incorrect. Good try though. In case you hadn't noticed, this is a message forum, not a thesis.

Keep in mind, that you are in the lower percentile of Americans, 5 yrs later worth of research and investigations on 9/11, that believe OUR GOVERNMENT WAS NOT INVOLVED OR WAS NOT AWARE. And that is a fact..

Maybe that 5 percent does what I do. Works in Counter-Terrorism, holds a TS clearance, and has a Masters. I bet the percentage is much lower in that arena and the 5% for believers is much higher.

 

[notfastenuf]

The only "conspiracy" (if u want to call it that) is the goverment trying to cover its ass because they all knew, the moment that first plane hit, that they dropped the ball. Anyone who thinks the planes were empty, or there were not planes, or that the buildings were brought down demolishin style is a complete tool.

Ding.