Blew My Engine

[cjd223]

Not exactly certain what caused it. Sounds like a broken rod. Probably too much HP on a stock engine. Trying to decide between an Aluminator short block or '15-'16 stock block. 700-725whp is enough for me. Ford Racing says the new stock engine has basically Boss rods and pistons. I can get an Aluminator SB for $3,500 ish. Not sure what the price is for the stock '15 SB.

 

[corepwn]

Not exactly certain what caused it. Sounds like a broken rod. Probably too much HP on a stock engine. Trying to decide between an Aluminator short block or '15-'16 stock block. 700-725whp is enough for me. Ford Racing says the new stock engine has basically Boss rods and pistons. I can get an Aluminator SB for $3,500 ish. Not sure what the price is for the stock '15 SB.

An Aluminator short block is more stout than the '15+ short block, but unless it's used I don't think you can order them anymore.

Do you really think you'll be satisfied with 700-725rwhp after you dump a bunch of money into it for a forged re-build? Horse power is addicting and you'll push it harder in time, I guarantee it.

If you can get an Aluminator SB for that price, I'd go for it.

 

[imeyers302]

Not exactly certain what caused it. Sounds like a broken rod. Probably too much HP on a stock engine. Trying to decide between an Aluminator short block or '15-'16 stock block. 700-725whp is enough for me. Ford Racing says the new stock engine has basically Boss rods and pistons. I can get an Aluminator SB for $3,500 ish. Not sure what the price is for the stock '15 SB.

You were at 700+ when it blew?

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

Not exactly certain what caused it. Sounds like a broken rod. Probably too much HP on a stock engine. Trying to decide between an Aluminator short block or '15-'16 stock block. 700-725whp is enough for me. Ford Racing says the new stock engine has basically Boss rods and pistons. I can get an Aluminator SB for $3,500 ish. Not sure what the price is for the stock '15 SB.

We actually have a low compression Pro Series build sitting on an engine stand just waiting to be adopted!

POWERSTORM FORD 5.0L PRO SERIES SHORTBLOCK 10:1 COMPRESSION

Our Powerstorm Pro Series Coyote engine features many upgrades allowing it to handle up to 1,000 HP. Built around Ford's new generation 5.0 aluminum block that is put through all of Livernois Motorsports Pro Series Engine procedures like deck plate honing, align boring, modified oil passages, etc....

 

[Vert]

We actually have a low compression Pro Series build sitting on an engine stand just waiting to be adopted!

POWERSTORM FORD 5.0L PRO SERIES SHORTBLOCK 10:1 COMPRESSION

Our Powerstorm Pro Series Coyote engine features many upgrades allowing it to handle up to 1,000 HP. Built around Ford's new generation 5.0 aluminum block that is put through all of Livernois Motorsports Pro Series Engine procedures like deck plate honing, align boring, modified oil passages, etc....

How much are the adoption fees, lol.

 

[11gtcs]

How much are the adoption fees, lol.

Looks like $5500 according to the link provided.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

I will waive the background check needed for adoption lol.

 

[Badlilstang]

I will waive the background check needed for adoption lol.

Dang... got a foster care program? lol

 

[cjd223]

You were at 700+ when it blew?

Somewhere around that number. Got a price from a friend at the local Ford store of $1,965.00 for a 15-16 short block. OTOH seems like I read somewhere you had to change something in the cam drive system to make the 15-16 SB compatible with the 11-14 heads. Could be wrong on that though.

 

[92fiveohfox]

Stock opg? What pulley? I'm pretty sure you have to use 11-14 cams for it to work right.

 

[c_me_pass_u]

So a 15-16 sb works with a 11-14? What about the entire motor?

 

[Weather Man]

With all machining and assembly, that Livernois sb is a nice piece. Very friendly boost compression ratio also.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

:thumbsup:

 

[cjd223]

Stock opg? What pulley? I'm pretty sure you have to use 11-14 cams for it to work right.

82mm pulley. Nothing wrong with the stock OPGs. Just stay off the rev limiter. My car is a '12.

 

[cjd223]

So a 15-16 sb works with a 11-14? What about the entire motor?

I am hoping my heads are not damaged. If not then no need for a complete motor.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

82mm pulley. Nothing wrong with the stock OPGs. Just stay off the rev limiter. My car is a '12.

Why Do the Oil Pump Gears Fail?

Every mechanical device is destined to fail with any amount of use; the time to failure though depends on the rate of usage or abuse. One mechanical device that tends to fail on the Ford Mod Motor is the oil pump gear. Granted, the stock gear is perfectly adequate for normal engine operation; the issue is only common when dealing with hi-performance engines. The question we receive time and time again: “Why do the oil pump gears fail?”

How the Oil Pump Gear Works

Oil pump gear operationThe oil pump used on the Ford Mod Motor is a gerotor design with an outer and inner gear setup. When the gears rotate, the intake side separates creating a void between the gears, which creates a vacuum that sucks in the oil. The oil is then moved to the discharge side through the gear motion. On the discharge side, the gears come back together squeezing the oil out. Tight tolerances and rigid design allow it to pump high viscosity liquids (e.g. Oil) at high pressures. In the Mod Motor the oil pump is driven directly by the crankshaft rotation and therefore, subject to the force oscillations of the engine.

The Forces on the Oil Pump Gears

Force

Neither power nor RPM is the culprit as neither equates to the actual forces within the engine while under operation. Force alone only explains part of the issue because torque (force with leverage) aggravates the conditions as the engine torque output increases.

The first component to examine is the engine crankshaft. On the Mod Motor the crankshaft has 4 phases per revolution with peak pulses of force every 90 degrees of crank rotation. Visually this is comparable to the human heart beat with every peak being a pulse (thump, thump, thump, thump). The blower, depending on the model it may have 5 pulses per revolution of peak force. Finally, the oil pump itself has 8 pulses per revolution of peak force. All of these are normally out of phase, but it is possible for them come into phase or close enough to increase the vector components of acceleration and velocity.

Acceleration has a time component and the above pulses are of very short duration (rapid acceleration and declaration). There is also distance (the clearance between gears/crank in this case, which seems small but things are relative) to calculate which, gives velocity and its derivative acceleration. The rapid change in acceleration can be defined as jerk or lurch:

Oil pump gear failures explained

Jerk is an extremely important component in precision mechanical operations, such as the operation of a combustion engine. Ford engineers would have spent considerable time working on reducing the jerk from normal operation (predictable behavior).

Abnormal Operation and Unpredictable Behavior

On a stock engine, under normal operation, the crankshaft has predictable angular forces and thus torque. Adding abnormal operation (i.e. bigger blower, pedaling the car, on-off traction, 2 step, bouncing off the rev limiter, hole-shots, flat shifting etc.) causes excessive jerk (quick acceleration changes during the pulses) allowing forces to exceed the limitations of the engine components. In the case of the Mod Motor, timing components break, oil pump gears fracture, crank snouts break/crack, crank keys fail, etc.; anything with a mass and angular velocity can be compromised.

Ford engineers designed the oil pump gears to survive under normal operation for as long as possible. They did not design the gears for hi-performance or race engine applications. A stock set of Mod Motor oil pump gears are manufactured from powdered metal, which is quite strong by itself, but it is also very brittle and unable to sustain impacts (instantaneous changes in force).

The solution is to use gears that are constructed from a material that is not as brittle (softer) such as 10xx steel or 4340 steel. These materials are more expensive to manufacture and requires very accurate machining and surface grinding (100 millionths) versus simply pouring powder into a mold. In normal use the Ford gear will last forever as it wears well versus 4340 gears which wear much faster when left unhardened.

The Bottom Line

This market is not standard operation; today’s hi-performance applications are pushing the limits of engines more and more. Ford engineers have taken the time to account for what happens during normal operation, but they have no control over owner operation or the conditions created by modifications.

 

[cjd223]

With all machining and assembly, that Livernois sb is a nice piece. Very friendly boost compression ratio also.

Yes, it is a nice unit. A little out of my budget. I have just started to recover from the beating my wife gave me Sunday for blowing the engine.

 

[466roller]

My car broke a rod a while back. I ended up putting a '15 long block together with 11-14 cam drive set up. There are plenty of '15 and up cars well into the 700's some into the 800+. My cars my daily so I needed to get it back on the road ASAP.

 

[Riptide]

Have you had the compressor off yet? If you're real lucky there is no damage to the supercharger and the heads. I've heard of people losing pretty much everything though. Knock on wood you aren't one of the poor unfortunate souls.

 

[SHIFTYBUSINESS]

Have you had the compressor off yet? If you're real lucky there is no damage to the supercharger and the heads. I've heard of people losing pretty much everything though. Knock on wood you aren't one of the poor unfortunate souls.

You're talking about pieces of broken rod/piston material coming up through the heads into the supercharger? My tvs coyote spun a bearing and the small pieces ran through the oil and ruined the cam towers and the cams, I assumed my blower was alright.

Sorry about your engine OP I know how it feels.