I think it has everything to do with it, it's things like that which help create a false sense of confidence. A little fear (call it respect if you want) at the track is a good thing, helps you go home with the same ride you brought there.
Anyone else frustrated with Ford over the next GT500?
- Thread starter biminiLX
- Start date
I don't see how you can have a false sense of confidence if you're literally spending the day almost causing wrecks and flying off the track.
You've never seen the guy in the porsche over driving like a dick because the miata is trying to pass him? We're getting off track here though, so we can just agree to disagree. I dont think DCTs are bad, but i do think they're part of a problem (being too many driver aids and nannies).
You've never seen the guy in a (insert cheap basic car here) driving like a dick trying to pass someone in a (insert expensive complex car here) trying to get that expensive car scalp?
I've seen plenty of people drive like idiots in every car configuration possible. People not watching their mirrors and failing to give a point by definitely has nothing to do with the type of car. I have been stuck behind a great many manual-transmission moving chicanes.
Can’t wait. Hope you get that 3rd allocation! Lol. I have a feeling this car is gonna be nuts.
I like the way you put it
At DBK, you just started assuming I’m dry drifting cars and slamming the sides of other people’s cars and spinning off track at some novice hpde thing. Ok I’m done. Sure you must be right.
No. I’m not. I’m driving street cars on street tires around closed circuit at private track day rentals, and at drift events as well as lots of canyon and B road time. I never said I’m Randy Phobst at Leguna Seca or any production car lap record holder for that matter.
And if you are honest with yourself you know that a street tire has to be exploited for fast laps. Not need for speed drifted, but exploited. Not every corner, but low speed corners, and on camber banked radius’ love a pitched start to get rotating. Call it a Scandinavian flick if you prefer top gear.
A race tire on a sticky car without suspension travel as in a ford GT, or even a gt350r isn’t gonna do much of what I was describing. It turns in pretty well on it’s own. I haven’t driven either of those but anyone who’s been on track could obviously get this.
I’m not talking about race cars with track tires. I’m talking about street cars with street tires.
Think STI’s, EVO’s and maybe base corvettes. I have piloted those on street tires as well as my 800-1200whp 03 cobra and my 275whp daily driver regal in closed performance events, drift, autos, and loads of canyon/ B road runs.
No I’m not trying he John Force of track days. Good god.
Facts though, you can’t get an STI or any front wheel drive car around a track quick on street tires without exploiting the tires.
Most factory rwd coupes and sporty cars like mustangs and Camaros asking like a little exploiting.
Having watched enough in car vids of hot laps at leguna and the Nurburgring, the best lap times and drivers exploit the tires on every street car they drive. Randy routinely flexes the tires at the cork screw and the final turn of leguna, and even sometimes on turn 1’s exit and turn 5, and just watch the test driver in the canary zl1 1le nurburgring run, he exploits 4 wheel drifts on a cup tire on damn near 15-20% of the track.
That said I don’t claim to be as good or close to that good, I just said I have more fun trying to drive like that than I do driving like a novice at a first timers hpde event. And manuals give me a lot more confidence personally to exploit a cars and tires balance.
No. I’m not. I’m driving street cars on street tires around closed circuit at private track day rentals, and at drift events as well as lots of canyon and B road time. I never said I’m Randy Phobst at Leguna Seca or any production car lap record holder for that matter.
And if you are honest with yourself you know that a street tire has to be exploited for fast laps. Not need for speed drifted, but exploited. Not every corner, but low speed corners, and on camber banked radius’ love a pitched start to get rotating. Call it a Scandinavian flick if you prefer top gear.
A race tire on a sticky car without suspension travel as in a ford GT, or even a gt350r isn’t gonna do much of what I was describing. It turns in pretty well on it’s own. I haven’t driven either of those but anyone who’s been on track could obviously get this.
I’m not talking about race cars with track tires. I’m talking about street cars with street tires.
Think STI’s, EVO’s and maybe base corvettes. I have piloted those on street tires as well as my 800-1200whp 03 cobra and my 275whp daily driver regal in closed performance events, drift, autos, and loads of canyon/ B road runs.
No I’m not trying he John Force of track days. Good god.
Facts though, you can’t get an STI or any front wheel drive car around a track quick on street tires without exploiting the tires.
Most factory rwd coupes and sporty cars like mustangs and Camaros asking like a little exploiting.
Having watched enough in car vids of hot laps at leguna and the Nurburgring, the best lap times and drivers exploit the tires on every street car they drive. Randy routinely flexes the tires at the cork screw and the final turn of leguna, and even sometimes on turn 1’s exit and turn 5, and just watch the test driver in the canary zl1 1le nurburgring run, he exploits 4 wheel drifts on a cup tire on damn near 15-20% of the track.
That said I don’t claim to be as good or close to that good, I just said I have more fun trying to drive like that than I do driving like a novice at a first timers hpde event. And manuals give me a lot more confidence personally to exploit a cars and tires balance.
You are doing me a serious confuse here brosef. Whew.
I think that's an M4 owner thing. My last HPDE of 2017, I watched a guy in a M4 run right off the track from the main straight. It's like he was checking his email at 150 mph and didn't notice the track went right.
I have only been on road course for 1.5 seasons with a total of 12 track days. I ran the advanced group on my last day of 2017 and realized a race was happening, and I wasn't in it. LOL So, I'm sticking with the entry level guys just above the in-car instructor group.
I think that there is a very tiny percentage of owners who ever track their cars and most of them fit into this category. I just want to run laps and enjoy the car somewhere I won't end up in jail.
Yea, but damn does it make the straights fun. At my local track, my GT350 only gets to high 130's on the straight but the Hellcat does high 160's.... like 168-169. You're not doing that with a stock or nearly stock car at the drag strip. So, there is some benefit to bringing a big HP car to the road course.
Don't tease. The suspense is hard enough. LOL
Dude... me, everyday, in my Wrangler on the way to work. I flat foot that mo-fo more often than any other vehicle I own. But the zero to 60 is like 10 or 11 seconds. I need to. LOL
I think you're confusing "drifting," or whatever you keep calling exploiting with slip angle... Two very different things.
As I follow this thread about the wait killing everyone, all I can think of is some retirement community in Florida where everyone is having a debate whether to go for dinner at 6 or go at 430 for the early bird special.
(Obscure Seinfeld reference)
“We’ll wait, but It’s unheard of”
(Obscure Seinfeld reference)
“We’ll wait, but It’s unheard of”
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I think the obvious 800lbs elephant in the room is Jerry Seinfeld. You’re killing me Jerry. Killing me.
That said, wow, quick typing on an iPhone with autotext is arguably how to type out jibberish. That was awful on my part. I gotta proof read this stuff.
That said, wow, quick typing on an iPhone with autotext is arguably how to type out jibberish. That was awful on my part. I gotta proof read this stuff.
You’ll do the same once you get your Trackhawk.
Pick your poison.
Gave some serious thought about getting one, but skipped it for the Demon... now I'm not getting the Demon because I want the blown Ford more.
I might buy a totaled Hellcat and do an engine swap in the Wrangler.
Can’t blame you there. I’m interested in the new GT500, only by a car enthusiast’s standpoint not a buyer’s. But those Dodges sure are impressive. I wouldn’t mind getting a Demon when the prices are down, in about 10-15 years.
That would be a cool to see. What are those crashes Hellcats going for?
Pick your poison.
Last auto I drove at the track (drag strip) was a Grand National. I called it the boosted sofa. It won a lot of races, but was boring.
My favorite era for drag racing was when the terminators came out, was one of the faster street cars out there with only 3 mods (pully, chip and cat back), ran 11s all day long, rarely lost, but the driver was important. Most guys couldn't hit 11s with the factory blower, at least not on F1s.
13-14 GT500s would have been fun if it wasn't for "clutch protection". I think I only managed a tenth better than my 3 mod Termi. Not much improvement considering it had 160 more rwhp, and only weighed a couple hundred pounds more.
But, clutch protection led me to get into road courses. Now I enjoy that more than drag racing. The 13-14s were fun on the track, a handful, but fun nonetheless. Going up through the Esses at the glen with 662 hp was awesome.
Then we had the GT350. for a couple of years, I didn't get one because I thought I'd hate it. BUT the new GT500 seemed nowhere on the horizon last spring, and I can't bear to buy a chevy, so I thought I'd get one use it for a year or two until the GT500 was available.
BUT, a weird thing happened. I love the GT350. I love the NA power plant. I don't bother with the drag strip anymore, and while the GT500 was a sledgehammer on a road course, the GT350 is a scalpel.
Now I'm really in a quandary, I don't like the idea of having the second tier Mustang, but I don't think a blown engine regardless of HP will be as much fun? I know, I'm crazy to suggest that a measly 526 HP could be more fun than 650 (ZL1) or 662 (13-14 GT500) or whatever the heck the new GT500 will have. But look at the reviews. Most head to heads prefer the GT350 over the ZL1 1LE. Sure the GT500 will be better than the ZL1 too. But I still can't imagine it being more fun than screaming around at 8K listening to that flat plane exhaust scream. And yes, I think my GT350 screaming through the esses was more fun than my GT500 was grunting through the esses.
Then we come to the transmission. Maybe a proper DCT and constant thrust will be more fun than trying to perfect heel toeing, but maybe not? I don't have the budget to have a DCT and a proper manual to try back to back so if the GT500 has a choice I won't know which one to make. Again, it would be frustrating to have the stick and be several tenths slower than the DCT. But what if the DCT ends up only marginally more fun than the boosted sofa?
I may just stick with the GT350 until there's an opportunity to drive the GT500 on track. Hopefully for more than 2 laps like I had with the GT350 track experience, or whatever the heck they called it.
My favorite era for drag racing was when the terminators came out, was one of the faster street cars out there with only 3 mods (pully, chip and cat back), ran 11s all day long, rarely lost, but the driver was important. Most guys couldn't hit 11s with the factory blower, at least not on F1s.
13-14 GT500s would have been fun if it wasn't for "clutch protection". I think I only managed a tenth better than my 3 mod Termi. Not much improvement considering it had 160 more rwhp, and only weighed a couple hundred pounds more.
But, clutch protection led me to get into road courses. Now I enjoy that more than drag racing. The 13-14s were fun on the track, a handful, but fun nonetheless. Going up through the Esses at the glen with 662 hp was awesome.
Then we had the GT350. for a couple of years, I didn't get one because I thought I'd hate it. BUT the new GT500 seemed nowhere on the horizon last spring, and I can't bear to buy a chevy, so I thought I'd get one use it for a year or two until the GT500 was available.
BUT, a weird thing happened. I love the GT350. I love the NA power plant. I don't bother with the drag strip anymore, and while the GT500 was a sledgehammer on a road course, the GT350 is a scalpel.
Now I'm really in a quandary, I don't like the idea of having the second tier Mustang, but I don't think a blown engine regardless of HP will be as much fun? I know, I'm crazy to suggest that a measly 526 HP could be more fun than 650 (ZL1) or 662 (13-14 GT500) or whatever the heck the new GT500 will have. But look at the reviews. Most head to heads prefer the GT350 over the ZL1 1LE. Sure the GT500 will be better than the ZL1 too. But I still can't imagine it being more fun than screaming around at 8K listening to that flat plane exhaust scream. And yes, I think my GT350 screaming through the esses was more fun than my GT500 was grunting through the esses.
Then we come to the transmission. Maybe a proper DCT and constant thrust will be more fun than trying to perfect heel toeing, but maybe not? I don't have the budget to have a DCT and a proper manual to try back to back so if the GT500 has a choice I won't know which one to make. Again, it would be frustrating to have the stick and be several tenths slower than the DCT. But what if the DCT ends up only marginally more fun than the boosted sofa?
I may just stick with the GT350 until there's an opportunity to drive the GT500 on track. Hopefully for more than 2 laps like I had with the GT350 track experience, or whatever the heck they called it.
Track Tour. Yeah that was fun. Fingers crossed I'll get the invite again this go round
I would not consider a GT350 a second tier Mustang in the same sense I don't consider a GT3 a second tier 911 to a Turbo S. That's an incomplete and imperfect comparison (maybe marginally better comparison is GT3/GT3RS/GT2RS), but they remain different tools for different jobs with different appeals. I've only driven a non-R 350 in the parking lot so I can't accurately compare that, but the R is more fun than many, many, many much higher HP, much more expensive cars. I would assume that also applies on a track-setup non-R.
I also don't care what anyone says; there's a reason race cars don't use superchargers. I wouldn't be buying a supercharged car if I was gonna be a huge track rat with it. Great for one lap shootouts though.
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