2013 Boss 302 LS vs 2013 GT500 SVTP - Opinions on Handling / Road Race Track Ability?

[JohnW#88]

If anyone lives near Tampa with a Boss and knows of some streets they wanna test this theory out on just let me know.

Repectfully, and I'm sure you're joking, but just in case you're not... take it to the track. Killing a soccer Mom and her 4 kids in their minivan certainly would ruin your test. Just sayin'.

I've been avoiding this topic but what the heck, I'll play.

Given the same basic prep (my level of track prep) Full cage, fire system, seat, belts, nets, race suit, Hoosiers, Carbotech pads and good fluid... I'd take the Gt500 for my 4 burner laps of qualifing and the Boss for the 45 minute sprint race. ;-)

Win-Win!

 

[WhiteKnite]

That said, in the 6,000 miles I've had mine I haven't any better "handling" cars out run me anywhere on the streets. Maybe there aren't enough curvy roads where people would have the chance to run each other. My car eats up on and off ramps, as well as the many banked interstates where I live at incredible speeds.

Also mention of the "exclusivity" of the boss...they made 4211 this year right? Don't know GT500 numbers yet, but guessing they are close and it does come with the most powerful production V-8 in the world.

This is what I've been able to scrounge up.

For Boss 2012-2013:
In total, 4000 examples will be assembled. That sum includes 3250 base Bosses and 750 Laguna Seca editions.

For 2012 GT500:
Total Production: 4834 (Includes 9 pre-production units)
3929 Coupes
905 Convertibles

As far as handling cars vs power (GT500), the whole point about straight line power is that you can out-pull most cars no mater how good they handle. Of course the best of both worlds is preferable. Not everyone can afford a $95K stock GTR (king of the street and track, IMO). But even with more power it's up to the driver to know how to handle it.

So, on the street there might be many drivers that let you pass because you're "crazier" than they are. JohnW#88's comment about killing a soccer mom comes to mind. :cryying:

But on the track, we're allowed to push the car way faster than we'd normally be comfortable knowing that there's a lack of soccer moms, telephone poles, slow poke commuter cars, pedestrians, road-kill, curbs just to name a few road hazards.

So, to that person that "beats" me on the street (me letting them go), I say to them, ok lets go on a road course and see who breaks better approaching apexes at 90-120MHP?

Their reply might be, "What does breaking have anything to do with racing?"

My reply? > lol

By the way, you're correct on the purpose built design of the GT500 vs the Boss 302. I see the GT500 as power cruiser. From light to light, you'd beat me no doubt. But that's what the Roush Stage 3 and GT500 are for. Straight line power. Although, the S3 has a better handling package. They're still considered a bit more "cushy (crusier-like)" on the track.

 

[WhiteKnite]

Given the same basic prep (my level of track prep) Full cage, fire system, seat, belts, nets, race suit, Hoosiers, Carbotech pads and good fluid... I'd take the Gt500 for my 4 burner laps of qualifing and the Boss for the 45 minute sprint race. ;-)

Win-Win!

Cheater! :-D

I'm going the weight reduction path first. I'm amazed how much weight loss can be achieved just by replacing the stock Boss 302 wheels with F14s Fordgelines and a new aluminum drive shaft. I'm going to save the later for when I replace the MT82 with a Tremec Trans Package; which includes the tranny, driveshaft, flywheel and shifter.

Seems like I can shave off 150lbs just by doing those mods alone.

 

[Boss949]

This is what I've been able to scrounge up.

For Boss 2012-2013:
In total, 4000 examples will be assembled. That sum includes 3250 base Bosses and 750 Laguna Seca editions.

For 2012 GT500:
Total Production: 4834 (Includes 9 pre-production units)
3929 Coupes
905 Convertibles

As far as handling cars vs power (GT500), the whole point about straight line power is that you can out-pull most cars no mater how good they handle. Of course the best of both worlds is preferable. Not everyone can afford a $95K stock GTR (king of the street and track, IMO). But even with more power it's up to the driver to know how to handle that power.

So, on the street there might be many drivers that let you pass because you're "crazier" than they are. JohnW#88's comment about killing a soccer mom of 4 in her mini-van comes to mind. :cryying:

But on the track, we're allows to push the car way faster than we'd normally be comfortable knowing that there's a lack of soccer moms, telephone poles, slow poke commuter cars, pedestrians, road-kill, curbs just to name a few road hazards.

So, to that person that "beats" me on the street (me letting them go), I say to them, ok lets go on a road course and see who breaks better approaching apexes at 90-120MHP?

Their reply might be, "What does breaking have anything to do with racing?"

My reply? > lol

By the way, you're correct on the purpose built design of the GT500 vs the Boss 302. I see the GT500 as power cruiser. From light to light, you'd beat me no doubt. But that's what the Roush Stage 3 and GT500 are for. Straight line power. Although, the S3 has a better handling package. Their still considered a bit more "cushy (crusier-like)" on the track.

+1 on racing

The Boss is much more unique than the Shelby: 2 Year run.

 

[jaywoo]

If I could have made the payment on a loaded 2013 GT500, there would be one sitting in my garage right now instead of the Boss. I will never track the car. Well, maybe a drag strip once or twice a year. I'd love 600-650 rwhp, so a blower of some type is in my future.

 

[guarnibl]

I say go Boss 302 LS and add the 2013 GT500 brakes, and a T56 Magnum FTW maybe!?!?!?

If you could mod say a good streetable 500 whp that screams past 8K RPM's out of the Roadrunner, me thinks that would be very fun, very cool, and very effective.

I have no person driving experience with either car though. I'm just telling you what I think I would want.

Some good lowering springs to get the stance right would be good too, but at the same time you don't want to take away the # one benefit of the car, and that being it's handling, and track performance.

The GT500 only stops five feet quicker than the 302.

This is an interesting thread. I have a slightly modded '13 GT500 with the SVTPP and track pack. The OP doesn't mention where his car will see most of its action, but seeing how we are talking about street cars and there was no mention of frequent track days, lets assume street driving.

That said, in the 6,000 miles I've had mine I haven't any better "handling" cars out run me anywhere on the streets. Maybe there aren't enough curvy roads where people would have the chance to run each other. My car eats up on and off ramps, as well as the many banked interstates where I live at incredible speeds.

Also mention of the "exclusivity" of the boss...they made 4211 this year right? Don't know GT500 numbers yet, but guessing they are close and it does come with the most powerful production V-8 in the world.

Someone also mentioned the Boss is more fun to drive, and probably so on the track. I haven't driven one, so can't comment on the street fun factor, but I smile every time I drive my Shelby and can't count the number of smiles I see on other motorists faces.

Seems to me both the Boss and GT500 are purpose built cars; the Boss for the road course and the GT500 for everywhere else.

If anyone lives near Tampa with a Boss and knows of some streets they wanna test this theory out on just let me know. (Just kidding)

Love the Shelby. But the Boss feels more raw IMO.

 

[kbroush]

I might be biased but I believe the boss is a lot more exclusive. Only a two year production run and it's still less than one year of a GT500. I love both cars and have driven a few GT500s and they are great but the boss really is a drivers car. It's lighter and more flick able for sure. If I was a rich man I would own one of both.

 

[Para81]

If I could have made the payment on a loaded 2013 GT500, there would be one sitting in my garage right now instead of the Boss. I will never track the car. Well, maybe a drag strip once or twice a year. I'd love 600-650 rwhp, so a blower of some type is in my future.

Have you driven a GT500 yet? I have a GT500 with full Griggs/Watts Link and TVS - it definitely handles better than my Boss Laguna Seca but it's not as fun to drive...

 

[cloud9]

Have you driven a GT500 yet? I have a GT500 with full Griggs/Watts Link and TVS - it definitely handles better than my Boss Laguna Seca but it's not as fun to drive...

Crazy, I have both vehicles too with virtually the same mods. The GT500 makes ~600 rwhp/rwtq compared to the Boss at ~400/360 but my lap times are virtually identical between the cars on several tracks. They just get there in different ways. One's a sledgehammer and the other a scalpel.

 

[Para81]

Crazy, I have both vehicles too with virtually the same mods. The GT500 makes ~600 rwhp/rwtq compared to the Boss at ~400/360 but my lap times are virtually identical between the cars on several tracks. They just get there in different ways. One's a sledgehammer and the other a scalpel.

I can't wait to get them on a road course. I love them both.

 

[kbroush]

Crazy, I have both vehicles too with virtually the same mods. The GT500 makes ~600 rwhp/rwtq compared to the Boss at ~400/360 but my lap times are virtually identical between the cars on several tracks. They just get there in different ways. One's a sledgehammer and the other a scalpel.

That's a good way to describe it!

 

[jaywoo]

Have you driven a GT500 yet? I have a GT500 with full Griggs/Watts Link and TVS - it definitely handles better than my Boss Laguna Seca but it's not as fun to drive...

No, not a 2013. I knew I couldn't afford it so I didn't want to tease myself. Lol! For quite a bit less then the 20k difference, I should be able to put a blower on it to get a little better then a stock 2013. Still wont have Nav, but that's ok.

I LOVE the way this car drives though! I can't believe how different it is compared to my old 2011 5.0. Maybe I should have driven a new GT500, I might like the Boss even more.

 

[TRDon]

If I could have made the payment on a loaded 2013 GT500, there would be one sitting in my garage right now instead of the Boss. I will never track the car. Well, maybe a drag strip once or twice a year. I'd love 600-650 rwhp, so a blower of some type is in my future.

This. I didnt buy my car to run road courses with. I bought it to boost it. All i did was finance an engine up front and got a whole lot of extras in the process. I may change my mind, but i bought the car with that plan. Cars are what you make it and how you want it. If i didnt put boost on it because someone else thinks its sacreligious, im not building my car i am building his car.

 

[5.4ever]

First of all, OP what do you want? What type of speed are you looking for?!?!?! straight or around the course?!?! Is getting the best time possible your most important goal or is getting there comfortably your #1 priority. You may be able to answer your own question when you answer that. Also, the first article you posted only shows how much behind the Boss is vs the ZL1 and the GT500(both are faster than the Boss straight and on a road course)

 

[5.4ever]

One more thing: Are you nly looking for a Ford vehicle? If not, the ZL1 or even the lowly 1LE maybe the answer for you....

Quickest car: GT500,ZL1,Boss,1LE

Fastest on a track:ZL1=/GT500,1LE=/Boss LS

Cheapest: 1LE, Boss, ZL1=/GT500

 

[WhiteKnite]

First of all, OP what do you want? What type of speed are you looking for?!?!?! straight or around the course?!?! Is getting the best time possible your most important goal or is getting there comfortably your #1 priority. You may be able to answer your own question when you answer that. Also, the first article you posted only shows how much behind the Boss is vs the ZL1 and the GT500(both are faster than the Boss straight and on a road course)

5.4ever,

The OP was just asking an honest question. You might want to read the whole thread and not just skim the first few posts.

Also, the point isn't just "the fastest" but a question of tastes and handling. IMO, the ZL1/1LE are ugly and plasticky regardless of their bargain or power. Also, the unique aspect of the retro Boss 302 is that is only has 444HP and 390 RHP and manages to compete on the track with cars pushing 550-600+ and in some cases will save you $12,000+ more (the Link was in the $59,000 range). It was designed to be a track car. Not a drag car. And it too is a bargain starting at 42-45K if you prefer its styling. I'm sure he'd be in the Chevy forum if he narrowed his choices down to include the ZL1/1LE.

 

[5.4ever]

....

 

[5.4ever]

5.4ever,

The OP was just asking an honest question. You might want to read the whole thread and not just skim the first few posts.



Also, the point isn't just "the fastest" but a question of tastes and handling. IMO, the ZL1/1LE are ugly and plasticky regardless of their bargain or power.



Also, the unique aspect of the retro Boss 302 is that is only has 444HP and 390 RHP and manages to compete on the track with cars pushing 550-600+ and in some cases will save you $12,000+ more (the Link was in the $59,000 range).


It was designed to be a track car. Not a drag car. And it too is a bargain starting at 42-45K if you prefer its styling. I'm sure he'd be in the Chevy forum if he narrowed his choices down to include the ZL1/1LE.

Ive read it four times now and all I see is someone trying to be reassured of which handles better, which we all know (common Knowledge) is that the Boss will get you to the finish line in a more "track car" feel. Meaning it handles slightly better than a GT500 and it is N/A

I never said "fastest" was the only way. All I said was "is getting there the fastest one of your objectives?" Because if it is, there are three pony cars that will do it "faster"
And looks are subjective. Im a Ford guy all the way but the 1LE and the ZL1 look amazing.


Uniqueness is all the Boss has going for it now. Two year run with awesome retro styling and somewhat unique motor, is the only thing that makes the Boss stand out now. And even though it does compete with cars that much more expensive, so do the other three pony cars. OP says the GT500 and Boss are priced similar meaning he can afford a new GT500, as well as a ZL1 and obviously a 1LE


And just because hes in a Ford forum doesnt mean for sure he would like a Mustang. Hes in a Boss subforum, does that mean he already chose a Boss over the GT500?!?!? Think not, and if the answer is yes, our discussion is moot lol

GT500 and ZL1 will get you there the fastest

ZL1 will get you there the fastest and handles the best of all 4 cars

The 1LE will get you there just as quick, if not quicker than a Boss, and for cheaper....

Boss sounds cool, looks cool, is rare... Thats about it. It no longer holds any rareness on the track. The other three pony cars will trump it somehow someway


Now if you want the BOSS only for its looks, then by all means go for it... :rockon:

 

[WhiteKnite]

Boss sounds cool, looks cool, is rare... Thats about it. It no longer holds any rareness on the track. The other three pony cars will trump it somehow someway

Now if you want the BOSS only for its looks, then by all means go for it... :rockon:

Rareness is only a collectors word. I don't care if they made 500,000 of them. All that matters is the "track feel" means that it actually handles and is more settled in the corners than the GT500. Which that it does. The GT500 is not as smooth on the track regardless of it's extra power. I know, I know, you drive up hill, both ways, in the snow...

Please. The point of a excellent designed track car is that it gives good feed back and allows the car to settle in the corners that enable a driver to get better lap times.

Now, regardless of "only for looks." The only reason you said that is because I made fun of how the Camaro looks. lol So, please tell that to the Grand-AM Continental, NASA and American Iron Mustang drivers. It's "obvious" they only drive them for looks.

Don't know who they are? Google is your friend. :rockon: Hint: It has nothing to do with 1/4 mile.

P.S. The reason I had issue with your post is that the OPs question is over six months old and you added nothing new to the conversation other than making a post that was late to the party. Funny you mention "common knowledge" after the fact of a six month old thread. Common knowledge can only be bolstered by asking question to people that actually own the cars, as he has done.

 

[Smileyboy]

Ive read it four times now and all I see is someone trying to be reassured of which handles better, which we all know (common Knowledge) is that the Boss will get you to the finish line in a more "track car" feel. Meaning it handles slightly better than a GT500 and it is N/A

I never said "fastest" was the only way. All I said was "is getting there the fastest one of your objectives?" Because if it is, there are three pony cars that will do it "faster"
And looks are subjective. Im a Ford guy all the way but the 1LE and the ZL1 look amazing.


Uniqueness is all the Boss has going for it now. Two year run with awesome retro styling and somewhat unique motor, is the only thing that makes the Boss stand out now. And even though it does compete with cars that much more expensive, so do the other three pony cars. OP says the GT500 and Boss are priced similar meaning he can afford a new GT500, as well as a ZL1 and obviously a 1LE


And just because hes in a Ford forum doesnt mean for sure he would like a Mustang. Hes in a Boss subforum, does that mean he already chose a Boss over the GT500?!?!? Think not, and if the answer is yes, our discussion is moot lol

GT500 and ZL1 will get you there the fastest

ZL1 will get you there the fastest and handles the best of all 4 cars

The 1LE will get you there just as quick, if not quicker than a Boss, and for cheaper....

Boss sounds cool, looks cool, is rare... Thats about it. It no longer holds any rareness on the track. The other three pony cars will trump it somehow someway


Now if you want the BOSS only for its looks, then by all means go for it... :rockon:

:dw:

The Shelby is barely quicker, the only thing it really has going for it is shear power. On some courses, that amount of power is useless. Also, hate to bring it to you, but the shelby isn't much faster than a boss. The ZL1 is also in the same boat plus its heavier. I have yet to see anything conclusive to show a 1LE is faster. All they did was minor suspension. It looses the HP battle and weight. As someone else pointed out, its also much less attractive. The only thing that has kept Camaro sales up is the hype from the transformers movie.

If you want something with balance then the Boss is much better suited for open track use. Isn't going to kill your budget in terms of maintenance. Brakes, tires, etc. And probably less risk of blowing your motor on track due to heat from the blower.