Fall 2017 GT500 supercharged voodoo, 10 speed auto and....

I think Ford is F#$Ked. I say this as someone who drove and loved my 2010 GT500. Ford always led the horsepower wars and lately they just seem to be scrambling. Here's what happened.

Dodge realized (rightfully so) that people in America want their American Muscle cars to be the king of the road. Not track day warriors. Make it handle, but when you put the hammer down, you want all hell to break loose. The Hellcat/Demon really messed with Chevy and Ford.

Think about it. Can you really release a GT500 now with 725bhp and call it a day when an 840bhp Demon is out there popping wheelies? 0-60 in 2.2 and 0-100 in 5.1. My god. It's a single-minded purpose built beast. What will the GT500 be? Nothing but a compromise of both track ready and 1/4 mile monster.

Chevy releases the greatest Camaro in the history of Camaros (ZL1 1LE) and NOBODY CARES. There's no hype. No hoopla. No orders flying in. Just a bunch of pissed off ZL1 early adopters that Chevy screwed when they decided to make a better ZL1 just 6 months after they launch the first car.

The promise of the GT500 has gotten old. We all know 1 thing...Ford made it to beat the Hellcat. And Ford probably had it around 80K. Now they have no answer for the Demon. None. I'm not trolling. Just telling it like it is. I was so ready to sell my Hellcat for a GT500 but year after year Ford has no answer. The GT350 is a pussy cat. I eat them alive in my Hellcat.

I just think Ford is kind of F#$ked. They literally can not top the Demon. Dodge gave the people what they wanted and Ford got caught confused and fighting a war against one monster, only to find that was just the baby monster, not the real king of the land.

Kaneda said:

I think Ford is F#$Ked. I say this as someone who drove and loved my 2010 GT500. Ford always led the horsepower wars and lately they just seem to be scrambling. Here's what happened.

Dodge realized (rightfully so) that people in America want their American Muscle cars to be the king of the road. Not track day warriors. Make it handle, but when you put the hammer down, you want all hell to break loose. The Hellcat/Demon really messed with Chevy and Ford.

Think about it. Can you really release a GT500 now with 725bhp and call it a day when an 840bhp Demon is out there popping wheelies? 0-60 in 2.2 and 0-100 in 5.1. My god. It's a single-minded purpose built beast. What will the GT500 be? Nothing but a compromise of both track ready and 1/4 mile monster.

Chevy releases the greatest Camaro in the history of Camaros (ZL1 1LE) and NOBODY CARES. There's no hype. No hoopla. No orders flying in. Just a bunch of pissed off ZL1 early adopters that Chevy screwed when they decided to make a better ZL1 just 6 months after they launch the first car.

The promise of the GT500 has gotten old. We all know 1 thing...Ford made it to beat the Hellcat. And Ford probably had it around 80K. Now they have no answer for the Demon. None. I'm not trolling. Just telling it like it is. I was so ready to sell my Hellcat for a GT500 but year after year Ford has no answer. The GT350 is a pussy cat. I eat them alive in my Hellcat.

I just think Ford is kind of F#$ked. They literally can not top the Demon. Dodge gave the people what they wanted and Ford got caught confused and fighting a war against one monster, only to find that was just the baby monster, not the real king of the land.

Click to expand...

I don't think you can judge until all the facts are in....LOL

Kaneda said:

I think Ford is F#$Ked. I say this as someone who drove and loved my 2010 GT500. Ford always led the horsepower wars and lately they just seem to be scrambling. Here's what happened.

Dodge realized (rightfully so) that people in America want their American Muscle cars to be the king of the road. Not track day warriors. Make it handle, but when you put the hammer down, you want all hell to break loose. The Hellcat/Demon really messed with Chevy and Ford.

Think about it. Can you really release a GT500 now with 725bhp and call it a day when an 840bhp Demon is out there popping wheelies? 0-60 in 2.2 and 0-100 in 5.1. My god. It's a single-minded purpose built beast. What will the GT500 be? Nothing but a compromise of both track ready and 1/4 mile monster.

Chevy releases the greatest Camaro in the history of Camaros (ZL1 1LE) and NOBODY CARES. There's no hype. No hoopla. No orders flying in. Just a bunch of pissed off ZL1 early adopters that Chevy screwed when they decided to make a better ZL1 just 6 months after they launch the first car.

The promise of the GT500 has gotten old. We all know 1 thing...Ford made it to beat the Hellcat. And Ford probably had it around 80K. Now they have no answer for the Demon. None. I'm not trolling. Just telling it like it is. I was so ready to sell my Hellcat for a GT500 but year after year Ford has no answer. The GT350 is a pussy cat. I eat them alive in my Hellcat.

I just think Ford is kind of F#$ked. They literally can not top the Demon. Dodge gave the people what they wanted and Ford got caught confused and fighting a war against one monster, only to find that was just the baby monster, not the real king of the land.

Click to expand...

Dodge can't make those road barges turn, so they might as well load them up on HP. Most people are tired of "American sports car" being the butt of a performance joke on the world car scene. Dodge can have their straight line cars. Nobody outside of drag racers really cares. We want the American manufacturers to keep pushing out ZL1s, ZL1 1LEs, GT350Rs, and the upcoming GT500 that will be a GT350R on steroids. And if Ford is serious about the use of carbon composites and other lightweight materials, we could be looking at a GT500 that weighs about the same as the C7 Z06. Imagine a GT350R with about 200 lbs less weight and 200+ more HP. Bye-bye, Z06!

So, yeah. Dodge can have the straight line game.

edit:
I remember how Carroll Shelby told Ford he wanted to build a Mustang that could "kick the shit out of Corvettes" on track. Thus became the original GT350R. I wonder how the current GT350R would fare against a C6 Z06 on track.

No one is buying a mustang that costs nearly 100 grand. People with that kind of coin dont buy mustangs. So if ford wants to try to build something thats both light weight, handles the road course, and dominates the drag strip, well, good luck pricing said car in the realm where your meat and potatoes crowd (read: mustang crowd) can afford one. The Shelbys were at the top end of that spectrum as it was IMO. Also, not exactly sure why you guys think Americans all of a sudden want road course cars over brutal power anyway. I sure dont. Wouldnt have bought a GT500 if I did. But whatever floats your boat. </Initiate flame suit>

Clemson said:

No one is buying a mustang that costs nearly 100 grand. People with that kind of coin dont buy mustangs. So if ford wants to try to build something thats both light weight, handles the road course, and dominates the drag strip, well, good luck pricing said car in the realm where your meat and potatoes crowd (read: mustang crowd) can afford one. The Shelbys were at the top end of that spectrum as it was IMO. Also, not exactly sure why you guys think Americans all of a sudden want road course cars over brutal power anyway. I sure dont. Wouldnt have bought a GT500 if I did. But whatever floats your boat. </Initiate flame suit>

Click to expand...

Evolution of the species. I love drag racing and have a packed shoe box of ships to prove it, but open tracking is far more fun. You can drag down every straight and then turn after to top it off. The downside is less accessibility and increased cost to get the car ready then in terms of maintenance. I guess what I'm getting at is a lot of new cars have HP it's time we the consumer expected more from a car than just straight line speed--save the hellcat/Demon which are outstanding one trick ponies.

I also disagree: If Ford made a 100k mustang ( NI ADM) it would sell just as the v6 Ford GT has already sold out its first 3 years of production at the same price as an Aventador.

Ford needs to work on aerodynamics bigtime with the stang. That and the 10A should help it compete with performance rivals from across the pond at greater than highway speeds.

Fourcam380 said:

Evolution of the species. ...

Click to expand...

'nuff said! Anybody can trash a car and turn it into a straight line monster. Look how many people ruined Boss 302s by turning them into drag cars. SMH

So don't the cobra jets run 8.98's@151mph?


http://www.dragtimes.com/Ford-Mustang-Timeslip-25950.html

Hero run vs hero run it looks like Ford already won this battle years ago but what do facts have to do with anything...

I personally love whooping the hell out of hellcats. I've had tougher races against 500whp evo's.

Also, it's pretty cool that the zl1 can run 11.5s@127, so can a trinity, and the hellcat too. Only difference is the trinity and zl1 will both do so much more like corner carve a hot lap and auto cross.

For the record, the demon is an exceptional vehicle, I just like to point out facts when people jump in the hyperbolic demon steroid train.

tt335ci03cobra said:

For the record, the demon is an exceptional vehicle, I just like to point out facts when people jump in the hyperbolic demon steroid train.

Click to expand...

We know the Cobra Jet is a beast.
I think we're all impressed here because one can daily drive the Demon if one chooses to. Not so with the CJ.

tt335ci03cobra said:

For the record, the demon is an exceptional vehicle, I just like to point out facts when people jump in the hyperbolic demon steroid train.

Click to expand...

argument is invalid.

CJ cannot be registered.


The way Dodge did the Demon was so epic. Their Marketing dept is shredding eveyrone by FAR!

Hell, i love Ford performance cars (check sig) but id be a damn FOOL to say that the Demon isnt a sick son of a bitch. Does it take the fun out of it? Sure... i like to build my own race cars with my hands but hey... Demon is an awesome idea nonetheless and ROCK ON Dodge for bringing A game. Ford and Chevy simply cannot compete.


And to whoever said the next GT500 will weigh the same as a c7z?? Get off the crack!

Maybe if they introduce it with a new chassis LOL! S550... no chance.

gimmie11s said:

argument is invalid.

CJ cannot be registered.
...

Click to expand...

The Cobra Jet can't be registered, but the Demon can't run 9.65s on the street, either. So when you put both cars in their natural element, Ford wins.

gimmie11s said:

...
And to whoever said the next GT500 will weigh the same as a c7z?? Get off the crack!

Maybe if they introduce it with a new chassis LOL! S550... no chance.

Click to expand...

I said imagine... Also, the GT350R-C is 3300 pounds. That's with a full cage, air jacks, a fuel cell, race electronics, and a weight penalty. That's well over 200 lbs lighter than a C7 Z06. Now, pay close attention. "...if Ford is serious about the use of carbon composites and other lightweight materials, we could be looking at a GT500 that weighs about the same as the C7 Z06." A GT350R w/o Electronics Pack is 3650 lbs. That's without even going whole hog with weight reduction. The C7 Z06 is 3534 lbs. We're not talking about a featherweight car here.

Why wont it run a 9.65? It sure will. Worse case, they say it will run a 9.9x without the special ECU and 100 octane tune.

Your opinion is Ford is going to mimick the weight savings of the 350R-C with the upcoming GT500? Come on dude.. wishful thinking.

The GT500 was never meant to be a pure track car--regardless of what Carroll Shelby might have said.

Its a Grand Tourer... not a canyon carver. It will likely be more Hellcat and less GT350 in my opinion... but i guess we'll have to wait and see.

Thanks to the ZL-1 the bar has been raised. It should turn as well as it goes, if they hit the mark.

Kaneda said:

I think Ford is F#$Ked. I say this as someone who drove and loved my 2010 GT500. Ford always led the horsepower wars and lately they just seem to be scrambling. Here's what happened.

Dodge realized (rightfully so) that people in America want their American Muscle cars to be the king of the road. Not track day warriors. Make it handle, but when you put the hammer down, you want all hell to break loose. The Hellcat/Demon really messed with Chevy and Ford.

Think about it. Can you really release a GT500 now with 725bhp and call it a day when an 840bhp Demon is out there popping wheelies? 0-60 in 2.2 and 0-100 in 5.1. My god. It's a single-minded purpose built beast. What will the GT500 be? Nothing but a compromise of both track ready and 1/4 mile monster.

Chevy releases the greatest Camaro in the history of Camaros (ZL1 1LE) and NOBODY CARES. There's no hype. No hoopla. No orders flying in. Just a bunch of pissed off ZL1 early adopters that Chevy screwed when they decided to make a better ZL1 just 6 months after they launch the first car.

The promise of the GT500 has gotten old. We all know 1 thing...Ford made it to beat the Hellcat. And Ford probably had it around 80K. Now they have no answer for the Demon. None. I'm not trolling. Just telling it like it is. I was so ready to sell my Hellcat for a GT500 but year after year Ford has no answer. The GT350 is a pussy cat. I eat them alive in my Hellcat.

I just think Ford is kind of F#$ked. They literally can not top the Demon. Dodge gave the people what they wanted and Ford got caught confused and fighting a war against one monster, only to find that was just the baby monster, not the real king of the land.

Click to expand...

You are completely clueless meng... lol

GT Premi said:

Dodge can't make those road barges turn, so they might as well load them up on HP. Most people are tired of "American sports car" being the butt of a performance joke on the world car scene. Dodge can have their straight line cars. Nobody outside of drag racers really cares. We want the American manufacturers to keep pushing out ZL1s, ZL1 1LEs, GT350Rs, and the upcoming GT500 that will be a GT350R on steroids. And if Ford is serious about the use of carbon composites and other lightweight materials, we could be looking at a GT500 that weighs about the same as the C7 Z06. Imagine a GT350R with about 200 lbs less weight and 200+ more HP. Bye-bye, Z06!

So, yeah. Dodge can have the straight line game.

edit:
I remember how Carroll Shelby told Ford he wanted to build a Mustang that could "kick the shit out of Corvettes" on track. Thus became the original GT350R. I wonder how the current GT350R would fare against a C6 Z06 on track.

Click to expand...

You are smoking some good shit if you honestly believe the majority of mustang buyers or any pony/muscle car buyer are more worried about how it turns over raw horsepower.

gimmie11s said:

Why wont it run a 9.65? It sure will. Worse case, they say it will run a 9.9x without the special ECU and 100 octane tune.

Your opinion is Ford is going to mimick the weight savings of the 350R-C with the upcoming GT500? Come on dude.. wishful thinking.

...

Click to expand...

I said it won't run 9.65 on the street, and it won't. That time was run on a prepped drag strip in ideal conditions. And for ****'s sake, I didn't say Ford would mimic the weight savings of the GT350R-C. You implied that it would be impossible for Ford to get the S550 to the weight of the extra portly C7 Z06. I simply used the GT350R-C as an example that, in race livery, the S550 is actually lighter than the C7 Z06. If the GT350R didn't have the Magnaride suspension, its weight would almost be within spitting distance of the C7 Z06.

Ford is already working on carbon fiber composite engine cradles (k-members). I'm sure they have other composite parts in the works, as well. Now, yet again, with the use of their carbon fiber composites and other lightweight materials, the next GT500 could indeed be near the weight of the C7 Z06. I don't know how I can make that statement any simpler, and I'm not even going to try anymore.

GotHemi? said:

You are smoking some good shit if you honestly believe the majority of mustang buyers or any pony/muscle car buyer are more worried about how it turns over raw horsepower.

Click to expand...

So, what you're saying is that you think Ford sells more Mustang GTs than they do V6s and Ecoboosts? Chevy sells more SSs than V6 and Ecotech Camaros?

@gimmie11s

You can make a cobra jet street legal. It doesn't have to have a vin number. As someone else said, it's the process used to make a kit car road legal.

Your retort is invalid because people have already done it.

Carry on.

S550's can be widdled down into the 3200lbs range with relative ease if you remove/replace anything nice/comfy in the interior, and suspension. The gt350r-c is a prime example. That car is handicapped with weights and comes in at 3200.

Ford can pull 200lbs out of a gt350r just by using a lighter engine cradle and floor.

The 2006+ z06's used balsa wood etc for the chassis to remove over 150lbs vs a steel c6.

What gtpremi said is completely accurate (unlikely) as he said IF ford is serious about carbon composite....

I don't think most mustang owners care about handling all that much. Most of us paid less than $40k for our cars, id argue quite a bunch of us spent less than $25k. We conceded that drag racing and straight line speed was good enough for us when we bought our cars.

I do know most anyone shopping for a $75k car will care a shitload about handling, interior, styling, comfort and sportiness because that's a boat load of money. You won't get a person who has $75k buying a drag car anywhere near as often as that person will buy an all around performer. Too much money on a singularity toy.

The demon is 4/10th awesome performance and 6/10th hype.

It runs its numbers, and does so well. It's also a lot slower than a cobra jet or even a copo. That said, I applaud dodge for a brilliant campaign. The car will sell out and bolster the brand. I'd do the same thing in their position. Don't hate the player, laugh at the game and get on with it.