Steigemeier Stage V Torque Plate Issues

[03 TOPLESSSVT]

Sorry guys but I just looked through all my pics and I must have dumped them. Once the blower was fixed I guess that I figured I didn't need them any more. 2 of the welds were completelly broken free & the others were either 1/2 way through or starting. What happens is that the sheet stock starts to tear/crack also right where the weld starts or ends. The plate must vibrate like hell under boost and want to shake itsel loose.

After installing the Stage 4 that had been further modified the car immediately ran & idled better along with quicker revs and seat of the pants feel (ass dyno). After taking it to Pete at Performance Dyno up in NH it was confirmed and onl 2 pulls were needed to get it right. It took 10 pulls with the broken stage 5 and still was off. Instant 11.4 to an 11.01. Thats just my 2 cents.

 

[STAMPEDE3]

Please don't take this the wrong way, but if I understand you guys correctly, you are wrong.

Mark(boobinspector), told me this exactly, and I had his car here after he tried getting most of the water out to then help change the blower/intercooler and do other upgrades.

He had popped his hood and noticed his intercooler fluid was low. I don't know if he put coolant or water in, but he did the jumper technique to fill the res. back up, but he noticed that it wouldn't fill up. he just kept pouring fluid in and the level didn't change much at all. it was pumping the water through the cracks in the intercooler and filling up the lower intake and then going into the heads and through the valves. he tried starting the car and at first it turned over, then it stopped and wouldn't do anything. I would consider this hydrolocking. The same think happened to sprayed daily a few years ago.

I have the intercooler here still and I poured water in it and it was cracked pretty bad. on the inside and even outside. if you guys want, I can have someone help and I can video tape it from my iphone. It may or may not happen tonight, but I can try.

if you want to consider that total failure, go ahead. IMO, if it cracks, it failed. total failure or not, it failed and is leaking into the lower intake. if you don't realize it soon enough, it goes into the cylinders, oil pan and many other problems can also take place if it isn't taken care of soon enough.

That was my point about it leaking with the car off. Does the IC hold enough water to fill the lower? IDK that answer for sure but I wouldn't think so.

In the case you are talking about he jumped the pump motor to continue filling so it was pumping more and more into the intake with the car not running if I read correctly.

That for sure can do it.

If the car is running it will take a catastrophic failure to DUMP in enough water to lock the motor.

My post was simply to rest peoples minds a little that the car SHOULD NOT hydro lock with a crack or small hole in the IC.

And yes, Pouring cold water down the carb does wonders for the combustion chamber.

 

[jrandy]

Orders blower back in 6/2008
eaton stage 5 port



10/2008 Ask about cams. For someone who claims to know a lot he doesn't know shit.
what type of cams should i buy?

.

hmmm...

Just playing devils advocate here but isn't that going against your argument about not swearing to customers? :dw:

That was my point about it leaking with the car off. Does the IC hold enough water to fill the lower? IDK that answer for sure but I wouldn't think so.
.

I was always under the impression that the IC did hold enough to hyrolock, but I could be wrong. I read it on a forum somewhere, but we all know just because its on the internet doesn't mean is the truth... :lol1:

 

[dynobobstieg]

hmmm...

Just playing devils advocate here but isn't that going against your argument about not swearing to customers? :dw:














I was always under the impression that the IC did hold enough to hyrolock, but I could be wrong. I read it on a forum somewhere, but we all know just because its on the internet doesn't mean is the truth... :lol1:

Sorry, that was actually a quote from someone else's post.

I have posted what I was asked about the technical information.
This has turned and I am not going to continue with this drama, if anyone has any real technical questions or concerns they need to contact me.
Thank you
Stiegemeier
636-949-2275
[email protected]
or PM

 

[JMD0346]

Sorry, that was actually a quote from someone else's post.

I have posted what I was asked about the technical information.
This has turned and I am not going to continue with this drama, if anyone has any real technical questions or concerns they need to contact me.
Thank you
Stiegemeier
636-949-2275
[email protected]
or PM

Are you kidding me? I suggest you rethink your position here. Showing some pictures and some advertisemets has done absolutely nothing to answer tech questions.


You havent answered where that junkyard plate came from. Why it was welded so poorly and incorrectly. What people should do and what you intend to do.


Ok so you say you're using good material now and what looks like TIG welds. Thats great. It still doesnt address the problem with all the others that out there.

If one had junk aluminum and monkey welds I imagine more do to. We have cases of several breaking even with the new plates and welding procedure. What about those?


If someone had a failure that causes engine/IC damage what do you intend to do about it?


No my friend this is far from over imo.

 

[IronTerp]

Well JMD, it's looking like the next step would be for the folks that are running Stage V's, (especially the early editions!), to call Steigemeier with their porting serial number handy, to get the exact information on the torque plate dynamic of their porting job. If Steigemeier reports that it is one of the models with the lower grade aluminum plate/welding, then the customer needs to ask them what can be done to remedy this potentially damaging modification. Hopefully, the customer will report back on Steigemeier's proposed solution......

I have posted what I was asked about the technical information. This has turned and I am not going to continue with this drama, if anyone has any real technical questions or concerns they need to contact me.

Thank you
Stiegemeier

There has actually been very little "drama" in this thread at all and there has been some very good technical discussion on the porperties of aluminum, welding dynamics, and possible consequences of various failures of the Stage V's torque plate. This thread and the one that preceeded it, has been loaded with "concerns" as to this situation and possible solutions. Not sure why you refuse to discuss the issue of these multiple torque plate failures and what Steigemeier Porting intends to do to rectify this. You have been contacted through this thread, and as a Supporting Vendor on this site, this would certainly be a great way to reach the many Stage V owners that are following this situation.

 

[black 10th vert]

Are you kidding me? I suggest you rethink your position here. Showing some pictures and some advertisemets has done absolutely nothing to answer tech questions.


You havent answered where that junkyard plate came from. Why it was welded so poorly and incorrectly. What people should do and what you intend to do.


Ok so you say you're using good material now and what looks like TIG welds. Thats great. It still doesnt address the problem with all the others that out there.

If one had junk aluminum and monkey welds I imagine more do to. We have cases of several breaking even with the new plates and welding procedure. What about those?


If someone had a failure that causes engine/IC damage what do you intend to do about it?


No my friend this is far from over imo.

^totally agree!:beer:

Bob, you really haven't helped us at all in this thread, other than pasting that same damn advertisement, that you posted twice in the other thread about this!:bash: Why can't you just put some kind of public statement out there (other than more of the same advertising) to let those of us who are (or potentially are) affected by this issue know that you will indeed stand behind all of these units? Obviously, in addition to the hassle of having to send the blower back to you, we also have to deal the labor of taking the car back apart, dealing with downtime, possibly needing to replace some gaskets, etc. I can't speak for everyone here, but this is a very valid concern for me personally.

 

[x NOODLES x]

I always wondered why POSI Performance didn't need (or want) to add this torque plate??

Does anyone know if this is the reason(no strength)? Or is it patented or something?

 

[JMD0346]

Well JMD, it's looking like the next step would be for the folks that are running Stage V's, (especially the early editions!), to call Steigemeier with their porting serial number handy, to get the exact information on the torque plate dynamic of their porting job. If Steigemeier reports that it is one of the models with the lower grade aluminum plate/welding, then the customer needs to ask them what can be done to remedy this potentially damaging modification. Hopefully, the customer will report back on Steigemeier's proposed solution......


There has actually been very little "drama" in this thread at all and there has been some very good technical discussion on the porperties of aluminum, welding dynamics, and possible consequences of various failures of the Stage V's torque plate. This thread and the one that preceeded it, has been loaded with "concerns" as to this situation and possible solutions. Not sure why you refuse to discuss the issue of these multiple torque plate failures and what Steigemeier Porting intends to do to rectify this. You have been contacted through this thread, and as a Supporting Vendor on this site, this would certainly be a great way to reach the many Stage V owners that are following this situation.

I aree with you Ironterp to a degree.


I guess his post just hit me wrong. It seem to have a tone to it. Exactly what he's been accused of. Kind of said to me(in my mind) he's tired of dealing with us/this. I apologize if I took it the wrong way or read to much into it. Its easy to do that I know.


Imho the members here deserve some explanations. What better place to do it than here where the members are? Why must every stage 5 owner have to call in and do things on his terms?

I guess at this point I dont think its too much to ask for the guy to post up publicly for our consumption, study and dialogue. Wouldnt you agree?

IMO when your stage 5 was made is irrelevant. The trouble as I see it is trying to weld cast to 6061 and subject it to that stress and heat. The material problem he has addressed, yes, but not the weld problem. I just dont trust it.


In my mind the question shouldnt be "What is your serial number?". The question is "what are you(stieg) going to do to help people remove the plate?".

We know they will/have failed. We know welding these two entirly different metals together is not strong. We know he has used inferior materials. We know he has made inferior welds. We know its been noticed that it(plate) doesnt actually help anything and at this point is more of a danger than worth it. We know the best/safest thing to do at this point is remove it and play it safe.

What we DONT know is what he's gonna do about it.



I dont want to sound negative at all. I just love my site and I want to see everybody come out ok with this.


Ill say again. If it were me Id remove and inspect/remove the plate regardless of what stieg says. I do all my own work on my car and I just wouldnt trust anyone's opinion with my very expensive engine.


Im not saying stieg will/did or may lie about anything but he more than likely is on damage control. Part of that is to down play the severity of problems.

If Im porven to be wrong then Ill take my lumps and apologize in the same way I expressed my concern and lended my little bit of knowledge of materials/welding/welding processes.


:beer:

 

[Tractionless1]

Those with Stg. 5's should be glad 'Terp. is refeering the ordeal, he is definitely going about it in a business like manner. Fortunately I am not affected as I am a Puss about adhearing material in the intake such as tq. plates, intake mani. epoxy, and JB welding silencer holes. Two of the three have seen failures and the jury is still out on the 3rd. I'm not saying anything, I'm just saying........

 

[TRBO VNM]

What is the price of a new intercooler now from tousley? I know you can find them used for about $300, but I thought brand new was a lot more.

 

[latemodelracer2]

I always wondered why POSI Performance didn't need (or want) to add this torque plate??

Does anyone know if this is the reason(no strength)? Or is it patented or something?

I know on my car removing it didn't cause any loss.

 

[utfan98]

Are you parinoid about something here? The more information we can gather the better we can diagnose the problem. The only implication of a requirement to prove anything is the one you somehow read into my post. Perhaps it's because I'm a scientist, but I tend to like to base my conclusions on as much information as reasonably possible.

Also, I'm not one to sit idly by while others try to solve an issue on their own. If we can help Bob solve a problem and improve his products by pooling together information I think we should. It's a lot more efficient and ultimately better for the customer.

No paranoia here (I don't have a Stage V). Instead of "us" trying to diagnose the problem(s), why doesn't Bob? As a member of the community reading the posts, I feel that this potentially serious problem is swept under the rug. We are talking about a SC here, not a shifter knob. You are talking labor time, shipping and down time of a car.

Bob should have informed the community of the problem(s) that the Stage V's are experiencing. Someone suggested a sticky about the potential problem, I could not agree more. Bob should be the one gathering information, interviewing, consulting, etc. He should have been proactive not reactive with is customers, his last name should be Toyota. We can all agree that an inferior product was made.

It appears that he is willing to work with some people, great. Where is the accountability?

 

[IronTerp]

Understand totally where you're coming from JDM. And can't say that I disagree......

I always wondered why POSI Performance didn't need (or want) to add this torque plate??

Does anyone know if this is the reason(no strength)? Or is it patented or something?

In the testing and evaluation that Brian did with the Eaton and his porting design, he found no performance benefit with the inclusion of the torque plate. His design appears to work well without it. Steigemeier's design apparently (argueably), receives a benefit from the plate.

What is the price of a new intercooler now from tousley? I know you can find them used for about $300, but I thought brand new was a lot more.

Grumpy Mystic paid $600 from Tousley for his intercooler about two years ago. They are probably higher now.....

 

[1BADSNK]

I went to Steig because at the time he was known as "the man" when it came to porting. I have the new style stage 5 but I've seen pics over the past few days of the welds on those even cracking. So, if I have to go through the crap of taking the blower back off again I'm putting a Whipple back on. Just wished I saved my money for this now instead of the cracking port. What can I do about the problem? Well, only one thing that I know of now. If I can save any of my Cobra brothers from wasting their money then I will. I have made other owners of our large mustang club aware of this problem. I have had two guys thank me today. They were just about to send their blowers out to have the stage 5 done & now they have changed their minds due to this problem. Does it help me......no.....but I feel better knowing I'm helping someone else from dealing with the problem I now have. This is such a dang same. :fm::nono:

 

[ImportsSuk]

I went to Steig because at the time he was known as "the man" when it came to porting. I have the new style stage 5 but I've seen pics over the past few days of the welds on those even cracking. So, if I have to go through the crap of taking the blower back off again I'm putting a Whipple back on. Just wished I saved my money for this now instead of the cracking port. What can I do about the problem? Well, only one thing that I know of now. If I can save any of my Cobra brothers from wasting their money then I will. I have made other owners of our large mustang club aware of this problem. I have had two guys thank me today. They were just about to send their blowers out to have the stage 5 done & now they have changed their minds due to this problem. Does it help me......no.....but I feel better knowing I'm helping someone else from dealing with the problem I now have. This is such a dang same. :fm::nono:

i cross posted this thread as well on my local board. he has lost a few ports over there also. i almost pulled the trigger on sending mine in when the 5 and 5+ just came out. i am so glad i didn't. if i did and had the same problems then this all this came to light, you can best believe he'd be hearing from my lawyer faster than he could say torque plate.

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

Getting the welding right shouldn't be that tough, different thickness or not.

The more of theses failures I have seen the more I am convinced, these plates are flexing in various areas from the powerful pulses of the charger rotors

.125 Sheet Aluminum can be flexed, it's only an 1/8" thick. I don't believe there is any metallurgical mystery here.

Air is a powerful thing even under fairly low pressures.

Stop the flex completely with an even thicker plate and do solid welds that also eliminate flex potential, or ditch the plate completely.

If the flexing isn't completely removed, the problem will reoccur.

 

[x NOODLES x]

Unfortunately unless this is 'fixed' somehow, those stuck holding Stage 5's will have ZERO value in the blower if they ever want to upgrade to a TS or Turbo......

 

[rotor_powerd]

What is the price of a new intercooler now from tousley? I know you can find them used for about $300, but I thought brand new was a lot more.

When I wrecked my car last winter, I needed a new heat exchanger, but the guy from Nationwide thought it was an intercooler, so he quoted me for a new OEM intercooler, and it was a hair over $900, IIRC.

 

[supercarkiller]

jesus christ this has gotten around ! just goes to show what a tight knit community we svtr's are. i don't know about u guys but i learn a great deal from this site and it has saved me lots of time and money in many other ways modding the car. i hate that this big of a shit storm had to become of it but looking now at the potential money and problems we will all save the drama i have had to go through is well worth it in my eyes. guys if u have a stage 4 or 5 i strongly recommend u remove it and have a look. the saddest part too me is all the poor guys that will never see these threads and there hard earned money is flying out the tailpipes. guys if u don't have the money to have posi or steve correctly port ur blower than at least remove and take the torque plate off. this could in fact potentially save u thousands by spending a little time removing the blower and having a look see. i was very lucky too find before it caused major damage !!!! i hope i have been of some real help to people by starting all this.