Official PNWSVT rebuild thread

[PNWSVT]

Nearest E85 station is 71 miles north of where I live. So trust me when I say it won’t run E85. It is on water/meth as well. And I’m trying to think this through, I’m not blindly doing anything. I have been and am continuing to research everything I can think of.

 

[roy_1031]

alright so you’re saying I can’t take a 4.6 block, not pay for machine work, and put 4000 into the bottom end and not make 750 with the rest of my setup? If that’s what you’re saying, why?

Because to make that 750 number, you'll need to run boost levels and timing that will melt a piston in short order running pump gas. The cylinder temps are astronomical pump gas versus E85. You might make a hero number on the dyno.....but I suspect it will fail very quickly once you leave

You need to really think thru your next steps on that motor and the fuel type that will be used. Are you 100% positive you won't run E85 at all? These answers might make a huge difference with the compression you want to set this motor up. Think it thru fully before proceeding.

If I was you, I'd sell the 3.4 regardless. The smaller blower will work better and be easier on the crank. If you can run E85 for your "kill" setup.....you could design that motor higher compression and make the 750 with a 2.3. And the days you leave it pump gas in "detuned" mode....it will be more snappy than the 3.4 lugging around low boost with a low compression motor

If you went the turbo route you would make a power closer to your goal due to not having the parasitic loss of a blower. The blower takes power to make power and a 3.4 takes a lot of power just to spin it. Just throwing that out there.

Now correct me if I’m wrong c6zman, but I think what c6zman is trying to say is that pump gas can only support X amount of horse power safely and that numbers closer to 600-650 on pump gas. 750 hp is an alcohol/e85/ethanol.


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[roy_1031]

Nearest E85 station is 71 miles north of where I live. So trust me when I say it won’t run E85. It is on water/meth as well. And I’m trying to think this through, I’m not blindly doing anything. I have been and am continuing to research everything I can think of.

That’s pretty damn far so I completely understand why you won’t run e85.


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[c6zhombre]

71 miles? Thats it? That wouldn't be such a bad relocation....I'm sure the family would understand lol

No seriously, I don't think you'll make 750 on pump gas and have any bit of a reliability factor. Maybe turbo, but not twinscrew/tvs. Thats the bottom line. 650 would be tops. But hey if you're willing to risk it, go for it. See how long it lasts

 

[PNWSVT]

71 miles? Thats it? That wouldn't be such a bad relocation....I'm sure the family would understand lol

No seriously, I don't think you'll make 750 on pump gas and have any bit of a reliability factor. Maybe turbo, but not twinscrew/tvs. Thats the bottom line. 650 would be tops. But hey if you're willing to risk it, go for it. See how long it lasts

Well what are some combos for 650 that are tried and true with reliability on pump. Obviously I want to stay close to the budget but if it can’t happen so be it. How do you like modular head shop and there shortblocks ?

5200 for the set up with the boss block

 

[01yellercobra]

FWIW, my buddy is around 580-590 with a Whipple on his 04. The only time the valve covers have been off the engine was when he had them swapped for a powder coated set. And the blower is pullied for something ridiculously low like 15psi.

For 650 I don't think you need to get crazy really. Maybe bump the compression up to 9:1. I'm not sure I'd even bother with the valve unless the old ones are toast.

 

[Nightmare302]

You don't need stainless valves on the heads. You need a valve job and them decked. The bottom end, can spiral out of control quickly with "While I'm here" mods.

I can tell you I plan out customers builds at about 2/3 a month (My 8-5 has gotten much busier so I do a lot less out of my shop). Out of those 2/3 I get maybe 1 build every 6 months. Why? Because people have no honest idea what it costs to build a car. They see big items for $X.xx and think that's the build.

Can you build a shortblock for 4k with no labor? I don't see why not. But you may want to sit down with someone or talk with someone about what parts to use and where to spend your money so your not just blindly throwing money at it. For instance, the "standard" MMR setups claim 900 or whatever HP but then charge extra for ARP head studs/main studs which you wouldn't be pushing 900 without.

Just do the research twice, talk with the shop that's doing the assembly and double check everything. Then you'll be happy. There are a ton of half done/just done Cobra's that get sold for pennies on the dollar because the owner just threw blind money into crappy stuff and ended up with mix matched parts and poor performance. Don't let that be you!

Best of luck on the build excited to follow the thread!

 

[c6zhombre]

Well what are some combos for 650 that are tried and true with reliability on pump. Obviously I want to stay close to the budget but if it can’t happen so be it. How do you like modular head shop and there shortblocks ?

5200 for the set up with the boss block

I have no opinion on who to use for your rebuild.....as I'm still rocking the factory '04 motor. I would listen to these other members that have experience with that. But I do know bigger isn't always better.....what's paramount for a 900hp race motor build isn't going to be necessary for a 700hp street use build. A lot of the times, it could be detrimental to your intended use.....could make your low and mid range power lazy. To me, it sounds like you want street light to street light fun on readily available pump E10 gas, so you should build accordingly.

Good luck.

 

[papajoewill]

I am basically after similar goals and in the process of getting the motor ready to go to the builder. In the same boat as far as E-85 and interested to see how everything plays forward.

 

[PNWSVT]

I am basically after similar goals and in the process of getting the motor ready to go to the builder. In the same boat as far as E-85 and interested to see how everything plays forward.

Keep me posted. As far As most peoples advice, it has only been “make sure you do your research” not “hey stay away from these rods or these rings or pistons” which is what I have been looking for

 

[PNWSVT]

I’m searching the hell outta this and it generally returns searches from 2008-2013 and tech has changed a lot since then. Maybe someone can pinpoint me to some current builds in progress

 

[01yellercobra]

Keep me posted. As far As most peoples advice, it has only been “make sure you do your research” not “hey stay away from these rods or these rings or pistons” which is what I have been looking for

There's really no point in saying any of that until you know the condition of your engine. There's no need to recommend rods if yours are still good. Same with the pistons and crank. I know you want to plan ahead, but until you know what's actually going on you can't make that plan.

The only advice I can really give is to stay away from Total Seal's gapless rings. I know I had an issue running them as did MalcolmV8. They caused some weird oil consumption issues with my set up.

 

[PNWSVT]

Thank you for that! I know nothing can be determined until it’s apart. But I also don’t want to take it apart again when I can just plan ahead now. I have a guy with a 2.9 VMP who wants the 3.4 for his drag car. Probably going to make that swap for sure

 

[PNWSVT]

As I was 2.3 with a pulley

 

[BlksvtCobra01]

Thank you for that! I know nothing can be determined until it’s apart. But I also don’t want to take it apart again when I can just plan ahead now. I have a guy with a 2.9 VMP who wants the 3.4 for his drag car. Probably going to make that swap for sure

2.9 Whipple? VMP only has the 2.65 and 2.3.


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[PNWSVT]

2.9 Whipple? VMP only has the 2.65 and 2.3.


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Yeah I caught myself. It’s the 2.3 with a 2.9” pulley

 

[BlksvtCobra01]

Yeah I caught myself. It’s the 2.3 with a 2.9” pulley

That is a great street blower.


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[PNWSVT]

Still waiting for someone to want to swap the 3.4 for a single turbo set up lol

 

[03' White Snake]

I just finished my build. 4.6L 0.020" custom diamond pistons, 4V reliefs, hardcoat anodized with moly skirts, stock rods, new kellogg crank, all ARP 2000 hardware everywhere, Had my main and rod bearings calico coated, Cometic head gaskets, all Ford gaskets everywhere else, I cleaned and lapped the valves (already had upgraded exhaust valves from before), custom cams, PAC springs, retainers, Trick Flow adjustable crank gears, Cloyes adjustable intake cam gears, Ford Racing 4V Timing Kit, Changed over my coolant lines to AN fittings (was a few hundred here), did all my own powder coating, Scott rod panels and paint.

As mentioned before, I had the block machined and the short block assembled... was over 3k there. I assembled everything else, degreed the cams ect. Let's just say I have over 12k into the engine alone. That's with me doing all the work.

Add new clutch, flywheel ect onto your build, that's another 1k there. Not sure your fuel system, but plan another 1500-2k there if your just starting.

Everyone always under estimates what it cost to make big power reliably. I already had all the supporting mods, fuel system, big blower ect on my car.

Without E85 or torco mix, it will be very hard to reliably go above 700 and to make it last. Good luck and happy researching. Feel free to PM me if you need more info.

 

[PNWSVT]

Okay I don’t know if my signature isn’t showing up anymore but this is what I have currently

Stock rods
Polished stock crank
DSS Gsx -21cc pistons .20 over (3.573 for .003 clearance)
Comp cam 274s
Steel retainers with behive springs
Ported heads
Leathel Performance full fuel system
3.4 whipple
26spline t56
Level 2 halfshafts hks springs Kenny brown matrix