With the direction Ford is taking IMO I don't think they will go with a motor as big as a 429 in a mustang. Although a new Svo would be interesting as there is a market for it
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What's after Boss 302?
- Thread starter CGoeschel
- Start date
I saw an article where Wiseco used a new 5.0 production block and upped the displacement to 351 relatively easily. Im thinking that they may consider a Boss 351 but not knowing which direction the body style is heading, maybe this is the one and only Boss? Or maybe they ditch the Shelby GT 500 name and have it be the 429 on the new 2014?
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Mustang II - funny - I surely hope the Ford historians wiped that mistake off the history books.
mustang II on the focus frame:nonono:
The NASCAR Mustang came first. The Boss name came for the Boss 302 and was then applied to the Boss 429. The Boss 351 has no racing heritage. Neither car nor the engine was a race homologation.
The Boss 302 was a highly successful package. Widely considered a great Mustang. The Boss 429 was purely to homologate the engine for NASCAR racing. The car itself was dubious. Its worth more money, but it was just not a car to enjoy driving.
Whats next? Probably a Mach 1 with some Boss engine pieces and some high tech luxury.
The real question is what happens with the 2014 comes out with no V8 option? Buy em while you can get em.
You've seen an original Boss 9 haven't you? That engine didn't fit in a Mustang either.
There were lots of reasons that the Boss 351 wasn't a homologation effort, but to say it has no racing heritage is almost blasphemous.
There was no need for it to be approved for racing because it didn't fit in any of the classes. It was too big for Trans Am's 5 liter limit and NASCAR was still running big blocks when it came out. It was also nothing more than a marketing package on a 351 Cleveland, which had been in production for 2 years already and had been installed in thousands of cars by then.
The Boss 351 has been raced as the 351C for over 40 years in everything from Pro Stock dragsters to Winston Cup cars to 4x4 trucks. The current NASCAR engines are closer to a Cleveland than anything else Ford has mass produced. There is more racing heritage with the 351C than any other Ford engine bar none. Nothing else even comes close. Just because it didn't need a back lot production of cars to make it legal doesn't mean it doesn't have any heritage.
Ford engineers already said they swapped in a 6.2 sohc which is about same size as the old cammer. Don Bowles had that new stang w the 777 engine which was a modified 6.2L. Big deal imo is to make a alum 6.2 block, lot lighter. we see how well the 2011 gt500 is doing compared to a 2010 gt500.
Something along these lines. I can't remember the specifics so I may be wrong, but I remember reading somewhere about the new 5.0 building process being similar to the modular familiy, as the 5.0 in ways is similar to the 4.6, and a 5.8 would be similar to a 5.4. Something about the deck height and bore sizes I think. Anyway a 5.8 would be interchangeable the way the 4.6 and the 5.4 are. Very similar with major differences being a bigger block and different crank. Thinking about a Coyote engine with 46 additional cubic inches and a revised top end could easily make 500 to the crank in n/a form, probably 500+ to the wheels in modified form via bolt ons and a tune. Fords answer to the LS7 basically. Match that up with a lighter new platform in the 3300lb range and you have a car that will beat the piss out of a 2011 GT500 and chase down the current ZO6(chase down not beat).
You know your stuff.
The Cammer was really an unnamed boss.
Too bad Ford never raced it in NASCAR.
Lousy Drag motor, However Pete Robinson (RIP) made a drive gear system for the cammer. The six foot timing chain would retard a bank forget which one) by a few degrees at high RPM. Not good..
Big blocks are history considering how tunable small blocks are these days and the weight advantage.
Jeff
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That's really a stretch considering the man the Boss was named for didn't start working at Ford for several years after the 427 SOHC was developed. Boss was also a title for a complete option package (for lack of a better term) on a car, not just the engine. There was never any plan for a complete option package including the Cammer, it was just an engine.[/quote]
Both cams retarded with rpm, but IIRC the right was about twice as bad as the left. You had to decide what rpm you wanted it to run good at and set the cams up accordingly. Definitely not a very desirable tuning feature.
[quote}Big blocks are history considering how tunable small blocks are these days and the weight advantage.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. We've got small blocks cranking out power old school big blocks could only dream about and getting 30 mpg in the process. Enjoy them while you can because they won't be around for much longer. The misguided treehuggers are winning the battle to rid the planet of too many things that really have no real impact on the environment and factory hot rods are one of them.
Question is, what will ford offer to compete with the Camaro Z28 with the 556 hp LS? from the CTSV?
I hope not, Ill have mine paid off by then and I'm crossing my fingers for a 2014 5.0 with IRS.
I think the v8 is secure in the mustang. 2014 is supposed to have a different chasis, supposedly a few 100lbs lighter and over all smaller than the S197 platform. A 5.0 coyote with DI, 300lbs lighter and maybe better aero=better MPG. I anticipate the 2014 will have all that with the IRS.
If your prediction is correct ford will have my money again. lol Id love to have a smaller lighter 400+hp mustang. I kinda hope they take some of the styling cues from the early sn95 chassis.
I would like to think that's the case, but with the CAFE number for cars hitting almost 38 mpg by 2016 they are going to need more help than weight and aero, which are benefits that won't always be seen. Weight won't do much for highway numbers and aero won't do much for the city driving. They are also forcing CO2 numbers now, which is a direct function of how much fuel you are using, so they will have to be even more careful with the emissions as well. Better engine efficiency with current technology means fewer moving parts, and fewer moving parts means fewer cylinders. I will be happy to see the V8 stick around, but I am not optimistic. If they cancelled the Mustang tomorrow they would be a lot closer to hitting the new CAFE mark without touching anything else, but it would piss off a lot of people.
This is all nothing but a political agenda anyway. The greenies want the V8 and performance cars gone and they are specifically targeting them. If they were really concerned about mileage and the environment they would just lower the speed limit back to 55mph and the problem would be solved. They aren't concerned about either, they just want to take away our toys and that is what they are doing.
That just means they will have to sell more V6 models, Fiestaa and FOci. The 5.0 is not going anywhere. Ford didn't spend all of that money developing the motor to only use it for a few years.
Also, High hp cars are here to stay. They will just get more expensive to offset fines/taxes assesed for vehicles not meeting MPG targets.
Also, High hp cars are here to stay. They will just get more expensive to offset fines/taxes assesed for vehicles not meeting MPG targets.
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