What blower to crack 800 rwhp?

[blackvette101]

Hey guys I currently have a gen1 TVS w/ 2.4 upper and 15% lower. I have maxed my set up out at 742 rwhp @ 20 psi on 103 unleaded. The only thing left I could do is internal engine work. I was going to throw the new kenne bell intercooler on there but i'm thinking that if I already have the blower off the car I should change it out and go for 800 rwhp. I'd prefer a 2.9 whipple or 2.8 KB but i'm not sure if they can hit that number. What blower do you guys recommend.

edit: i'd prefer to keep the boost pressure around what I have now +/- 2-3 pounds.

basic mod list is
ARH 2'' headers w/ dual 3'' exhaust no mufflers
JLT 155mm intake w/ whipple twin 75mm throttle body
Shelby competition heat exchanger with two supercharger coolant tanks

 

[VNMOUS1]

Please read Editor Turner's in depth article on the home page of svtperformance.com

 

[GT500RedStripe]

Kenne Bell has lots of options.

 

[07 Black Beauty]

@ that power level it would be a good idea to build the motor. I would build the motor and add some cams, that should get you to 800 rwhp and drop your boost some.

 

[1320 Junkie]

Build the motor first as suggested above....other wise your playing with fire on stock rods and hardware at that boost level. If u want to keep the boost at 19/20psi on stock rods porting your Gen 1 will yield great results....or just buy the Gen2 VMP if they are your source for blower supply. Too many options to list honestly.

 

[blackvette101]

Build the motor first as suggested above....other wise your playing with fire on stock rods and hardware at that boost level. If u want to keep the boost at 19/20psi on stock rods porting your Gen 1 will yield great results....or just buy the Gen2 VMP if they are your source for blower supply. Too many options to list honestly.

The stock bottom end doesn't concern me too much the car will probably see 4-6 highway pulls a year. I've had the TVS since january and it has only seen 2 pulls. I'm planning on replacing it once it lets go.

Please read Editor Turner's in depth article on the home page of svtperformance.com

I saw the article BJ but it seems on race gas (116 too not 103) in a 5.8 liter (don't they have better flowing heads/cams) it made 783 rwhp so I am not sure i'd even be able to replicate the power of that setup and if i did it still would be alittle short of the number im trying to see to justify the cost over my GEN1. I am already at 742 so i'm concerned of buying a new blower and not being able to crack 800 if a 5.8 isn't doing it on unleaded. I can not use E85 as my car sits too long between driving. I'd possibly be open to a gen2 TVS with porting but then i'm up at whipple/KB prices.

So i guess my question for the forum is what blower will crack 800 at around this boost level.

Kenne Bell has lots of options.

But which would be best for 800 at around 20 psi? 2.8? 3.6?

 

[brandonflood123]

Build the motor first as suggested above....other wise your playing with fire on stock rods and hardware at that boost level. If u want to keep the boost at 19/20psi on stock rods porting your Gen 1 will yield great results....or just buy the Gen2 VMP if they are your source for blower supply. Too many options to list honestly.

dont mean to thread jack, but jay do you know if my stock rods will be alright with the set up im going to be running? 2.9l with 3" pullie, id725's, BAP, 93 octane, kooks long tubes with off road x pipe, jlt 127mm, twin 65mm tb. stock lower. i know alot of it has to do with the tune aswell. im hoping for 720-750 to the tires. thats the plans i have so far as far as the motor mods go. and i know i will need a new clutch too

 

[VNMOUS1]

The stock bottom end doesn't concern me too much the car will probably see 4-6 highway pulls a year. I've had the TVS since january and it has only seen 2 pulls. I'm planning on replacing it once it lets go.



I saw the article BJ but it seems on race gas (116 too not 103) in a 5.8 liter (don't they have better flowing heads/cams) it made 783 rwhp so I am not sure i'd even be able to replicate the power of that setup and if i did it still would be alittle short of the number im trying to see to justify the cost over my GEN1. I am already at 742 so i'm concerned of buying a new blower and not being able to crack 800 if a 5.8 isn't doing it on unleaded. I can not use E85 as my car sits too long between driving. I'd possibly be open to a gen2 TVS with porting but then i'm up at whipple/KB prices.

So i guess my question for the forum is what blower will crack 800 at around this boost level.



But which would be best for 800 at around 20 psi? 2.8? 3.6?

Your call, as only you know what you're trying to do for x bucks. Btw, you can't port GEN II. There isn't enough metal to do it.

bj

 

[blackvette101]

Your call, as only you know what you're trying to do for x bucks. Btw, you can't port GEN II. There isn't enough metal to do it.

bj

Have you guys done a gen2 on a 5.4 with 2.4 upper/15% lower with race gas.

 

[Van@RevanRacing]

But which would be best for 800 at around 20 psi? 2.8? 3.6?

The 2.8 kits are currently on sale as a complete system for 25% Off.

The only way you'll make 800 RWHP is with race gas or E-85 which will require a fuel system.

The 3.6 will make 30 to 40 additional RWHP over the 2.8 KB due to the reduction in engine parasitic drag.

 

[1320 Junkie]

dont mean to thread jack, but jay do you know if my stock rods will be alright with the set up im going to be running? 2.9l with 3" pullie, id725's, BAP, 93 octane, kooks long tubes with off road x pipe, jlt 127mm, twin 65mm tb. stock lower. i know alot of it has to do with the tune aswell. im hoping for 720-750 to the tires. thats the plans i have so far as far as the motor mods go. and i know i will need a new clutch too

750 is a good goal on stock rods. I wouldn't go much past that unless building a motor is a ultimate goal anyways. If your ok with pushing the limits...sky or rods are the limit

 

[brandonflood123]

750 is a good goal on stock rods. I wouldn't go much past that unless building a motor is a ultimate goal anyways. If your ok with pushing the limits...sky or rods are the limit

a
hah do you think that 750 range +/- a few is doable with the set up im going with? i would really like to eventually build the motor but that will be a ways away haha.

 

[VNMOUS1]

Have you guys done a gen2 on a 5.4 with 2.4 upper/15% lower with race gas.

No, but on a little Torco mine did 747/744. It's in Steve Turner's first article. My 2007 with 51k on the clock.

 

[1320 Junkie]

a
hah do you think that 750 range +/- a few is doable with the set up im going with? i would really like to eventually build the motor but that will be a ways away haha.

Most likely the 2.9 will need 20psi to hit that goal but its definately achievable with supporting hardware no doubt....timing will likely need to be a tad aggressive also.

 

[brandonflood123]

Most likely the 2.9 will need 20psi to hit that goal but its definately achievable with supporting hardware no doubt....timing will likely need to be a tad aggressive also.

so i might need like a 10% lower, maybe start keeping torco around lol. i dont want to get crazy with timing i was thinking around maybe 17* but thats all with the tuner.

 

[19COBRA93]

I made 824rwh with my 2.9L, but that was on 100 octane and 23lbs. Just about any of the aftermarket blowers will do it, depending on supporting mods, and how hard you spin them. I'd seriously look into the VMP gen II, or a fully modded BPS TVS. You can't beat the torque from those things.

 

[NickSezz]

You can add our Super Stock Cams to your current set up and hit 800+

You will make more power on less boost which is a safer and more efficient way to make power.

Just a suggestion.

 

[CodyK7]

Can I ask why the need to hit 800rwhp. Is it is just to hit that mark? Seems like alot of expense for 60rwhp.

 

[Nsssane1]

I have a heck of a deal in the for sale section, Whipple 2.9 only 800 miles never been on dyno or to track. Its like new.

 

[Bad Company]

You can add our Super Stock Cams to your current set up and hit 800+

You will make more power on less boost which is a safer and more efficient way to make power.

Just a suggestion.

I really feel like this is a loaded answer at these Hp levels.

I've thought about this quite a bit and yes it lowers boost pressures entering the engine. But it doesn't make it easier on the engine to build the Hp when cams are installed. In fact I think it increases cylinder pressures to levels that become dangerous at lower boost levels when Hp goes above 785RWHP. To increase Hp by 100RWHP you are effectively getting more air into the engine with less boost. This means that you are filling the cylinder more efficiently with the cam upgrade. This is showing up with a lower boost pressure, why? Because you lowered the restriction in the the intake manifold due to the valve events during the intake and exhaust stroke, so the engine is filling the cylinder with more air at lower boost pressure and exhausting the extra gases easier. The dyno results prove this.

Cylinder pressures in the engine is what is breaking the rods. Thrust loads and angles, along with RPM and piston speeds also play into this equation. But Hp increases are a direct result of higher cylinder pressures during the power stroke. The advantage of the aftermarket cams is both in filling the cylinder more efficiently and getting rid of more of the spent gases, which in-turn reduces boost. Lower boost reduces Intake Air Temperatures. Lower IAT reduce the chance of detonation. This is the advantage of the cams, but don't tell people it is a safer way to build Hp above the threshold of the rods and that it is easier on the engine. It isn't any easier and it will break a rod due to cylinder pressures as easily as a bigger blower will. The other advantage in the cams is in reducing boost this also reduces the parasitic Hp needs to turn the smaller blower at faster RPM to fill the cylinder, why? Because the blower doesn't require quite as much HP to move the same CFM of air at the same blower speed at the lower boost pressures after a cam installation. But the other big factor is everybody thinks........WOW!!! I'm now down 2-3 psi of boost, so I can put a smaller pulley on and get even more power from the set up. They never think about cylinder pressures, they are constantly told and sold on the limits of these stock engines is the Hp output versus the boost pressure. Keep the boost low, keep the RPM under 6250, keep the power at 780 or less and nothing will break. But here you're telling him to go 830-840RWHP, his boost will be lowered by 2-3 psi and it will be safe for him to do. It might be for a few good passes, but if this guy likes to stand on it a lot and uses pump gas at anytime, I can see, hear, and smell the bang that will be forthcoming. His use of 103 octane at these power levels won't stop a rod from breaking either.

Stop selling 18 psi of boost on pump gas is safe. Stop selling 20 psi on 103 octane is safe. Start thinking of the engine as a complete package and what its producing Hp wise. I have a theory and I'm going to try to test it in the future. What I want to do is see if I can build 800RWHP on 15 psi or less on 93 octane, but it will be a built engine with a stout set of rods to handle it. Now is my 15 psi 800 hp engine safe at 15 psi on 93 octane? Would you tell someone that they could change the pulley size for more power and still be safe. If I told you I was going to do this with stock rods, would you tell me to change the pulley to increase Hp and that the engine would be safe at 18 psi, regardless of the Hp output? This is basically what you just told this gentleman