Question On Black Ice For People That Live IN Those Funny Cold Places.

[oldmodman]

I was having a conversation with a friend that like me has never drive onto black ice.

Regarding chains and tire choices. What would give you the best chance of keeping control if you do not have any experience?

Snow tires.
Snow tires with studs.
Mud and snow tires with chains one the rear wheels only (four wheel drive vehicle)
Mud and snow tires with the chains on the front. (four wheel drive vehicle)
Mud and snow tires with chains on all four wheels. Thin cable chains on the front due to clearance with fender, regular chains on the rear. (four wheel drive vehicle)

I voted for studded snow tires and my friend likes the idea of four wheels all chained up. And this is assuming a top speed of 25 mph.

Also assume that this is somewhere there is plenty of snow for the season so the studs won't be on dry pavement and the chains can be left on the entire season too.

 

[DAVESVT2000]

Four studded snows left on all season long.

Not sure chains would be legal to be left on all season.

 

[Screw-Rice]

I was having a conversation with a friend that like me has never drive onto black ice.

Regarding chains and tire choices. What would give you the best chance of keeping control if you do not have any experience?

Snow tires.
Snow tires with studs.
Mud and snow tires with chains one the rear wheels only (four wheel drive vehicle)
Mud and snow tires with the chains on the front. (four wheel drive vehicle)
Mud and snow tires with chains on all four wheels. Thin cable chains on the front due to clearance with fender, regular chains on the rear. (four wheel drive vehicle)

I voted for studded snow tires and my friend likes the idea of four wheels all chained up. And this is assuming a top speed of 25 mph.

Also assume that this is somewhere there is plenty of snow for the season so the studs won't be on dry pavement and the chains can be left on the entire season too.

Having dealt with black ice my whole life and work in the worst possible conditions, you really don't need to go overboard.
Goodyear Triple Treads work great, and only second to Blizzaks.
Studded tires are beneficial and the most extreme I would go, unless I had to drive mountain passes, in which case I may chain the drive wheels only.

 

[Corbic]

Depends on where you live and what the local laws are.

Studs and chains may not be legal. Studs and chains may also be required by law!

For cars you can't go wrong with Blizzarks. They are cheap and make you feel like it's a dry summer.

Get them on a set of winter rims. You don't want to use them when it's over 30 degrees or dry. You'll chew up the fine fingers very quickly and lose a lot of the great traction.

For trucks, I've been impressed with my Good Year Duratracs. First two winters felt like dedicated snow tires. I run them all year so they have 50k and are getting to their last year of use. Last winter was "meh", better then a touring tire.

I want some 17's so maybe I'll get BFGs next summer and use my 16's for a dedicated snow tire.

 

[Lambeau]

These are the best, but you don't have them listed: Bridgestone Blizzak, Michelin X-Ice, or similar winter performance tire.
I know guys that run Blizzaks, and say they are the greatest on ice - period.

I guess to clarify here Drew, these tires are very soft/sticky tires - a very low durometer. They only last ~20K miles. You put them on at the very last minute before the first snowfall. As soon as it warms-up in the spring, get 'em off.

Now that I think about it, not sure what LEO's run. Maybe one of them will chime in.

 

[NC85]

http://youtu.be/efiW2K8gASM

 

[Deceptive]

Specific tires are going to be a band aid.

Understanding how to drive in poor weather will out perform winter specific tires.


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[01cobravortech]

Black ice is rare buddy. I mean the past few years we're seeing 30F-20F temps in NJ and even black ice is rare in our environment. You don't have to go over the top with tires, chains, etc. Its one of those weather anomalies that is more climate dependent than anything. Its kind of like responding to a flash flood, or those dummies doing one of those Pokemon, Blacks Lives Something rallies. Its so sudden and unexpected, that you have a limited response to it that's practical, really.

 

[Robert Francis]

As above, in the respect your best success of driving on "black ice" is that you have to be aware that it may be present - and slow down.

 

[M91196]

We call it black ice because it's on a "bare" road so you don't expect it.
That's why it kicks your ass, your driving like it's not icy. Other than that it's all the same ice and it sucks. See above for good winter recommendations.
YMMV.

 

[HudsonFalcon]

+1 on the Blizzak's. My wifes Jeep has them on all 4 corners and they work great even on the very steep dirt road we live on.

 

[Bronze123]

Been selling tires to cops for years. My current pd department has three vehicles. Tahoes they run Goodyear ultra grip winter tires all year. Mostly cause they are rwd only. The ford explorers run Goodyear rsa. And the chargers run the rsa as well. Both explorer and chargers are awd. They get roughly 20-30k out of a set. All tires have a high speed rating of a v I believe.

I love my winter tires I have had in the past, such as michelins and bridgestones. I been trying something new for almost a year, and I like it. Toyo Celsius, it's an all season but it's designed to do better in winter conditions. And it does great in winter and very little road noise. I leave them on all year and don't need to swap them out

 

[Dusten]

We call it black ice because it's on a "bare" road so you don't expect it.
That's why it kicks your ass, your driving like it's not icy. Other than that it's all the same ice and it sucks. See above for good winter recommendations.
YMMV.

This is why chains don't work. Its rare you know you're on it, until its to late. And most places don't allow chains unless there is actual reason for them.

 

[cbj5259]

Honestly there really isn't a tire (short of metal studs) which is worth a damn on ice. The best way to approach any standing water spots on the road that have frozen over into a "black ice" patch is to lay off the accelerator and brakes and coast through it. If all four wheels are on ice, braking or accelerating will do nothing but send you into a spin. Simply coasting is your best option. Keep ample distance between your vehicle and the one in front of you if you are driving on roads with icy patches and do your braking early before you get into a turn. As was mentioned earlier it's more important how you drive on ice than what kind of equipment you are using.

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[L8APEX]

The only real world setup is knowledge and practice and prepardness. You're most likely to catch black ice on a road that had been plowed and cleared but the snow was able to melt in the day and cover the roadway and refreeze at night. Use light imput on the wheel and all controls. "Quickly" Ease into the clutch too, don't just punch it if your running a manual. The inertia can throw off your cars balance and quickly send you into a skid.

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[CobraBob]

My wife uses Blizzaks and loves them. Me, too. Black ice is not really a huge issue up here unless you are using excessive speed based on road conditions. When a black ice warning is issued, we always reduce our driving speeds. Black ice conditions don't usually doesn't last that long because the local towns do a good job laying down sand or ice-melt where black is present, especially at intersections and spots where vehicles have to stop. 9 times out of 10 an accident on black ice is a result of excessive speed and carelessness on the part of the driver.

 

[kirks5oh]

Honestly there really isn't a tire (short of metal studs) which is worth a damn on ice. The best way to approach any standing water spots on the road that have frozen over into a "black ice" patch is to lay off the accelerator and brakes and coast through it. If all four wheels are on ice, braking or accelerating will do nothing but send you into a spin. Simply coasting is your best option. Keep ample distance between your vehicle and the one in front of you if you are driving on roads with icy patches and do your braking early before you get into a turn. As was mentioned earlier it's more important how you drive on ice than what kind of equipment you are using.

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This. Most of the time in the winter, when going under an overpass I will take my foot off the gas and simply coast. That's where I've found most black ice. Other than that, I run blizzaks on my gtr in the winter and they are great.

 

[Drive XR7]

+1 on Blizzaks. They are the best out there.

Studs are illegal where I live because they tear up the roadway. Might be legal in Canada or Buffalo though.

 

[Coiled03]

Blizzaks, and minimize any inputs to the vehicle; gas, steering, or brakes.

 

[DHG1078]

I agree with most of the above. Studs are the only thing that will prevent you from losing control, but are illegal on most roadways. You have to live in a pretty extreme environment for them to be allowed as they destroy roads. When studs are allowed, you likely aren't driving directly on a roadway anyways. There is probably a bit of snow under you.

A good winter tire helps a great deal, but as stated your driving habits are going to matter the most. Once you lose traction, there is no regaining it regardless of tire selection. Best thing to do is drive defensively, and try to avoid areas that are likely to develop black ice whenever possible.