No it won't not unless they drop 2 cylinders!
Motor Trend H2H: Z/28 vs. GT350R
- Thread starter DSG2003SVT
- Start date
No it won't not unless they drop 2 cylinders!
That should tell you something. They value the 350 more than the z06.
One key thing to remember, I don't think GM has a single thing in the works to compete NA to NA with the Voodoo. The next ZL1 will probably beat the R, but it will have an LT4. The Z06 has the LT4 in a better, lighter body than what the ZL1 will have. R&T still said the R was a better and more enjoyable car than the Z06. There will not be another high powered NA GM motor because they're moving away from that. So, I think the Z/28, at least the gen 5 concept of it, is dying with the 2015.
At some point, we should stop magazine racing, and buy what's the most fun. Who here can take ANY car to its limits? I want what makes me the happiest when I'm driving it. I love high RPM, high powered, NA engines like the Voodoo and LS7. I'd buy a Z/28 before I'd buy a new ZL1 with the LT4 for that reason alone. I don't care if the new car will be faster, it's not what I like the best. If you like FI better, or power is all that matters, or you want to talk about track times you'll never duplicate, then wait and buy the LT4 car.
The new ZL1 will not be lighter than a GT350R. The R with electronics and 16 gallons of fuel weighs 3,703-3,714lbs. (depending on which magazine did the weighing). The base 1SS weighs 3,665lbs. with 16 gallons of fuel. Take that base 1SS, add heavier wheels and tires, 6-piston front brakes, MRC suspension, and, most importantly, a blower and all its supporting hardware. It's not going to gain less than 49lbs. from all that. The base C7 Z06 gained 226lbs. over the base regular C7 from similar changes (3,298lbs. vs. 3,524lbs.).
At some point, we should stop magazine racing, and buy what's the most fun. Who here can take ANY car to its limits? I want what makes me the happiest when I'm driving it. I love high RPM, high powered, NA engines like the Voodoo and LS7. I'd buy a Z/28 before I'd buy a new ZL1 with the LT4 for that reason alone. I don't care if the new car will be faster, it's not what I like the best. If you like FI better, or power is all that matters, or you want to talk about track times you'll never duplicate, then wait and buy the LT4 car.
The new ZL1 will not be lighter than a GT350R. The R with electronics and 16 gallons of fuel weighs 3,703-3,714lbs. (depending on which magazine did the weighing). The base 1SS weighs 3,665lbs. with 16 gallons of fuel. Take that base 1SS, add heavier wheels and tires, 6-piston front brakes, MRC suspension, and, most importantly, a blower and all its supporting hardware. It's not going to gain less than 49lbs. from all that. The base C7 Z06 gained 226lbs. over the base regular C7 from similar changes (3,298lbs. vs. 3,524lbs.).
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Badass cars.
This comment is irrelevant in the here and now, there is no point in comparing prices from 2 years ago. In 11/2015 the Z28 is 55K and GT350 is 65K+ ish (in my area, where I was shopping ) and the unobtainable GT350R is 80k+?? ( you cant actually buy one ) Of course as time moves forward things will change.
i dont know why the chevy boys are over here crying about the R.it will not be a failure like the z28 is price wise.you guys wanna cry about a 350 R that beat an old gen5 CRAPMARO.well when the BOSS 302 was at the end of its cycle the z28 came out and did its thing,now that the roles have changed you guys wanna cry about it.then a fool brought up a z06.why i dont know.that car is JUNK.blown motors,over heats real quick,and couldnt do 5 laps to save its own life.thats Garbage Motors at its finest.:nonono:
If I wanted the 350 it would have to be the R and I doubt I would find one nor shell out the extra money for one.
Ford should build as many R's as people want imo.
I still think that the z28 at 55k is a great deal.
Ford should build as many R's as people want imo.
I still think that the z28 at 55k is a great deal.
Everything is great about the R, except the "constrained" supply.
At the end of the run, you'll be able to get them, once the new GT500 is announced and Ford's hype machine get's up to speed on those.
At the end of the run, you'll be able to get them, once the new GT500 is announced and Ford's hype machine get's up to speed on those.
That's both a blessing and a curse. The people that do manage to get them will have a car that maintains value and appreciates more quickly. I could definitely see the GT350R going for above MSRP used.
so show me a list of these car's you have that appreciate 5 years down the road. the only one I can think of is the ford GT and even it dipped bad during the economy slowdown. I looked at one for $150k in 2010 but was still too much for my white trash budget
if they build 1000 of these cars over two years it will help resale for sure but make the car appreciate??? I have to see that.
I didn't say immediately, I just mean more quickly. However, if someone does sell one while they're still hot, I really could see them going for over MSRP similar to the 911 GT3. Sometimes, cars don't appreciate on paper, but if they're hard to get while still in high demand, they'll still sell for more than they're actually worth.
Nailed it!
Great video! Norton and I knew that the 350R would win a head-to-head after talking with Randy Pobst at the Colorado Mile, he didn't expressly say so but he was absolutely gushing about the R. We kept our mouths shut about his comments until the video came out.
GM fans trying to justify their purchases makes for interesting banter. The Z28 at a deep discount is a good value, but there's a reason it's discounted so deeply. In the end MSRP for MSRP the 350R is a SUPERIOR vehicle and a VASTLY SUPERIOR VALUE. People understand this and that's why demand is high and why there are ADMs. Had I wanted a 350R I could have called the dealership in VA who I bought my '14 GT500 through and they would have gotten me one for MSRP. So the ADM thing is different based upon the dealer, I've bought from them before so they will make me a priority.
Bottom line, the Z28 might be fun to drive but it's obsolete. Heavy, outdated chassis, terrible interior, terrible visibility. It's worse in every performance metric and is much more expensive. OBSOLETE.
GM fans trying to justify their purchases makes for interesting banter. The Z28 at a deep discount is a good value, but there's a reason it's discounted so deeply. In the end MSRP for MSRP the 350R is a SUPERIOR vehicle and a VASTLY SUPERIOR VALUE. People understand this and that's why demand is high and why there are ADMs. Had I wanted a 350R I could have called the dealership in VA who I bought my '14 GT500 through and they would have gotten me one for MSRP. So the ADM thing is different based upon the dealer, I've bought from them before so they will make me a priority.
Bottom line, the Z28 might be fun to drive but it's obsolete. Heavy, outdated chassis, terrible interior, terrible visibility. It's worse in every performance metric and is much more expensive. OBSOLETE.
http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/chuckwalla-valley-raceway
Pobst fast lap time with GT350, non-R
Pobst fast lap time with GT350, non-R
That's not Ford's fault. Blame the greedy dealers.
Not if dealers keep pricing them out of reach! I desperately want a GT350R, but at an $85K+ buy-in, I think I'd spend my money elsewhere. That price opens up a whole new realm of vehicles to choose from; vehicles with more tangible assets.
Anybody who can make a car understeer, oversteer or four-wheel drift can take a car to and beyond its limits. Why do people think taking a car to its limits is some mystical ability that only professional race car drivers possess? They're mortal men (and women) just like the rest of us. They've just developed the nerve needed to consistently push a car within its limits to garner the best times on a track. Some street drivers have more nerve than others and can indeed [safely] push a car to its limits on the road. I've always argued that it's actually easier pushing a car to its limits on a track than on the road because of the fact that you have the entire [wider] width of the road at your disposal and there's no risk of any traffic coming in the opposite direction. I suspect the pucker factor is much higher on bumpy, twisty mountain roads where most corners are blind corners with the risk of a ricer or Harley rider cutting across into your lane in the opposite direction, not to mention sand or water in a turn and you still have to keep it in your lane. Oh, and cops, too! It's actually probably more relaxing just to be on a closed road course. haha
Some thoughts on where this is going
Just some comments:
Z28 justly was blasted for it's interior and that you just can't see out of the darn cave in the MT Head to head.
New Alpha platform continues with the same poor visibility, I hope visibility is slightly better, those Chevys are unsafe., INTERIOR SUPPOSELY BETTER.
Alpha with LT$ is going to be really quick, but will it be a nice happy car?
Hope 526 HP is not near the limit for the NA 5.2?
Ford needs to use some more Aluminum and Carbon fiber in the top end stuff to get the weight out. Weight reduction will do a lot to make it quickest on the track.
Note:
Voodoo motor parts are available thru Ford Racing.
I suspect the next GT500 will be a blown version of the 5.2. I hope it is a big axial screw compressor & not the tiny TVS 1900.
Heck, maybe a set of turbos makes sense at the current state of technology. ( I'd miss the torque.)
7 Speed MT would be sweet. 10 Speed Auto would make a Good GT type of power tourer.
Ford should offer a new Aluminator engine based on the 5.2 block and heads as a competed engine. No need for a Flat Plane crank in the GT500, just make it really beefy and well balanced for the power adders.
I can see the Hellcat going down off HP thrown. ( I still like MOPAR)
Big displacement is a thing of the past. (Bo-ho,- I like dinosaurs, being one myself.)
Just some comments:
Z28 justly was blasted for it's interior and that you just can't see out of the darn cave in the MT Head to head.
New Alpha platform continues with the same poor visibility, I hope visibility is slightly better, those Chevys are unsafe., INTERIOR SUPPOSELY BETTER.
Alpha with LT$ is going to be really quick, but will it be a nice happy car?
Hope 526 HP is not near the limit for the NA 5.2?
Ford needs to use some more Aluminum and Carbon fiber in the top end stuff to get the weight out. Weight reduction will do a lot to make it quickest on the track.
Note:
Voodoo motor parts are available thru Ford Racing.
I suspect the next GT500 will be a blown version of the 5.2. I hope it is a big axial screw compressor & not the tiny TVS 1900.
Heck, maybe a set of turbos makes sense at the current state of technology. ( I'd miss the torque.)
7 Speed MT would be sweet. 10 Speed Auto would make a Good GT type of power tourer.
Ford should offer a new Aluminator engine based on the 5.2 block and heads as a competed engine. No need for a Flat Plane crank in the GT500, just make it really beefy and well balanced for the power adders.
I can see the Hellcat going down off HP thrown. ( I still like MOPAR)
Big displacement is a thing of the past. (Bo-ho,- I like dinosaurs, being one myself.)
Stop rambling and babbling. We heard the no replacement for displacement crap for years. The terminators shet that up. Then gm fan boys howled for a blown Camaro. They got their beloved ZL1. Then when they saw it was a turd on the drag strip, gm fan boys turned into euro handling mullet headed fans. They did not talk about handling with the F body. Ford now has drag racing and handling cornered. AND all you can throw out is some plastic Euro poser. Classic.
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Any opinion on how the gt350 would do against the z28? Very curious. Price wise right now those 2 seem pretty comparable.
From what I have heard the trofeo tires on the z28 are significantly faster than the cup 2 on the R. A couple test have the Trofeo running 1-2 sec faster per on the same car in a couple different test.
Now the mpss on the GT350 will be slower that the cup 2. On the same tire that 3 second gap could become one second or less with the GT350TP vs the Z28.
Now the mpss on the GT350 will be slower that the cup 2. On the same tire that 3 second gap could become one second or less with the GT350TP vs the Z28.
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