Limit of ID 1000 /BAP KB stock pump

[BenV8]

Hi guys, in 2 weeks I'M going on the dyno to tune my new short block setup. I wish to to run around 675-700 rwhp with the 3.33 pulley, But my tuner think at 15lbs of boost if I shift at 7300 rpm I will miss fuel. I have ID 1000 with dual stage BAP KB abnd stock pump. I want to run with pump gas.

I would like your opinion about that. What do you think about that ?

PS. for my set-up see my signature

many thanks

 

[BenV8]

22 views and no answers? do you think my tuner have reason?

 

[gimmie11s]

Pump gas would be fine at that power level (been there.. had plenty of fuel).

e85, no bueno. would need full return style system.

 

[stang910]

I ran that exact setup and it needed more fuel. I probably could have ran it like that since it never went dangerously lean and I could always command shifts earlier, but your asking for trouble trying to stretch fuel like that. Get you a return fuel system or run less boost so you don't melt a piston in a few months.

 

[BenV8]

I ran that exact setup and it needed more fuel. I probably could have ran it like that since it never went dangerously lean and I could always command shifts earlier, but your asking for trouble trying to stretch fuel like that. Get you a return fuel system or run less boost so you don't melt a piston in a few months.

which Rpm do you shift ?

 

[BenV8]

Other opinion?

 

[stang910]

which Rpm do you shift ?

If I remember right around 6800 rpm it was starting to compensate for not enough fuel pump and around 7200 it was starting to drift away from commanded lambda of .78.

 

[BenV8]

I always thought that with this gas set up we could make it to 850 rwhp easily

 

[MRSUPRA]

/\That's what I was thinking. I've seen at least one other person push 800rwhp+ with just a BAP and good injectors.

 

[BenV8]

So, what fuel set up do you running with your paxton guys ?

 

[Zemedici]

how hard are you wanting to lean on it on pump gas? I'd go return at this point and be able to turn the boost wayyyyyy up.

 

[BenV8]

I want to run 15 lbs of boost but my tuner think I begin lean at 7100 rpm but I 'm not sure about that

 

[BenV8]

why at each time I ask questions on this forum I need to be insistent to have answers? It is because I'm french canadian? I respect you a lot and I do my best for speak in english....it is disapointing!!

 

[stang910]

I always thought that with this gas set up we could make it to 850 rwhp easily

Easily? To me that means your only using 80% of what your fuel system is capable of which would put a stock fuel pump with a BAP 1000rwhp capable.

850rwhp is doable with the stock pump and BAP, but it's how the car is setup which makes it possible. To hit that number you have to start out with a manual car. Octane and type of fuel being used plays a huge part how much you can make. Most pump gas has a stoich of 14.1 so switching to a fuel that has a stoich of 14.7 will get you a 4% higher ceiling. Also with that amount boost on 93 octane your probably looking at around 12* of timing and with a race fuel you can probably get away with around 20-22* of timing. 10* of timing is huge!

Type of power adder will play a huge role as well. At 15psi a centri is probably taking about 80rwhp to turn while a good turbo setup will see those gains. Lastly these big HP cars with the stock fuel pump and BAP, if AFR was recorded most of the time you'll see it going lean at the top of the pull. Ok for a dyno pull, but not what you want to go down the track. A generous dyno will help with those numbers also. So if you factor in all these "tricks" to get a huge dyno number you can see how it's possible.

 

[stang910]

I also forgot to mention the cars trying to get big HP numbers on a stock fuel pump are using a JMS 21v BAP and not a 17v KB BAP.

 

[BenV8]

Easily? To me that means your only using 80% of what your fuel system is capable of which would put a stock fuel pump with a BAP 1000rwhp capable.

850rwhp is doable with the stock pump and BAP, but it's how the car is setup which makes it possible. To hit that number you have to start out with a manual car. Octane and type of fuel being used plays a huge part how much you can make. Most pump gas has a stoich of 14.1 so switching to a fuel that has a stoich of 14.7 will get you a 4% higher ceiling. Also with that amount boost on 93 octane your probably looking at around 12* of timing and with a race fuel you can probably get away with around 20-22* of timing. 10* of timing is huge!

Type of power adder will play a huge role as well. At 15psi a centri is probably taking about 80rwhp to turn while a good turbo setup will see those gains. Lastly these big HP cars with the stock fuel pump and BAP, if AFR was recorded most of the time you'll see it going lean at the top of the pull. Ok for a dyno pull, but not what you want to go down the track. A generous dyno will help with those numbers also. So if you factor in all these "tricks" to get a huge dyno number you can see how it's possible.

my tuner dyno is a mustang dyno so my goal is between 650-700 rwhp and I have de 3.33 pulley, so I just want a safe set-up, but he think I'm going lean at 7300 rpm. It sure I understand what you say and the best is a fuel system upgrade, but I don't see a lot of paxton guys on this forum have this system, It is why I ask my questions

 

[BenV8]

I also forgot to mention the cars trying to get big HP numbers on a stock fuel pump are using a JMS 21v BAP and not a 17v KB BAP.

ok but I have the dual stage KB BAP

 

[gimmie11s]

why at each time I ask questions on this forum I need to be insistent to have answers? It is because I'm french canadian? I respect you a lot and I do my best for speak in english....it is disapointing!!

Because we dont speak French and French people are pissy (see your post i quoted above).

You have your answers in English above multiple times. 850 on a BAP is too much. GO RETURN STYLE.

700 with a BAP is fine.


BTW, i had a Paxton with a 3.33 on my 2014 and it sucked. But what do i know (and everyone else who already responded).

 

[BenV8]

Because we dont speak French and French people are pissy (see your post i quoted above).

You have your answers in English above multiple times. 850 on a BAP is too much. GO RETURN STYLE.

700 with a BAP is fine.


BTW, i had a Paxton with a 3.33 on my 2014 and it sucked. But what do i know (and everyone else who already responded).

hey, I do my best to talk in english you can respect me? you know, I have done searches before ask my questions.

 

[stang910]

I would suggest a 3.6" or 3.47" pulley and race gas to get where you want to be if you insist on keeping the stock pump. I only know of one guy on this forum that ran the 3.33" pulley with a stock fuel pump and raced it (without a wastegate). The car was quick but it didn't take long and he sold his somewhat new aluminator as a hurt engine. Maybe the reason you can't find anybody running that combo is because it's not a great idea. I've done it and gave you my feedback. Your car may be different initially, but you'll eventually regret it. If you play with fire you get burned.