I'm wondering if this is the "clutch protection" doing this? There is no way of turning it off?
GT500 + Drag Radials + Sticky Track=#%#%
- Thread starter BOD89LX
- Start date
I'm wondering if this is the "clutch protection" doing this? There is no way of turning it off?
I have no experience driving a Z06 or a 13 GT500 for that matter, but I have driven earlier GT500's and I've owned a Terminator, and driven plenty of Foxbodies, and with every thing being equal(tires, suspension setup, manual or auto trannies, etc) a lighter Foxbody is an easier car to get a good launch with. Like with most things dealing with performance lighter weight benefits how well a vehicle launches.
I would think that a Vette weighing between 3100/3200 lbs would be an easier car to get a good launch with especially when talking street tires seeing as a Z with house quite a bit more rubber. I do know Z06's run flats are suppose to be pretty poor performers though.
I would think that a Vette weighing between 3100/3200 lbs would be an easier car to get a good launch with especially when talking street tires seeing as a Z with house quite a bit more rubber. I do know Z06's run flats are suppose to be pretty poor performers though.
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I think people forget that when the C6 Z06 first came out, everyone struggled with the clutch and getting good 60' times was a real challenge. It was thought that the clutch was flawed and would ultimately limit the performance of the car. People also believed that the engine computer (PCM) would invoke various nannies to protect the drive train and this would also prove to limit the performance - unless all of these protections were disabled.
In 2006, I believe the fastest bone stock C6Z time was turned in by Ranger with an 11.29. Five years later, the times came tumbling down with the fastest time now at 10.715 (Ranger) --with NO MODS other than the "driver mod". There are now a total of 7 drivers who have turned in 10 second (bone stock) passes -- in 2006 there were none.
This happened because the drivers learned what worked and what didn't and over time adjusted to the unique characteristics of the Z06 clutch. engine, Torque Management, and other factors.
After being part of this in the Z06 world, I'm pretty confident that the same will happen with the '13 GT500 and that we will see the times come down as drivers get more seat time, learn what works, and share their experiences and knowledge with other racers.
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What he said. If you are still bogging you need to go higher on the rpm until you get the tires to actually burnout and then back down your rpm a little to get to the sweet spot. At least that's how i always did it. Also can you possibly release the clutch pedal a little slower to try and slip the clutch a bit so you don't get the drive-train shock?
More gear will likely help but more seat time would also yield some pretty good results. Still I think you did pretty good!
There is no way you're revving to 5k and dumping the clutch on a 662hp car with stock street tires and not spinning unless the car computer is interfering in some way.
Read the title I have drag radials and like I said the car can spin the stock tires at will and can spin the drag radials some if I am rolling and the clutch is engaged, I went out and tried 5000 rpm launches on the street in mid 40 degree temps and it will bog unless you slip the hell out of the clutch and then you can smell it. Like I said also you can watch the boost gauge drop to 0 once the clutch is out and it feels like the throttle is closed as then it opens back up and the boost climbs if I am rolling at idle then stab the gas the boost goes up right away and will spin a little once it hits 7-8 psi on the street. thats why I think the clutch protection is doing something at this point and keep in mind the car still ran 11.9@121 doing this and if i use the track apps i can get a 0-60 in 3.9 seconds about the same as street tires with launch control the car is not slow by any means just could be faster if I could get it to leave harder.
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A Very true statement on all accounts.
The Z06's OEM clutch hates drag racing launches....it wasn't designed for that purpose. It takes patiences and seat time to learn all the nuances of a car, and I don't see the GT500 being any different. :beer:
Using brute force is not always the best way to achieve stellar performance numbers at the track.
I am pretty sure with a tune and T/B and intake the car would leave just fine as the tune gets does away with a lot of the throttle control that the pcm is playing with and it also picks it up on the bottom end. The biggest problem with trying to find that magic spot on this car is the cost of a new clutch and labor about 2K to figure it out. Gears are much cheeper and the car will run a little quicker with them as a added bonus.
I suffered with this same problem with my old 04 Cobra, it drove me crazy. I was running drag radials and I couldn't warm the tires. I finally figured out that the TC switch was bad, it was not turning the TC off, changed the switch and all my problems were solved. You never know might want to look into it.
The T/C in a 03/04 Cobra(or lets say 01-04 Mustangs) is about some worthless shit. Who doesn't love hitting brick walls as that's about what it feels like when your in your cool Edge Mustang(particularly powerful/modded 03/04 Cobra) hauling ass with your tire burning and then all of a sudden the tail in starts to get just a little sideways and the computer basically decides to just up and kill the motor. If you're not wearing the seatbelt then you'd probably smack your head in the steering wheel.
The old Mustangs T/C was very crude. It was suppose to let the wheels spin, but if it detected that the rear of the car was getting even just slightly sideways it would instantly. I understand what they were thinking though. Foxbody and SN95 cars are very tail happy, and can up and go very quickly without warning. They can be unpredictable so they were probably trying to keep people out of situation where they would start spinning out of control. Still it could be very dangerous if you were say passing somebody or merging into traffic and all of a sudden the T/C totally kills the power.
I got tired of trying to remember to push the button every time I started the car so i just got it turned off in a tune. I mean there really is no situation where the T/C system in beneficial on a old New Edge Mustang.
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I realize this thread is a little old, but there is NO WAY in hell that a proven 662HP car is bogging on the street with DR's, not happing...unless as you said the computer is shutting the car down or something is wrong with your car. My 03 has 600hp at the tires and if I crawl out in second it will destroy every tire on the market. Trust me 5k on the car and I have already had around 6 sets on the car. I received my VIN yesterday, but if this is a power problem or issue not due to computer anyone want a SGM…3.73's will not solve your problem and if it does am still not sure I want the car.
Like I said its something in the pcm as I can be rolling at idle and spin the drag radials on the street but if I am trying to launch it will bog if you try and slip the clutch too much now if I dump the clutch it will just smoke the tires no problem. I said before you can watch the boost gauge drop to 0 when it bogs as its making a few pounds of boost as the clutch is coming out then just goes to 0 for a second then starts to climb and like I said the car still ran 11.9@121 doing that , I plan to go back to the track and try the rpm only feature of the LC and see if that helps other wise its just trying to find the sweet spot between spin and bog and not kill the clutch when doing so.
Damn keep us informed, I hope it is at least fixable with a tune. I am not an every weekend track guy, but I do like to go a few times a year.
Not surprising.
I'm sure your boost will drop to practically zero if let the engine RPM's drop too far. Do you know how low your RPM's are dropping when you bog?
As I mentioned previously, something has to slip when launching to match the engine RPM's to the drive line RPM's. And if the tires aren't spinning, the bottom line is there is no choice: the differential in RPM's between the two is going to be made up through the clutch slipping.
You will get best results by forcing the clutch to slip by applying more power, and doing this as quick as possible -- before the clutch has achieved full clamping power and bogged the engine. I think you should experiment with the timing and synchronizing your throttle application with the clutch coming up. Try being quicker on the throttle squeeze and starting a little earlier as the clutch pedal is coming up.
Good luck!!!!
:beer:
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The problem is the more slip you get the sooner the clutch protection kicks in like I said it is as if the throttle is closed for a split second then ramps back open so the more throttle you give it the faster it bogs, If i put the street tire on doesnt do it as they will spin before the clutch slips to much, so the real problem will be trying to find the sweet spot and not destroy the clutch doing so as the clutch in these cars is almost a on/off type engagement notheing like my 03 Cobra or my Foxbody with a faceplated pro shifted Astro T-5 with a centerforce DFX clutch. But I will say if the car had a tune and small mods I am sure this problem would go away.
It sounds like there's going to be a real need to have some significant seat time to figure out the stock, un-modded car, before owners start getting into the 10's ...even with the cool air days coming. You need that strong 60' and 1/8 mile splits to reach that goal, and it sounds like the clutch and the various safety protocols built into the car (for self preservation purposes) is going to make it a challenge...just like all the other high powered 3-pedal cars.
Subscribed, to watch your progress !!! :rockon:
**Update** - The clutch protection system is new and it's behavior is not yet fully understood.
Believe this may also be a case of a very strong clutch locking up before the engine is making significant power.
BOD89LX - Try changing the timing of when you hit the throttle to be quicker/faster so the engine is deeper in it's power curve before the clutch locks up.
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I am going to go out tonight and do some testing with the LC RPM only feature to see if it does the same thing but I do agree if I could find that magic spot the car should 60' like my 2012 did its just a very small window to find.
It does talk about the clutch protection in the owners manual so I believe that it has some from of it if they outlined in the owners manual.
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