Delete the AC or Not? Managing cooling issues

[Bishop03]

Thought I would get some feedback from those that have gone done this path.

I am relatively new to the SN95 Cobra world, I have owned a 96 for about a year. The car is going to be a summer driver and an Autocrosser. I live on the Westcoast of Canada and will use the AC 4-5 times a year. The car has a lower temp t-stat and is good working order but still runs hot in the summer especially when driven hard.

I need to manage this issue. The first owner had a switch to turn on the exisiting fans or had extra fan/fans installed and wired to a switch. The second owner took it out because it interfered with his large stereo system. My idea was to get an AC delete and pull out the condenser as I hear this is the main problem. Doing this would also drop weight in an important area of the car.

My brother who is a mechanic thinks I am crazy and believes I will miss the AC. He also feels it could be a bigger job than I think.

So feedback I am looking for is others that have the same issue, how have you managed it and why. Were you happy with the solution. People that have deleted the AC, did you regret it?

 

[98v8]

Did your car have the factory tsb done? Could be that since its a 96 hope ive helped

 

[SNK_RATH]

I would get that tsb done ,and go from there . I deleted my ac on my 95 5.0 and have regreted ever since !!!! :fm:

What exactly is running hot ? Where is it at on the gauge ?

 

[mwolson]

I run a non-intercooled KB @6PSI on my 96. I had a real cooling issue on very hot days, and the condenser replacement fixed it for me. But I did a lot of research in the process. Here are my thoughts on cooling in general and 96 cars specifically:

How do you know it is running hot? Unless it is puking coolant, it probably isn't running hot. Invest in a real gauge so you know.

These engines love to run hot. You get a better burn at the stock temperature, about 195+.

Some people run 180 to try to reduce the chances of detonation. A lot of people run 180 without a clue as to why.

FYI, in my 97 Cobra LLX4 tune, I run the stock 195* T-stat and stock fan settings:

Low Speed Fan On 208
Low Speed Fan Off 200
High Speed Fan On 228
High Speed Fan Off 224

If you are going to change the thermostat from stock, do it for a reason (usually to avoid detonation), and change the fan setting in the tune at the same time.

But if you aren't at risk for detonation, leave it stock, unless you have a reason I can't think of.

The 96 condenser is known to be too dense. In fact, I don't think the TSB does much good without the new condenser, and it may not be needed with the new condenser. But finding a new condenser is really hard now. You might want to contact Mustang Matt. I'm pretty sure he can tell you how to convert to use an 03/04 condenser.

Have you burped the crap out of your coolant system? These cars are notorious for running hot with air in the system, and it takes me 4-5 burps to get the air out.

 

[KCRN12]

If the car will mainly be an autocross car an you don't plan on using it as a daily driver then I don't think you'll have any issue deleting the AC. However, if it will be anywhere close to a DD in the summer, I believe you will regret it. I had the AC in mine out for the first year I had the car and then again for several months after I did the cobra swap and it was pretty bad driving the car in the summer w/o AC. The biggest issue, though, is you won't have any defog. The AC system removes the moisture from the air, which allows the defog to work. If it rains and you don't drive with the windows down you'll have a big fogging issue on the windshield, unless you use some form of defogger on it. This was the biggest problem I had with it. Well, that and the fact that anytime I had my gf with me and we were goin out so she didn't want her hair messed up (windows down) it got WAY too hot with no ventilation.

As for what your brother said... If he really is a mechanic and truly believes it will be a difficult job then I would hesitate to let him work on anything of mine. I don't mean any disrespect, but seriously, I could delete the AC in one of these cars in about 30 min.

 

[KCRN12]

Oh, but as for fixing it if you keep it... Try to find a new style condenser with fewer fins. I can almost guarantee that's your problem. It's a very common issue with the 96 cars.

 

[VirtualSVT]

When is it getting hot? Moving or Idling?

 

[na svt]

The problem with 96 Cobras was the a/c condensor, it restricted airflow because it had too many finds per inch. The 97 and later condensors had fewer fins which allowed more air to pass through them and onto the radiator. Also, the 96 fan/shroud setup also restricts airflow. Changing the condensor was enough for my 96 to run cool at all times. I recommend you start with the condensor and if that doesn't do the trick, step up to a 97 and later radiator and fan.

Keep the a/c.

 

[na svt]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Replace...998|Model:Mustang&hash=item5d3636a068&vxp=mtr

http://www.go-part.com/9702-ford-mustang-condenser-p-14496.html?src=shoppingcom

http://www.getallparts.com/parts/19...r/ac__condensers/cnd40170/product-detail.aspx

 

[na svt]

1996 fan 1996 cobra fan - Bing Images

1998 fan 1998 cobra fan - Bing Images

 

[na svt]

My idea was to get an AC delete and pull out the condenser as I hear this is the main problem. Doing this would also drop weight in an important area of the car.

Moving the battery to the back does more for the weight bias than removing the a/c. The condensor and lines are very light, the pump is heavier but still not as much as most people think.

 

[na svt]

4v+DOHC=Big Power? Actually 4V+DOHC is the same as 4V+4V or DOHC+DOHC and in all three cases they equal 8 valves per cylinder.

Now that would be one bad mutha!

 

[Bishop03]

Just quickly read the posts, outstanding some very thoughtful insights, thanks for taking the time to post. I have a couple follow up questions I will ask later.

 

[Tyler72]

I swapped in the later style condenser (got a brand new one from Oreilly's) and also installed a fluidyne radiator and a 160* thermostat. The thermostat swap was done because I'm running a D1SC and I wanted to keep the engine temps down to help prevent detonation and to be able to run quite a bit of timing on pump gas. Car runs great and stays cool with no issues now. Heat works great in the winter time too.

 

[deadernie]

What's a hot day in Vancouver?

 

[Bishop03]

What's a hot day in Vancouver?

Over 27 using the proper scale above 75 using imperial

I am sold the AC stays, a new condenser and burping the crap out of the cooling system are the first steps.

What would be cost/labour differences between

New Rad- aftermarket piece
vs.
New Fan/Shroud

Again great information thanks for sharing your experiences.

 

[KCRN12]

The fan an shroud would definitely be cheaper, labor wise. But if you decide to go that route, you can easily do that yourself. It's not much more than a couple bolts and you can have that finished.

Aftermarket radiators are typically a good bit cheaper than factory. And the radiator, once you get the fan off and hoses disconnected only has 1 bolt in each of the mounts, at the top. As long as you understand the concept of burping the system I have no doubt that you can do that yourself, too, and save the labor cost.

If you decide to keep the AC and just replace the condenser then that will require some time at the shop, because the AC system will have to be evacuated and recharged. You CAN also evacuate it yourself by just taking the hoses off.... It's illegal, but it can be done. You also can recharge it with the cans from autozone or wherever, but it's a pretty big pain to get it to go in, and if you're just a little bit off (too little or too much) it won't cool as well.

 

[mwolson]

Before I replaced my condenser, I had replaced my stock radiator with a big Fluidyne aluminum radiator. It helped, but not as much as I expected it to. That ultimately led to the new condenser.

But, I had bad luck with Fluidyne leaking along the side seams just after it was out of warranty, as have many others. Fluidyne told me I was SOL. Mishimoto users have had a lot of similar complaints. My theory is that they are held in too tightly by the stock radiator mounts, and body flex cracks their seams.

A few years ago, I replaced my Fluidyne with a custom copy (made out of copper) built by a local radiator shop, and have had no cooling or leaking issues since. It weighs 8 lbs more than the Fluidyne, but could cool a semi.

A few months ago, a Mishimoto rep posted a message on a forum that they were developing a new radiator that does not fail so soon, but have not heard if it is in the market nor have I heard any reviews.