Which do you have. Does anyone know which is the easiest install?
What Quadrent+FW Adjuster
- Thread starter kaboom
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Before I start I want everyone to know I'm selling a Maximum Motorsports Quadrant, Firewall adjuster, and new stock clutch cable for $100.00 in the parts section.
The reason I'm selling mine is because Pro Motion is a local shop. Walt of Pro Motion designed the dual hook for Steeda which UPR copied and added a third which has no function to sell under then impression more is better. Bottom line the hook quadrants do nothing they follow the same ramp as the stock quadrant. The only benefit is in the strength over stock. If your going with a quadrant then get a quick release, it's the whole benefit. Not all quick release ramps are the same, most use washers, some are self centering.. Bottom line the new ramp from Pro Motion was picked up by McLeod and Ram as well as the firewall adjuster.
Bottom line on the firewall adjuster is that it works. It's beefy, and the firewall won't flex. This is the superior setup, the firewall won't flex, the cable won't bind, the ramp self centers.. all is well with the world.
Firewall adjuster.
Quadrant
Goodluck in your decision.
The reason I'm selling mine is because Pro Motion is a local shop. Walt of Pro Motion designed the dual hook for Steeda which UPR copied and added a third which has no function to sell under then impression more is better. Bottom line the hook quadrants do nothing they follow the same ramp as the stock quadrant. The only benefit is in the strength over stock. If your going with a quadrant then get a quick release, it's the whole benefit. Not all quick release ramps are the same, most use washers, some are self centering.. Bottom line the new ramp from Pro Motion was picked up by McLeod and Ram as well as the firewall adjuster.
Bottom line on the firewall adjuster is that it works. It's beefy, and the firewall won't flex. This is the superior setup, the firewall won't flex, the cable won't bind, the ramp self centers.. all is well with the world.
Firewall adjuster.
Quadrant
Goodluck in your decision.
What the deal with that set screw?
Personally, I like the UPR Extreme F/W Adjuster. Originally, I put the Steeda unit on my 98, but when I had to adjust at F/W while away from home and didn't have any seal nor the time to let it dry, I made the decision to switch to the UPR F/W aduster. I left the Steeda Quadrant in place though.
This time around, I went with all UPR. Funny, but now it's Steeda copying UPR. Stick around long enough and you'll see everything.
I would like to see the Pro Motion quadrant. Is it really self centering with any F/W aduster, or is that just some more marketing hype (like the triple hook)? That claim would have to be proven to me. I haven't seen an aftermarket quadrant yet which didn't have to be shimmed., but it's no big deal. You only have to do it once.
This time around, I went with all UPR. Funny, but now it's Steeda copying UPR. Stick around long enough and you'll see everything.
I would like to see the Pro Motion quadrant. Is it really self centering with any F/W aduster, or is that just some more marketing hype (like the triple hook)? That claim would have to be proven to me. I haven't seen an aftermarket quadrant yet which didn't have to be shimmed., but it's no big deal. You only have to do it once.
Wait a second... You're telling us the UPR & Steeda quadrants have the exact same ramp profile as stock? I doubt that! Someone got some pics...
U.M.
I have to agree with U.M. on this one. Both the Steeda and UPR felt different than stock as far as release and pedal effort.
Sorry to break it to you guys.. Walt designed the first double hook qaudrant for Steeda which UPR copied and made their triple out of.. and of the "hook" quadrants follow the same ramp.. line it up against stock.. then line it up against another "hook" quadrant.. Quick Release is the way to go, it's the only benefit over strength.
Call me stupid, but I've never heard or read a good explanation on what the quadrent and FW adjuster do..
I've alway tought that they adjust the travel and feel of the clutch pedal...
is this correct? :??:
I've alway tought that they adjust the travel and feel of the clutch pedal...
is this correct? :??:
The stock quadrant is a 2 piece affair made out of plastic. The 2 pieces have teeth which mesh, but if the teeth wear (and eventually, they will), then the 2 pieces will flex giving that vauge feeling to the pedal.
The aftermarket quadrants are all one piece units, usually machined from aluminum. They do not flex or wear like the stock one will. However, if you do not shim the aftermarket ones, they can wander side to side on the 2 mounting posts (which are connected to the pedal). If the quadrant is not inline with the cable as it comes through the firewall, the cable could ride up high on the quadrant, then slip down into the groove (or if you are really misaligned, the cable can slip off the side of the quadrant leaving your clutch fully engaged). Over time, a misaligned quadrant can cause your cable to fray and break. I used 1/2" washers from the hardware store on both sides of the quadrant to center it. If you are in doubt about which size washer to use, you can take the quadrant with you and match up the hole side to the hole in the washer. I'd get several (they are real cheap) in different thicknesses (if available) so you can align it properly.
BTW, the reason the stock quadrant is in 2 pieces, is so it can be adjusted as the clutch disk wears. When you pull up on the pedal, one piece is pivoted away from the other, and a spring alows the other piece to pivot and catch on the next tooth, thus lengthing the whole affair. On the aftermarket units, either an adjustable cable is used, which is adjusted underneath at the transmission (a royal pain in the ass), or a firewall adjuster is used to "shorten the aparent lenth of the cable. If you use a F/W adjuster, it's best to use the stock cable (which needs to have some plasic trimmed off). If you get one which adjusts at the bellhousing, then you must use the appropriate aftermarket cable.
Sorry for the long post, but you asked and an engineer answered.
The aftermarket quadrants are all one piece units, usually machined from aluminum. They do not flex or wear like the stock one will. However, if you do not shim the aftermarket ones, they can wander side to side on the 2 mounting posts (which are connected to the pedal). If the quadrant is not inline with the cable as it comes through the firewall, the cable could ride up high on the quadrant, then slip down into the groove (or if you are really misaligned, the cable can slip off the side of the quadrant leaving your clutch fully engaged). Over time, a misaligned quadrant can cause your cable to fray and break. I used 1/2" washers from the hardware store on both sides of the quadrant to center it. If you are in doubt about which size washer to use, you can take the quadrant with you and match up the hole side to the hole in the washer. I'd get several (they are real cheap) in different thicknesses (if available) so you can align it properly.
BTW, the reason the stock quadrant is in 2 pieces, is so it can be adjusted as the clutch disk wears. When you pull up on the pedal, one piece is pivoted away from the other, and a spring alows the other piece to pivot and catch on the next tooth, thus lengthing the whole affair. On the aftermarket units, either an adjustable cable is used, which is adjusted underneath at the transmission (a royal pain in the ass), or a firewall adjuster is used to "shorten the aparent lenth of the cable. If you use a F/W adjuster, it's best to use the stock cable (which needs to have some plasic trimmed off). If you get one which adjusts at the bellhousing, then you must use the appropriate aftermarket cable.
Sorry for the long post, but you asked and an engineer answered.
Originally posted by SnakeBit
The stock quadrant is a 2 piece affair made out of plastic. The 2 pieces have teeth which mesh, but if the teeth wear (and eventually, they will), then the 2 pieces will flex giving that vauge feeling to the pedal.
The aftermarket quadrants are all one piece units, usually machined from aluminum. They do not flex or wear like the stock one will. However, if you do not shim the aftermarket ones, they can wander side to side on the 2 mounting posts (which are connected to the pedal). If the quadrant is not inline with the cable as it comes through the firewall, the cable could ride up high on the quadrant, then slip down into the groove (or if you are really misaligned, the cable can slip off the side of the quadrant leaving your clutch fully engaged). Over time, a misaligned quadrant can cause your cable to fray and break. I used 1/2" washers from the hardware store on both sides of the quadrant to center it. If you are in doubt about which size washer to use, you can take the quadrant with you and match up the hole side to the hole in the washer. I'd get several (they are real cheap) in different thicknesses (if available) so you can align it properly.
BTW, the reason the stock quadrant is in 2 pieces, is so it can be adjusted as the clutch disk wears. When you pull up on the pedal, one piece is pivoted away from the other, and a spring alows the other piece to pivot and catch on the next tooth, thus lengthing the whole affair. On the aftermarket units, either an adjustable cable is used, which is adjusted underneath at the transmission (a royal pain in the ass), or a firewall adjuster is used to "shorten the aparent lenth of the cable. If you use a F/W adjuster, it's best to use the stock cable (which needs to have some plasic trimmed off). If you get one which adjusts at the bellhousing, then you must use the appropriate aftermarket cable.
Sorry for the long post, but you asked and an engineer answered.
Thanks for the info...
but what are the benefits...
A better (less vauge) clutch feel.
Ability to adjust where the clutch engages/disengages. For example, when racing, some adjust so that the clutch disengages with the pedal only part way to the floor. This gives them an advantage when speed shifting.
I just like the feel and the ability to adjust where the clutch engages.
Ability to adjust where the clutch engages/disengages. For example, when racing, some adjust so that the clutch disengages with the pedal only part way to the floor. This gives them an advantage when speed shifting.
I just like the feel and the ability to adjust where the clutch engages.
I'd still like to see some pics comparing the stock quadrant with the aftermarket parts showing the identical ramp profiles...
U.M.
U.M.
I found it chop meat!!!!
Is this the only advantage? What is this I keep hearing that you need one of these to keep the throw out bearing from failing again? I just had my entire T56 replaced because the TOB severed the input shaft guide in my T56......
That's a big part of it. The stock quadrant, when adjusted correctly, puts a slight amount of pressure on the clutch fork arm which puts the TOB up against the pressure plate fingers. The result is that the TOB is rotating all of the time, even when in neutral with the clutch pedal all the way out. As the pressure plate wears, this goes to just light pressure on the fingers. This causes friction and wear of the fingers and TOB. As the pressure decreases even more, the TOB can wobble due to uneven pressure, causing the wear on the input shaft guide. During that time, attempts to adjust the stock quadrant will fail until the wear on the pressure plate increases.
My preference on an aftermarket quadrant, is to adjust it so there is 1/4" to 1/2" freeplay in the pedal. This keeps the TOB away from the pressure plate fingers when the clutch is out. This also insures that the clutch is fully engaged when in gear, thus decreasing any unnecessary wear on the P/P. Some have added an external spring on the clutch fork arm to ensure that it is pulled away from the P/P when out (remember that the TOB is held against the clutch fork arm by a clip).
I don't have any hard data supporting that an aftermarket quadrant will lead to extended clutch life vs stock setup, but I do have personal experience in 4 different Mustangs that an aftermarket quadrant feels better than stock.
You might want to read this... the quadrant cable is useless on an '03 & '04.
check it out: http://www.svtownersassociation.com/svtoaforums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5971
check it out: http://www.svtownersassociation.com/svtoaforums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5971
I just installed the UPR triple hook quadrant and the UPR extreme firewall adjuster this weekend. I re-used the stock clutch cable as most people say it's superior to the aftermarket cables. Here are a few observations...
First off, the quadrant and firewall adjuster didn't come with any instructions. I had to download them from UPR's website. Additionally....the UPR instructions blow! Lets just get that fact out front from the get go. Try these modified ones instead: http://www.shane.roberts.net/quad.htm
Anyone who has performed a quadrant install WITHOUT removing the drivers seat gets the coveted "Contortionist Award". I removed mine and still had problems getting under there!
Be prepared to use a dozen or more 1/2" washers getting the quadrant lined up on the pivot shafts and square with the firewall adjuster. Note - These washers ARE NOT included with the quadrant. Some people have cut up the stock quadrant and used parts of it as a washer.
While wrestlin' with the removal of the stock plastic firewall piece/clip (it has to be cut off the stock cable in order to use it with the UPR firewall adjuster) I must have popped the other end of the cable out of the clutch fork on the tranny. They don't warn you this can happen... Of course you can't adjust the cable when one end of it is no longer connected! DOH! :bash:
Once I got the heat shield/dust cover off the side of the tranny and hooked the cable back in I was then able to take up the slack with the firewall adjuster. I was even able to utilize the first hood on the quadrant too.
It works very well with the stock cable and my clutch releases much higher now which is what I wanted. It is also more firm and has a very solid feel to it. I must admit though the pedal pressure and release profile are NO DIFFERENT THAN STOCK! 2JZFAN was absolutely correct. The ramp profile on the UPR quadrant is the same as the stock quadrant.
U.M.
First off, the quadrant and firewall adjuster didn't come with any instructions. I had to download them from UPR's website. Additionally....the UPR instructions blow! Lets just get that fact out front from the get go. Try these modified ones instead: http://www.shane.roberts.net/quad.htm
Anyone who has performed a quadrant install WITHOUT removing the drivers seat gets the coveted "Contortionist Award". I removed mine and still had problems getting under there!
Be prepared to use a dozen or more 1/2" washers getting the quadrant lined up on the pivot shafts and square with the firewall adjuster. Note - These washers ARE NOT included with the quadrant. Some people have cut up the stock quadrant and used parts of it as a washer.
While wrestlin' with the removal of the stock plastic firewall piece/clip (it has to be cut off the stock cable in order to use it with the UPR firewall adjuster) I must have popped the other end of the cable out of the clutch fork on the tranny. They don't warn you this can happen... Of course you can't adjust the cable when one end of it is no longer connected! DOH! :bash:
Once I got the heat shield/dust cover off the side of the tranny and hooked the cable back in I was then able to take up the slack with the firewall adjuster. I was even able to utilize the first hood on the quadrant too.
It works very well with the stock cable and my clutch releases much higher now which is what I wanted. It is also more firm and has a very solid feel to it. I must admit though the pedal pressure and release profile are NO DIFFERENT THAN STOCK! 2JZFAN was absolutely correct. The ramp profile on the UPR quadrant is the same as the stock quadrant.
U.M.
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I think im gonna try the speed release? What is the difference between the speed release and the tri hook?
The radius is larger on the quick release quadrant than the stock quadrant. I don't know about the 3 hook design. For the same amount of pedal travel, the cable moves a greater distance. If I remember right, it is the red colored one from Steeda.
If you change quadrants, you also have to install a firewall adjuster. Replacing the stock quadrant removes the adjusting capability of the stock linkage.
Dana
If you change quadrants, you also have to install a firewall adjuster. Replacing the stock quadrant removes the adjusting capability of the stock linkage.
Dana
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