Truth about 5w20 oil and why SVT says no synoils

[SnakeBit]

Synthetic oil can take extended drain periods just fine. All you have to do is change your filter and top off every 3,000 miles. IMO, I would NOT do extended periods on the filter.

I have done this on 2 other Mustangs, an 86 GT which went more than 10 years and 200K miles, and 98 Cobra for 50K miles (then traded it for the 03). On the other 2 cars, I used Castrol Syntec on the 86, and Mobile 1 5W30 on the Cobra. On the both cars, I changed out filter every 3K and full oil change every 12K.

I plan on doing filter every 3K and full change every 12K with the Amsoil, and I'm switching to Amsoil filters at my first filter change.

IMO, if you are going to change the oil every 3K, then stay with the Ford oil. If you move to synthetic, then go for the extended drain intervals, just watch those filters so they don't get clogged up.

 

[1jarhead]

Originally posted by Daniel Moran
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Ford's new factory fill SAE 5w-20 motor oil (part number XO-5w20-QSP) is a synthetic blend, as is the widely retail marketed Motorcraft Premium 5w-20. If so, why in the world would SVT say no full synthetic in the 03? I'd say they just don't want to contradict corporate policy.

In response to this discussion concerning motor oils to use in the 03 Cobra I have a brief statement. I also called SVT prior to going to fully synthetic oil. When asked what they recommend as to a synthetic oil their response was to stay with Fords 5W20 synthetic blend. They told me they cannot recommend any other due to Fords warranty requirements. They also told me that they have not heard any negative feedback as a result of using ANY brand of synthetic oil. They did however say it would be best to stick with 5W20 and make sure it meets SAE requirements. I use Royal Purple 5W20 in mine. The first thing I noticed was that the engine did not seem to be working as hard and there was a significant improvement in throttle response. Bottom line to me is less friction and better longevity.

 

[Z-COBRA]

My 2 cents worth also.Just recently bought my 03 and I plan on going to Mobil 1 without a ?.Iv'e been using it on my Expedition and the wifes ZX2 since the begining and no problems what so ever.BTW Mobil1 meets or exceeds every spec for motor oils made.I just copied this from the Mobil1 web site and please read carefully one paragraph about Ford.
Product Description
Mobil 1 0W-20, Power and Performance Formula, is the most advanced performance synthetic engine oil designed to provide the ultimate level of power, and protection to keep engines running smoothly and cleanly. Mobil 1 0W-20 exceeds the requirements of the latest gasoline and diesel powered automobile engines. Mobil 1 0W-20 is the ideal product for high revolution and output four and six cylinder cars where a 0W-20 or 5W-20 viscosity lubricant is recommended.

Features & Benefits
Mobil 1 0W-20 is made with a patented proprietary test blend of ultra performance synthetic basestocks fortified with the most advanced additive system available today. Mobil 1 with Supersyn Antiwear Technology provides unsurpassed levels of performance, cleaning power and engine protection to enable a superior driving performance. Mobil 1 0W-20 is a leading edge viscosity grade uniquely designed to enhance the power output of vehicles equipped with high revolution engines, while providing a protection system for the most extreme driving conditions.

Mobil 1 with SuperSyn 0W20 is engineered specifically for Ford, Honda and any other vehicle where a 0W-20 or 5W-20 engine oil is recommended. Mobil 1 with SuperSyn 0W-20 exceeds API SL/CF, ILSAC GF-3, and the performance requirements Ford WSS-M2C-153H specification. This full synthetic formulation provides both exceptional engine protection while providing more efficient operation as indicated by improved fuel economy or greater power when compared to more viscous products. Key features and benefits include:


Features
Advantages and Potential Benefits
Active cleaning agents Reduces deposits and sludge build-up for the longest and cleanest engine life
Outstanding thermal and oxidation stability Reduces oil ageing allowing extended drain interval performance
Enhanced frictional properties Greater fuel economy and increased horse power performance
Excellent low temperature capabilities Quickest cold weather starting
Extended engine and electrical system life
High Viscosity Index and the Supersyn Antiwear Technology Extraordinary lubrication and wear protection performance in all driving styles and conditions
Unsurpassed low and high temperature engine protection

Applications
Mobil 1 0W-20 is recommended for all types of modern vehicles, especially high-performance turbo-charged 4 and 6 cylinder gasoline and diesel multi-valve fuel injected engines including those found in passenger cars, light vans and trucks where a 0W-20 or 5W-20 viscosity grade is specified.
Mobil 1 is not recommended for 2-Cycle or aviation engines, unless specifically approved by the manufacturer.


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Specifications & Approvals

Mobil 1 0W-20 meets or exceeds the following industry specifications:

ACEA A1,B1
API SL,SJ,EC,CF
ILSAC GF3

 

[2004svtcobra]

Who the hell really cares. As long as you change your oil every 3000 you will be OK.

 

[Z-COBRA]

2004,where abouts in western PA?,i have good friends in Tittusville and go TRout fishing there every spring.
Zorba

 

[soontobecobra]

OK, here is the problem Im seeing for far. Everyone is opinion sharing on what is good and what isnt, but NO real answers are coming from this and another long thread.

So lets get the most imortant questions answered:

1. If SVT says "engine was not built for 100% Syn oils", why do most here think that because Ford uses a blended oil that that statement cant be true? Do syn blend Dino oils of the "same" weight as 100% Syn oils still provide a thicker coating than full syns? (stae facts, not opinions) Perhaps that is why they say FULL syns should not be used. Is the main problem with dino/blend oils that they break down faster? wont frequent changes solve this?

2. OK the warranty issue! No matter how u feel about it, Ford recommends a 5w-20 Blend. Now I really need to know, if you use a different weight, will Ford void the warranty? Is there even a decent chance they will? Probably, right? So, the point here is to find out EXACTLY how to meet Ford's warranty requirements for the term of the warranty and still protect Cobra engines well into 100K-200K miles. For example, will using the 5W-20 blend for the first 36K miles, and, after warranty ends, then switching to somewhere say 10W-30 thru 15W-50 cause permanent damage during the first 36K miles?
Basically the goal here is to meet the warranty as best I can while preserving my engine as best I can and then to switch to much better/more protecting oils once I am free from Ford's warranty grip so that the car is fully protected into 100K-200K miles.

So more-to-the-point questions are:

1. Is there a better oil than Motorcraft 5W-20 Blend to fully protect the engine during the first 36K miles GIVEN THE WARRANTY RESTRICTIONS? Perhaps a frequent change interval with this oil, say 1500 miles? Perhaps full Dino oil changed every 1500 miles?

2. Does it matter what type (blend, full, or dino) of oil is used if frequent change intervals are used (every 1500 miles say)? Or no matter what will full synthetic always provide better protection that blends and dinos on most engines? Basically, can blends and dinos be changed frequently enuff so that there is no break down and the cost isnt too prohibitive?

3. What are the weights if any other than 5W-20 is Ford willing to openly warranty without going thru lawyers and having things in writing and all that crap?

Honestly, I would just like to get some real answers rather than reading all of the crap posted so far. We know the drill with weights, whats better for high performance engines, Ford's stance, the EPA, etc.

All of you who already own Cobras, Mach 1s, etc had every oppurtunity to learn about the political bullshit that caused 5W-20 to be used before you bought the car LIKE I AM DOING. u had every chance to look into this whole oil weight problem in the United States when it comes to performance cars. You chose to buy it anyway. I will buy one to, but I will be totally informed of all none problems BEFORE I purchase it.

These are the facts: Ford waranties 5w-20 and we know that this sucks for long-term engine protection; the EPA/political bullshit in this country cause this. Buyers should have been aware of this before they bought the cobra thru research like im doing.

SO PLEASE TELL ME HOW CAN WE BEST PROTECT OUR ENGINES TO 36K MILES, KEEP WITHIN THE GUIDELINES OF THE WARRANTY, AND THEN BEST PROTECT OUR CARS STARTING AT 36,001 MILES.

P.S. Last thing, in my opinion if u want to keep ur cobra well into 100K-200K miles then NEVER get an extended warranty where u will be forced to use 5w-20 for as long a 60K-76K miles. There would surely be no reovery from that length of time on 5W-20.

 

[03cobra#116]

Right off the Mobil 1 website:

"Mobil 1 5W-30, New Car Formula, exceeds the requirements of the latest industry standards required by newer modern gasoline and diesel powered automobile engines. Mobil 1 5W-30 is approved and the first choice by premium car manufacturers including Corvette."

Ford's not going to void a warranty for using an excellent full syn oil.

 

[soontobecobra]

If there is even a chance they will, its not worth the risk! maybe you could get them to do it with lawyers and the like but that's much too time consuming and car might be laid up that whole time.

 

[pgordon]

I have my car in the dealer now for warranty work, did not ask about oil type.

 

[soontobecobra]

I dont have access to a Cobra manual. What are all the ratings that the chosen oil has to meet or exceed?

 

[soontobecobra]

Also,

Can anyone say definitively (no opinions) that the '03 and '04 Oil Passage Design was changed to only work with 5w-20? IS or isnt it too small for 5w or 10w-30's?

That has to be the most important question besides the warranty issue. I would like to stop guessing and get an answer to this question; surely this can be answered by someone with factual knowledge.

Discussing which oil is best is pointless if we cant even find out for sure whether the car is even supposed to take above 5w-20 oil mechanically.

 

[soontobecobra]

double post, damn back button

 

[Petzuk]

:beer:


Soontobe:

This issue has been so thoroughly discussed by prominent forum members, that there is no need to add any more comments.

First, go to the first post on this thread where Cobra'03 summarized the entire issue last year.

Next, do a search on oil. Many, many discussions and comments are there for the asking.

Finally, use a syn in your Cobra (as you will read). Amsoil, Mobil1.... 0w30, 5w30.... You can't go wrong.


:beer:

 

[Cobra'03]

I read many of the succeeding posts to the original thread, and most are hilariously lacking in knowledge of fundamental tribological principles - there is a ton of speculation, yet the original post shows exactly why Ford recommends what it does, and it isn't to make your engine happy. Words mean things. If some here cannot make sense of the clear intent of the EPA letter, and then extrapolate it to what they have been told by SVT, then there really is nothing much more to say.

As a lubricant engineer for 10 years, it is my professional opinion that the only engine application where a very lightweight oil is absolutely necessary would be in the case where the engine tolerances were so tight, that thicker viscosity oils would not have adequate "time" (since viscosity is a volume/distance dynamic) to squeeze into the smallest passages. If someone can show that the tolerances on the 2003 SVT's are significantly smaller than the 2001 (which allowed a 30 weight) oil, then I will accept some validity to the "the engine was designed for it". I doubt anyone can, and so my recommendations and analysis remain the same as they were a year ago.

BTW, if you are at all interested in my current oil studies and comments, look for "Road Rage" on www.s2ki.com. They even designed a cool avatar for the old oil guy - lubrication of 9000 RPM engines with carbon fiber cylinder liners is a new, and fascinating, area of study for me. There are UOA's (used oil analyses) there that clearly indicate that the S2000 engines come with a high level of molybdenum, so those guys were leaving the stuff in their new engines for a long time. I researched and found a moly additive that does not plate, so it is useful for new engines, which allowed those guys to do an oil change at 1K to rid of metal and any leftover casting sand, but still allow seating of rings in the carbon-mettalic cylinder liners.


Happy motoring.

By the way, if anyone cares, my current favortie lubricants come from here:
www.le-inc.com

The key component in Lubrication Engineer's products is their own proprietary additive, a Trade Secret. It is called Alumasol and has higher temperature stability, is more inert, and just as strong an extreme pressure material as moly.


This is a real insider's product that I meant to post about for a while, but have been busy on other Forums.

 

[pny_xtc]

I did some research myself about the oil passages being to small for a heavier oil. I looked at the shop manual for a 99' Cobra (5w30 recomended) and 03' Cobra (5w20 recomended). I checked all the tolerances for the bearings; cam, rod, and main. The tolerances are exactly the same. From that conclusion, run what you like 5w20 or 5w30. As far as syn. oils, I feel the fact that syn. oils won't break down like conventional oils is enough reason for me. My $.02 !!!

 

[tvguy]

Originally posted by Cobra'03


I doubt anyone can, and so my recommendations and analysis remain the same as they were a year ago.

The original link in this thread is gone, and to be honest, I was indeed too lazy to read 4 pages to find your recommendations. I have a little time, so I'll look some more, but if you have the time, please be specific and direct with your recommendations. It may be repetative, but for those with tons of "oil" questions, your expertise is needed and respected. No need for in depth analysis, what oil do you recommend for a 03/03 Mustang Cobra? Your words have a lot of pull here to put it mildly. Thanks.
pacotaco

 

[davidmax]

We run all our new built motors for 2,000 miles 4 oil changes) and then go Syn but its Motorcraft 5-20 to break her in.These motors take a while to seat and need friction so EZ driving 5,000 miles,drive it like you stoll it 2000 is fine,Dave Smilovic.

 

[caveman6666]

Originally posted by Cobra'03
If someone can show that the tolerances on the 2003 SVT's are significantly smaller than the 2001 (which allowed a 30 weight) oil, then I will accept some validity to the "the engine was designed for it". I doubt anyone can, and so my recommendations and analysis remain the same as they were a year ago.

Just a note: My '01 also recommended 5W20. Maybe you're thinking of the '99's?

 

[PowerWheels]

Had a tick with 5w20, no tick with M1 5w30. I'm not worried about anyone saying the warranty is no good because I used Mobile 1. Ford stands to loose way to many customers if they void over garbage BS.

 

[ChicagoMike]

Does anyone think there would be a problem running 10W30 in the spring/summer/early fall?

Full synthetic 10W30....