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Those with aviator motors

Discussion in 'New Edge Cobras' started by TBCobra, Apr 10, 2011.

  1. TBCobra

    TBCobra Premium Member Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    Can anyone who has done an aviator swap give me an idea of what i would be in for? Like what extra pieces did you need to make it work? What year aviator motor, if not all, fits? I know i would need 6 bolt fly wheel.
     
  2. SonicBlueOval

    SonicBlueOval Member Established Member

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    All year should be the same. I have an 03 in my car. What are you swapping it into? Do you already have some cobra parts like timing cover and intake etc? Here is a page that should be helpful as well - How to: 4.6 2v to 4.6 4v Swap.
     
  3. TBCobra

    TBCobra Premium Member Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    It would be swapped into my 01 cobra. lol im not doing 2v to 4v.
     
  4. SonicBlueOval

    SonicBlueOval Member Established Member

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    I figured it was going in an 01 cobra, but the guy that wrote that article was swapping an aviator motor into his car so it has good info in it. The long block will work just fine for you if you swap the timing cover and intake over. Heads actually flow better, but you will have to get a 6 bolt flywheel like you said
     
  5. IUP99snake

    IUP99snake The Shocker Established Member

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    I swapped an aviator motor into my car in 2005. Long story short: I had a built motor built based on my 99 engine, but the shop that installed it didn't bleed the coolant properly and overheated it before I had a chance to drive it. Destroyed everything.

    Strapped for cash and not being able to afford a new built motor from scratch while I waited for my lawsuit to make its way through the court system, I looked for junkyard motors.

    All the cobra and mach motors were way too expensive. But knowing that an aviator motor is basically the same as a marauder and a mach, I was able to find one CHEAP because the junkyard didn't know it was the same thing. I paid $2,000 for a complete 10,000 mile motor with all the accessories and wiring harness.

    All I really needed was the long block, I sold everything off it I didn't need and was able to recover $1500 back, so the motor only cost me $500. I sold the aviator intake for $400 bucks, but that was back when the aviator intake was seen as the "poor man's FR500 intake"

    The swap itself was really easy. I reused my coil covers, cobra intake, cobra front cover (so all the accessories are exactly the same). All I used was the long block. The cobra intake bolts to the later 03/04 heads.

    The only external differences in the long block are the 6 bolt crank and the exhaust ports that are different on the 03/04 heads vs. the 99/01 heads. Existing headers and manifolds will technically bolt up, but the port shape is different. So, I decided to get a set of used 03 cobra manifolds for 20 bucks. It's all I could afford at the time.

    For the flywheel, I bought a 6 bolt, 11" aluminum flywheel from Fidanza, that way, I could still use my brand new clutch from the old motor. You could get a 6 bolt mustang GT flywheel if you want, but you'd have a 10.5" clutch instead.

    The engine runs great. It's got 10.3:1 compression, so it's great for a N/A build. I'm running a procharger with it, so I couldn't go as wild with the boost as I had planned with my forged motor.

    I had it tuned by Dave Guy of SGS automotive (formerly Kauffmann motorsports) in Dillsburg PA. They did a REAL CONSERVATIVE TUNE.

    The motor has less peak power on the top end, and makes less peak boost because of the better flowing heads, and because it has a 500 RPM lower redline. With my mods, it's tuned to make 450HP with lots of timing being pulled in the higher RPM.

    I think this setup is ideal for a centrifugal blower. The high compression, with the better flowing heads, plus cams designed for more bottom end power is great for around town driving and overall driveability, with the blower, which is awesome for top end blasts.

    It makes about 50 less peak HP, but makes as much as 75 more HP than my other motor as low as 3000 RPM than my 99 cobra motor with the procharger made.

    Sure, it doesn't have forged internals, but it's lasted 60,000 miles with a good tune and keeps driving great.

    When the time comes for a rebuild, I'll probably go with a stroker crank in addition to forged internals. I might take the compression a little bit lower, perhaps 9:1 or 9.5:1 so I can really pump up the boost.

    If you have any more questions, let me know!
     
  6. SonicBlueOval

    SonicBlueOval Member Established Member

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    Just wanted to clear up one thing here. The GT flywheel from Feb' 01+ actually use an 11" clutch. Just look for a car with a TR-3650 if you are looking to save money instead of going to an aluminum one. Put my aviator engine in with an eaton swap a few months ago, glad to hear yours has been working well for so long.
     
  7. IUP99snake

    IUP99snake The Shocker Established Member

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    Aaah good to point out. I didnt know that. That'll save you a great deal of cash if you're looking to do an entirely junkyard build. The flywheel was the most expensive piece of my build, (except for the motor itself) at $300 and change.

    I went with the fidanza piece because I had a brand new clutch installed with a blown motor and I wanted to be 100% certain that it would fit with this 6 bolt setup. I thought all 8 bolt flywheels were 11" and all 6 bolt flywheels were 10.5", which is why I got the "hybrid" flywheel from fidanza.

    How's it working with your eaton? Are you using the 03 cobra front dress? Is yours forged?

    People say the cast crank is crap, but you'll have no problems with it.
     
  8. TBCobra

    TBCobra Premium Member Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    Wow good info guys thanks.
     
  9. jbp99cobra

    jbp99cobra Fly fat ass, fly!!! Established Member

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    This is the info I was looking for too! My car has been sitting at a shop while I was looking for a replacement motor and I have been wondering about the Aviator option.
     
  10. IUP99snake

    IUP99snake The Shocker Established Member

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    The aviator option will save you a great deal of cash, especially after you sell everything you don't need off of it, down to the bare long block.

    Or you could go with a navigator 5.4 short block. You could put your 99-01 heads on it and have your intake widened. Or just get some adapter plates. Those are just some of the mods you'd need, not to mention a new hood. But there are some pros and cons to either swap.

    You could take the aviator motor, install some forged internals including a stroker crank and some cams while it's out of the car and turn it into a fire breather.
     
  11. na svt

    na svt say no to power adders Established Member

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    the engine is 10:1, same as the mach engines. It makes less power due to the shorter duration cams; 190 deg compared to 202 deg. The better flowing heads may reduce boost a very small amount but not enough to lower hp.
     
  12. jbp99cobra

    jbp99cobra Fly fat ass, fly!!! Established Member

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    Is it worth anything using the '99 cams (for N/A application) or are the differences negligible?
     
  13. na svt

    na svt say no to power adders Established Member

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    the engine will gain about 20rwhp with the 99 cams and if you install them at a 108LC it will pick up a lot of tq also.
     
  14. IUP99snake

    IUP99snake The Shocker Established Member

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    According to Motor Trend, it's got a 10.3:1 compression ratio.
    Used 2005 Lincoln Aviator Luxury Sport Utility Performance Specs - 2005 Lincoln Aviator Luxury Sport Utility Performance Specifications - Motor Trend Magazine

    That's the most reliable source I've been able to find, although I've heard it's got a compression ratio anywhere from 10:1 all the way to 10.5:1. If you can find a more reliable source, I'd love to see it.

    It has the same exact cams as the 03-04 cobras, which are also the same cams as the marauders and mach's. They make more mid range power, at a sacrifice of top peak power. It's enough to notice the mid range. Like I said before, my car made 75 more HP as low as 3000 RPM, but made 50 less peak HP at redline. That tells you something!

    The main reason why my car makes less "peak" boost is because it has a lower redline than with the previous motor, probably due to the cams. (in addition to the better flowing heads) With a centrifugal blower that only makes peak boost at peak RPM, 500 less RPM is 1 or 2 PSI of boost.

    It might be worth it to put a set of 96-98 intake cams in there, or perhaps a set of FGT cams.. but if you're gonna do a cam swap, you might as well just go with aftermarket cams for the time invested.
     
  15. na svt

    na svt say no to power adders Established Member

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    Last edited: Apr 15, 2011
  16. IUP99snake

    IUP99snake The Shocker Established Member

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    The Mach 1 registry says 10.1:1, which is pretty close to 10.3:1. But like I said before, I've seen so many places that are inconsistent with the compression, but the most places I've seen say 10.3:1, which is what I'm going to keep claiming until I see some more sources that prove otherwise. The Mach 1 registry says 10.1:1, but where'd they get their information from? Could have been anywhere.

    I can tell you from my own experience that my 99 motor pulled all the way to 7000 RPM, but this motor only pulls up to about 6500. It's all in the heads and cams, which were set up for more midrange power, rather than high rpm peak power. Even the 03 cobra motor has a redline of about 6500.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2011
  17. na svt

    na svt say no to power adders Established Member

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    Yes, that's because the intake cams have only 190 degrees duration (see my previous post on the cams). However, the redline isn't determined by the cams or the powerband. The redline is determined by the rpm capability of the drivetrain components. For example, the redline of an automatic tranmission'd Mach 1 is lower than the that of the manual trans'd Mach 1. However, if you swap out the tq converter and a snap ring in the auto trans it's rpm capability increases substantially along with the redline.
     
  18. Competition

    Competition Hood Rich Established Member

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    WTF is an Aviator motor?
     
  19. IUP99snake

    IUP99snake The Shocker Established Member

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    True.

    The point I'm trying to make is that the powerband with the aviator motor is substantially different than the 99/01 cobra headed motor, especially with a centrifugal blower. It makes much more midrange torque, has better throttle response, but is relatively more subdued at higher RPM. I remember my 99 motor used to bog a little before I got into the boost, then it was a hell of a ride all the way to redline. But this motor makes killer torque down low. In fact, it makes peak torque at 3300 RPM, which is 1000 RPM lower in the powerband than when I had the 99 heads and cams.
     
  20. na svt

    na svt say no to power adders Established Member

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    and engine from a lincoln avaitor, same as the marauder and automatic Mach 1 engines
     

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