Smoking Brakes

[Poisonous Mods]

Has any one else experienced smoking brakes after a hard twisty run?

After running really hard down some twisties & late braking into a turn when i got to a red light, i actually saw my brakes smoking.

I know our cars are much heavier VS previous models but to be smoking?:dw:

 

[cobrapete03']

Yeah it happens...I've seen it before...3800 lbs. with 390+ hp... its a whole lot of momentum to slow down once these cars get rolling at a decent rate...If you never want to think about your brakes again...Baer Racing Brakes...the best your $$ can buy.


-pete:coolman:

 

[Poisonous Mods]

But didnt FORD think of it before they released the cars? Not cool when the guy next to you is a Porsha & he says ( Looks like you need to upgrade ur brakes next ). This is what caught my attention to the smoke.

 

[KNGOBRA]

Yep, smoked my fronts within the first month against a Z06, he made sure to point out that my front brakes aren't up to par....I agreed with him.....:cuss:

 

[cobrapete03']

Its just like anything else...Its good enough for the "average" driver that won't be pushing the limits...The stock brakes are not designed to take repeated 90+ mph stops without some fade and excessive heating...I had to get on my brakes once at 130+ mph and they really didn't like that at all...I guarantee with Baer brakes they wont even wince at 100+mph stops repeatedly, especially with the Extreme Braking Kit they have for our cars...6-piston calipers designed for Winston Cup racing...Everyone always wants to increase HP but sometimes they forget that the kinetic energy increases 4X for just doubling the speed...


-pete:coolman:

 

[GordsFord]

122 miles of track time at Portland with hard use of the brakes = worn out front pads!! Each 2 mile lap required two slow downs from 125 mph down to about 50 mph and about 7 or 8 times from say 75 mph to 40. Stopping was quite good with very little fade but they sure wore out fast!

Gord

 

[03'Darin]

I beg to differ that the factory brakes aren't any good. First of all they are set up for street driving. Anytime you set a car up for a paticular type of driving there are comprimises.

The factory brakes are very capable of running an open track event or hard street driving with some upgrades.
1. Fresh fluid is vital to avoid boiling. I have found Ford HD to work very well.
2. Replace the front rubber brake hoses with a good pair of DOT stainless ones.
3. Remove the metal dust shield from the spindle (just behind the rotor)
4. Install a good brake duct system using the supplied holes next to the fog lights. Why do you think they put the holes there.
5. Install a good set of pads based on what type of driving you expect to do. Most performance pad applications are listed by what type of conditions they will be subjected to. Performance Friction makes some excellant track pads, check out their web sight for pad descriptions.

There is no substitution for bigger and better brakes if price is not an issue BUT the factory brakes with some upgrades are a much better brake than people give them credit for.

The spec brakes for my AS Mustang were Cobra/PBR's with the front rotors machined down to 12". Chevrolet 1LE brakes were the 12's so the Mustangs were not aloud to have more brake meaning we had to incur the expense of new caliper brackets and machining down rotors. With a car and driver weight of about 3400 #'s I have run those brakes in races up to an hour in length with no problems at all.

If you do want to spend the money for bigger calipers and or rotors(which with good pads will improve stopping ability) check out the new 6 piston Wilwood kit. They look like a very good system and I have seen them for $1195.

 

[Cobra-R]

I agree with Darin (well, not sure about the part of the willwoods are the best), but these brakes are very capable brakes. (have I said this before?) upgrade to a good pad and the other mainatinance that darin mentioned above and you will be good to go.

Brian

 

[GordsFord]

Yes I agree with Darin and Cobra-R that the stock brakes if modified with the right pads and some cooling ducts etc. should be good enough for open track days if not pushed right to the limit. I just changed the front pads on mine last night and one thing that had happened was that the rubber dust/water boots on two of the pistons were burned right off so I will be replacing them also.

Gord

 

[DD2000GT]

Your supposed to take your foot off the gas pedal when braking...



j/k :-D

 

[GordsFord]

Right, I forgot that!!!

Gord

 

[03'Darin]

Originally posted by GordsFord
Yes I agree with Darin and Cobra-R that the stock brakes if modified with the right pads and some cooling ducts etc. should be good enough for open track days if not pushed right to the limit. I just changed the front pads on mine last night and one thing that had happened was that the rubber dust/water boots on two of the pistons were burned right off so I will be replacing them also.

Gord

The dust boots will melt off any time you do an open track event. I ran my AS car without dust boots (they melted right off also) for five years with no ill affects.


Brian
Do you ever come out East to do any track events? BTW I am still looking for a good brake duct kit for my 03' (that is priced reasonable).

I don't think the Wilwood's are the best....they just look like a very good value for the money. Wilwood has a decent amount of racing backround and I think they are offering a quality brake upgrade for the money.

 

[Cobra-R]

Darin,
The furthest east I have run in Road Atlanta last year, other than that Gingerman in south haven Mi. (be there next week in fact).

I wasn't cutting down the willwoods, I just don't know if they are the best or not, so I want to stay nuetral on that issue.

A major concern with track use is heat. The caliper (whether willwood, Brembo, ect) is not going to do much to address that issue. You can do more good with upgrading rotors (although the stock Brembo's are very decent rotors) to a better unit. The best rotors that I am aware of is the Brembo two piece floating design. They are spendy, but you will probly do more overall good with an upgrade in that area than with calipers. I have no direct experience with the Baer eradi-speed rotors, but just for the record, they are not a full floating rotor even though they are a two piece design.

The dust boots melting is a fact of life with high heat, my Brembo's have been burned off for quite some time. In fact, some of the really high quality brake kits don't even have dust boots just because you won't keep them in tact.

Brian

 

[harry gilbert]

Originally posted by Poisonous Mods
But didnt FORD think of it before they released the cars? Not cool when the guy next to you is a Porsha & he says ( Looks like you need to upgrade ur brakes next ). This is what caught my attention to the smoke.

Sure, but they don't really WANT you to race. If they did, they wouldn't put the note in the SVT Supplement about installing better Ford Racing parts voiding the warranty. Besides, if you crash and destroy the car you will need to buy another one (if you live). Aaaah, marketing.....

 

[Poisonous Mods]

Id say Darwin & Cobra-R got great points. Going to have to change to braided stainless brake lines & change the rotors to some crossed drilled ones. Also some break ducts for about 150.00 should help .

Brakes are o.k. for just normal driving but im not a granny so its about having some spirited driving exp. with the car, right?

 

[Poisonous Mods]

Oh...Wait what brakes lines should i get? I can get a friend to help me out but want to get some real good ones that can stand up to the high temps.....

Also do the rears need to be changed as well?

 

[Cobra-R]

Originally posted by Poisonous Mods
Id say Darwin & Cobra-R got great points. Going to have to change to braided stainless brake lines & change the rotors to some crossed drilled ones. Also some break ducts for about 150.00 should help .

Brakes are o.k. for just normal driving but im not a granny so its about having some spirited driving exp. with the car, right?

Stay away from drilled rotors, they will not hold up to hard use!!!! You are better off with stock rotors than drilled rotors of any kind!!!!


Brian

 

[Poisonous Mods]

Cobra-R..what about slotted rotors?
Also any advise on the brake lines on which to get?

 

[03'Darin]

Originally posted by Poisonous Mods
Id say Darwin & Cobra-R got great points. Going to have to change to braided stainless brake lines & change the rotors to some crossed drilled ones. Also some break ducts for about 150.00 should help .

Brakes are o.k. for just normal driving but im not a granny so its about having some spirited driving exp. with the car, right?

D-a-r-i-n's....(sorry had to do that) suggestion would be to upgrade the front lines (I am looking for a DOT kit for the 03's as I get time but have not gotten any yet) which I think Russell has. The rear brakes don't generate heat like the fronts do so you won't NEED the rears.....however they will be more durable and give better pedal feel if you do all four.

Get a good set of pads. Brian and I have discussed this rather thoroughly in some other posts....do a search for brakes and check them out. Everyone has there own opinion about pads....mine is the Performance Friction 83's. Read some posts and determine what you think would be best for you.

Put on some good brake ducts. You won't believe the difference in braking when the rotors are kept cool.

I would do these items before I invested in new rotors. But...as I said before...it's all in what works best for you.

Darin

 

[Cobra-R]

Originally posted by Poisonous Mods
Cobra-R..what about slotted rotors?
Also any advise on the brake lines on which to get?

Read this: http://corner-carvers.com/altimathread.php.html It is long but gets quite ammusing the further you read, but you will learn a ton.

I am running slotted brembo two piece rotors now, but as you can see from this site it isn't recommended. Brembo says that on these rotors the slots are cast in the rotor as opposed to being ground in after the rotor is made which is suppose to keep the rotor from being stressed. There are a number of people in the R forum that have been running these for a while, so they do seem to be holding up under track use. AndyM tried a set of drilled in his two piece setup and I think he pulled them off after one or two events.

To answer your question; I would buy solid unless you are gona spend the mucho bucks for the "good" rotors, but as darin (or is it darwin? ) said it is overkill.

Brian

Edit: I didn't mention I use the slotted brembo two piece because they don't offer a solid rotor.