i haven't had a newer mustang but my 90 gt is fine for DD duty. they don't get too bad of mileage cause they're light and have tall gears and as long as you have a heater for the winter they're fine. you just gotta be super careful in the rain.CY98Cobra said:
Set me Straight! 01' Bullitt or 93' Cobra
- Thread starter Bullitt #3067
- Start date
My Bullitt is NOT my daily driver. Nor would any fox that I may purchase. Don't misunderstang, my Bullitt is an absolute blast to drive and puts a smile on my face everytime I get in it. It just does'nt have that neck snapping torque I'm looking for. All of my friends have told me to just throw a KB on it and call it done.
I could do that, but......................................
In the last several years, fox-bodies have really grown on me. Every show or mag I'm always curious about them, never modulars. I read the 5.0 forums on stangnet daily. I think I have this fascination because I've never owned one.
Now, if I were to purchase one and completely "finish" it................ are they all that they are cracked up to be???
Like I stated in my first post. Many have told me that I'm CRAZY to go back to a fox-body! It would not feel half as good as my Bullitt (and DO LOVE how my Bullitt handles).
But hey, you can make a fox handle well too, right? It was either the last issue of 5.0 Mustang or MM&FF that had that INCREDIBLE silver coupe on the cover. At the end of the article, the owner had commented that his coupe 'outhandled' his wife's 03' cobra! (his suspension was completely re-done).
So, you guys are the owners of the best foxes ever. If you were me, what would you do???????????
Keep Bullitt or Build a 'complete' fox
Set me straight!
I could do that, but......................................
In the last several years, fox-bodies have really grown on me. Every show or mag I'm always curious about them, never modulars. I read the 5.0 forums on stangnet daily. I think I have this fascination because I've never owned one.
Now, if I were to purchase one and completely "finish" it................ are they all that they are cracked up to be???
Like I stated in my first post. Many have told me that I'm CRAZY to go back to a fox-body! It would not feel half as good as my Bullitt (and DO LOVE how my Bullitt handles).
But hey, you can make a fox handle well too, right? It was either the last issue of 5.0 Mustang or MM&FF that had that INCREDIBLE silver coupe on the cover. At the end of the article, the owner had commented that his coupe 'outhandled' his wife's 03' cobra! (his suspension was completely re-done).
So, you guys are the owners of the best foxes ever. If you were me, what would you do???????????
Keep Bullitt or Build a 'complete' fox
Set me straight!
Bullitt #3067 said:
Man honestly its just gonna come down to personal preference. There both great cars and each have there pros an cons. But as I mentioned if your wanting to build somethin seriously fast and what I mean seriously fast I would say 10.99s on down. Your gonna be able to do it much cheaper w/a fox. For what I think your lookin for; me personally I'd find a GT that is possibly already partly "finished" meaning already has 31 spline diff in place, tremec, etc. Then go from there, if you really want the "cobra" look go for it. As you should know the sky is the limit for the 5oh brethen. But; if you want more of that snappy torque I wouldn't see any problem w/running a 100 shot of juice on that Bullitt. Juice definately gives a real torquey feel; trust me. ;-)
I Have An 03 Cobra, And A Fox Dd 91lx 5.0. Love Them Both!
Being A Ford Tech The "bullitt" As You Call It Is Just Ok. Now the 03-04 cobra's are quick, but do not seem to have the room in them as a Fox body
Dont get me wrong I like the power of the new cobra's, but that same power can easily be put in the Fox body.
Suspension is an easy add on to the Fox bodies as well, remember the money you save buying a Fox can be used for bolt ons and suspension upgrades
In my opinion DUMP the "Bullitt"
Dont get me wrong I like the power of the new cobra's, but that same power can easily be put in the Fox body.
Suspension is an easy add on to the Fox bodies as well, remember the money you save buying a Fox can be used for bolt ons and suspension upgrades
In my opinion DUMP the "Bullitt"
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Bullitt #3067 said:
We cannot answer that. We don't know what you like or what you might like to drive.
Do I like my foxes over the later models? Yes
Do I like to drive my 93 on long trips more than my wife's 01 cobra? Definitely
BADBOYSPACK said:
I didn't know that 200RWHP was "easy to come by" :rollseyes It's not "easy" to double the horsepower on a fox. 500 HP is also about the max without splitting the block in half. A stock bullit should easily outperform a stock 5.0.
If the car wont be a daily driver, then its all in what you like better. Those 5.0s look great, especially the cobras. What ever you do, dont buy a near stock 93 cobra to mod the crap out of it.
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opps, double post.
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Beetle6986 said:
Uhh; yeah it actually is quite easy to double the power on a 302. Well lets see its pretty endless how to do it. Cubes, supercharger, turbocharger, nitrous, or any combination. I can't see doubling the output of that 4.6 in NA trim. I'd say some really stout 306s out there in NA trim are putting down twice the original output the stock 302 came with. A stroked 302 (327, 331, 342, 347) should easily attain double power output with the right combo. Then add blower, turbo, or juice and you've pulled away to a level the "bullitt" wouldn't have a chance of attaining. Also I would be willing to bet a bonestock 93 Cobra could hang very easily w/a Bullitt. Slap some 3.73s, bumped timing, shortbelt, and a good driver and I'd say the Bullitt would lose for sure.
Fiveoh93Snake said:
Uhh, your definition of easy is probably not the same as most others. Increasing cubes, supercharging, turbocharging and nitrous aren't considered to be easy, inexpensive or reliable mods for a stock internals 5.0. (NOS would fit the cheap category). Those are all heavy mods, except the NOS.
Fiveoh93Snake said:
I was refering to the comment comparing to the 03 Cobra, not the bullit. The horsepower was already double what the 5.0s were from the factory.
Fiveoh93Snake said:
3.73s, and a tune are not "stock". I was also comparing the cars, not the drivers. You'd have to make up about .5 seconds in the 1/4 mile.
LEE93COBRA said:
Try asking the woman in the passenger seat which car is more comfortable. I'd be willing to bet that its not the 5.0.
Beetle6986 said:
Well; first off I can admit some of the choices I posted could be termed as not necessarily easy to double the output on a 5oh. Increasing displacement would more then likely fit the bill as the most time consuming and pretty costly to double output. Supercharging I would still say would fall in as an "easy" way to double the original output. Any competent shade tree mechanic with a decent amount of knowledge would be able to install a supercharger and supporting components. Bottom line would come down to wallet thickness. Turbocharging would be a little more involved and probably wouldn't quite fall in easy but I dam sure wouldn't say its hard. Nitrous would definately fall in as easy and cheap such as you stated. And yes I would definately say all would fall in as reliable; I've definately seen a shitload of 5ohs with any of the above and live past 150K miles. So basically I still say; yeah its pretty easy to double output of a stock 5oh.
The overall comparison of the thread is a Bullitt vs. 93 Cobra (or foxbody) and I would friggin hope a 32Valve DOHC 4.6L w/a blower could at least double the output of a lowely 5oh; if not you better sell that pos.
My statment of 93Cobra vs. Bullitt was bonestock trim w/out a single mod; and I'll say again the 93Cobra should hang w/the Bullitt absolutely no problem. A little bit better driver in the Cobra and the Bullitt driver could have his hands full. I may be off on my guess here but I would think a bonestock 93Cobra could run a 13.8 no prob w/good driver an decent weather. A friend of mine had a Dark Highland Green Bullitt and when he was bonestock I believe he was turning 13.60s-70s so that should make it pretty close. The comparison w/just a couple mods (3.73s, shortbelt, bumped timing) was just to show how easy it would be to outrun the Bullitt. So no sense in gettin your panties in a wad.
oke: And of course I would think the woman would say the 99+ Cobra in this case would be more "comfortable" to her. Just as I stated before I had a 2000GT, 5 speed w/grey leather. Naturally JMO but to me the SN-95 cars are more of a "chick" car. Foxes just seem to be the more of a hotrod mans man car. The statement about bad expectations for a 13 year old daily driver is simply ludicrous; if the car is built right and routine maintenance performed on it then there shouldn't be any worries of driving it everyday. I've taken mine on several trips from Tennessee to Texas without one problem; and at the push of a button I'm just over 500HP. :shrug: Anything else I need to clear up for ya? :rollseyes
Again, your post has confirmed that in reality it isn't that easy. Even with all the things you mentioned above, you still need all the supporting mods. I have also seen 5.0s live to 150K with FI. The turbos are superchargers were installed at 130K, not 0 miles. I don't know why you're taking this as an attack against you or your car. I have a 5.0 now and I have owned others. The average joe doesn't have FI or NOS. Its easy to pay for anything if money isn't a concern (for most people it is). If its that easy, I guess everybody should have done it by now.Fiveoh93Snake said:Well; first off I can admit some of the choices I posted could be termed as not necessarily easy to double the output on a 5oh. Increasing displacement would more then likely fit the bill as the most time consuming and pretty costly to double output. Supercharging I would still say would fall in as an "easy" way to double the original output. Any competent shade tree mechanic with a decent amount of knowledge would be able to install a supercharger and supporting components. Bottom line would come down to wallet thickness. Turbocharging would be a little more involved and probably wouldn't quite fall in easy but I dam sure wouldn't say its hard. Nitrous would definately fall in as easy and cheap such as you stated. And yes I would definately say all would fall in as reliable; I've definately seen a shitload of 5ohs with any of the above and live past 150K miles. So basically I still say; yeah its pretty easy to double output of a stock 5oh.
Thats why I told him I would keep the Bullitt. Looks like I've pushed one of your buttons.Fiveoh93Snake said:The overall comparison of the thread is a Bullitt vs. 93 Cobra (or foxbody) and I would friggin hope a 32Valve DOHC 4.6L w/a blower could at least double the output of a lowely 5oh; if not you better sell that pos.
:lol: Who seems to be all bent out of shape?Fiveoh93Snake said:So no sense in gettin your panties in a wad.
So you don't think they improved the ride comfort in the mustang in the 13 year period? Well, they have, its not an opinion, its a fact. No reason to argue it.Fiveoh93Snake said:
Nope, you pretty much confirmed everything i stated in my last post.Fiveoh93Snake said:
Try not to get upset to easily. BTW, nice cobra you have there. :beer:
Beetle6986 said:Again, your post has confirmed that in reality it isn't that easy. Even with all the things you mentioned above, you still need all the supporting mods. I have also seen 5.0s live to 150K with FI. The turbos are superchargers were installed at 130K, not 0 miles. I don't know why you're taking this as an attack against you or your car. I have a 5.0 now and I have owned others. The average joe doesn't have FI or NOS. Its easy to pay for anything if money isn't a concern (for most people it is). If its that easy, I guess everybody should have done it by now.
Thats why I told him I would keep the Bullitt. Looks like I've pushed one of your buttons.
:lol: Who seems to be all bent out of shape?
So you don't think they improved the ride comfort in the mustang in the 13 year period? Well, they have, its not an opinion, its a fact. No reason to argue it.
Nope, you pretty much confirmed everything i stated in my last post.
Ok; since all ya wanna do is argue with me and/or anyone else in this thread about this I'll lay it out plain an simple for ya so maybe this time you can understand it. First off naturally we have two separate opinions that we are both entitled to. But; I think your forgetting what forum your in (SVTPerformance, Cobra Forums, FoxBody Cobras); secondly do you have either car? Do you have any experience with either car? Nope didn't think so; so kindly shut your pie hole an close the door on your way out. But before you do finish readin this.
Basically I'll sum it up quickly for ya; just a few minor boltons and a 150 shot of juice and BINGO you've doubled ouput of a stock 5oh. Thats pretty fockin easy pal. And I highly doubt hardly any people installed a supercharger or turbo or nitrous on there car at 130K miles; that statement is simply idiotic. And yes I would say more average Joe's than you think have any of the three or are heavily modded in NA trim. Just thumb threw many of the cars on this website or Corall or elsewhere.
The only reason you've pushed my button is the fact that you come in the FoxBody Cobra Forum and start makin wise cracks about two cars you have no clue about.
I'm not the one that got all bent out of shape when BadBoys commented about how easy it would be to put that power in a FoxBody. Your the one that started off with the "rolling eyes smart ass remarks".
And yes as a matter of fact it is a matter of opinion; my opinion is the 94+ cars are "chick" cars. I've owned one as I stated; I couldn't stand the dam thing to be honest. Power was decent for a 4.6 but that was it. At 6'4" I had less knee room with that ugly ass double hump dash. Seats felt like I sat ON them instead of IN them like my Cobra. Bottom line underpinnings were still FOX chassis derived. Wasn't improved that dam much like your tryin to make it sound. So basically once again; we have two separate opinions which we are both entitled too. Now kindly shut the door on your way out.
"Anyone else" was only you. I was reading recent posts, I wasn't hanging out in "your" forum. Any experience? plenty. Did you miss the cars listed in my sig (that was in the past year alone).Fiveoh93Snake said:
Fiveoh93Snake said:
Go ahead and run your 150 shot everyday and see if you engine last for 150,000. I haven't seen too many 5.0s that were supercharged or had turbo for an entire 150,000 miles. BTW, this website and Corall doesn't represent the average joe (Its probably more like 1% of the mustang community).
As stated above, I have experience with more than one car from both generations. You're not the only one that has knowledge on both cars.Fiveoh93Snake said:
You took it way to seriously.Fiveoh93Snake said:
You might be the exception, not everybody is 6'4". The suspension was improved. The floor plan, crossmember, x-brace under the oil pan, the mounting loaction and spindles were modified, the control arms are longer, etc. I was talking about ride comfort, not fun factor or space. Sorry to come into "your" forum. Sounds like you don't like to hear others opinions.Fiveoh93Snake said:
Beetle6986 said:
I'm not the only one you decided to argue with or try and shoot someone elses statements down with some kind of smart ass comment. You've done the same thing w/me, BadBoys, and Lee93; read your above posts dude. Its pretty dam obvious to me you obviously prefer the newer cars way over any Fox from your statements. Bottom line if you look at it from a value standpoint the Cobra wins out. Cobras in very good to excellent condition can easily net $15k I would gather a 2001 Bullitt will only pull in a few thousand more probably still less than $20k, thats not too good in the Bullitts favor considering the Cobra is almost a decade older. From a mod potential standpoint the Cobra once again wins out; this time by a landslide, potential for Cobra is endless, Bullitt basically has a "cap" where its only gonna go so far and then your "done". Cost is also gonna play a huge role here; lets say 10 second timeslips were the goal, mod for mod its gonna cost more to get that Bullitt there. In the looks department I'd say its a tossup but a small favor once again for the Cobra; bottom line there both good lookin cars. But in this case I just don't think the Bullitt has the muscular look goin like the Cobra and definately not in the same class as the 03-04 Cobras. Naturally that last statement is my opinion.
I did run my 125 shot on my 90GT from 80 somethin thousand miles when I bought it until 168K when I finally pulled motor and went with a 306. Another friend of mine bought his 90GT with around 60K and he started sprayin at about 70K from what I remember and it lived until he pulled motor out w/ 130K plus. You know what; when we tore that motor down it was spotless, crosshatches still very visible, was not using any oil (Mobil 1 Syn) but he had a 306 LongRod ready to drop in it. So yes with the proper tune the 302 can live a long happy life on FI.
As far as comfort I would still have to give the nod to the Cobra; like I stated I had a 2000GT, silver, 5speed, w/grey leather, seats were horendous, felt like you sat on them rather than in them like any other fox body with the "sport" type seating. Now definately if your comparing 93Cobra to 03-04 Cobra I'd give the nod hands down to the newer Cobra, w/the added bolstering just from the looks (haven't sat in one) I'd say they've gotta rock. You would definately have more experience with that. By the way nice car. :beer: Now stop makin me anticipate your next post prick.
Hey I would like to add that I am one of those idiotic people. Threw nitrous on my car at 124k miles and ran it until 167k miles when I add the D-1 at 14 psi. Cracked a piston 4k miles later due to bad gas I picked up in Tennessee (or at least I think)
Just like 5oh I am over 500 rwhp.
Why are we comparing 4v in the mix? A Bullitt is a 2v, so yeah stock for stock a 93 cobra and a 01 Bullitt are going to be similar in power output. yeah the 5.0 has limited longevity at 500rwhp and above but guess what, 4.6 2v are limited starting around 400rwhp due to weak rods.
Oh and far as asking a woman which she prefers, my wife is pretty happy in my 93
Cracked a piston 4k miles later due to bad gas I picked up in Tennessee (or at least I think)Just like 5oh I am over 500 rwhp.
Why are we comparing 4v in the mix? A Bullitt is a 2v, so yeah stock for stock a 93 cobra and a 01 Bullitt are going to be similar in power output. yeah the 5.0 has limited longevity at 500rwhp and above but guess what, 4.6 2v are limited starting around 400rwhp due to weak rods.
Oh and far as asking a woman which she prefers, my wife is pretty happy in my 93
. LOL.Fiveoh93Snake said:Now stop makin me anticipate your next post prick.
.Fiveoh93Snake said:
15K is pretty steep for a 93 cobra unless it has extremely low miles. But, you're absolutely right about the cobra holding its value better than the bullitt.
The limit for modding a bullitt vs the cobra is debatable. The 4.6s have been around long enough to have the same mods available as there are for the 5.0. I agree with you 100% on the looks. I love the look of the 93 cobras, but thats just my opinion. I helped my cousin to get all the parts to convert his 90 5.0 to a cobra look a like this summer.
. I don't doubt what you said. But use power a few times a day and you will definitely shorten the life of the motor. All depends on how hard you are on it. You can beat the crap out of a stock 5.0 at every redlight and have it easily last over 100,000. Try the same thing with the 125 shot.Fiveoh93Snake said:
Fiveoh93Snake said:As far as comfort I would still have to give the nod to the Cobra; like I stated I had a 2000GT, silver, 5speed, w/grey leather, seats were horendous, felt like you sat on them rather than in them like any other fox body with the "sport" type seating. Now definately if your comparing 93Cobra to 03-04 Cobra I'd give the nod hands down to the newer Cobra, w/the added bolstering just from the looks (haven't sat in one) I'd say they've gotta rock. You would definately have more experience with that. By the way nice car. :beer: Now stop makin me anticipate your next post prick.
You're right about both year cobras. The seats will hold you in a hell of a lot better that the bullits. As you said, its like you're sitting on the seats in the 4.6 rather than in them and you slide all over the freaking place going around turns, but the cushion is a hell of a lot softer! The cobras are more like performance/racing seats where as the 4.6s seats or geared more towards luxury a bit more.
Go to www.turbomustangs.com There are some people over there that have reliable super quick foxbody's, some use them as their daily driver. Let's say you had a 96+ up car, and a foxbody car.. goal was to get into the high 9's. At that power level, both cars would need aftermarket blocks and the supporting internals. You WILL do it cheaper with a foxbody! there's people running 10's on stock everything, they also use the cars for daily commuters. I definately vote for the fox, parts are cheaper, and they look just flat out mean.
I'm 6'7" and i have two fox body mustangs currently. I have a 93 GT that i'm making into a fun open track car and i just picked up a 90 GT Vert that i'm gonna make into a fun cruiser.
I cant bring myself to "move up" to the newer body style cars. I love my Foxes. I want to find myself a nice SVO to build after i get done rebuilding the Vert (i bought it for 100 bucks from a friend of mine... the car is a basket case but this way i can do it the way I want from the start)
Look at the American Iron cars and the guys that run them successfully. There is a reason Maximum Motorsports and Griggs Racing win with Foxes.
Start with the Chassis.... Thru-the-floor subframe connectors, Tubular K-member, torque arm/panhard bar, coilovers, Baer 5 lug... thats the start of something truely beautiful. Move to the interior... add some Recaro SRD/Speed seats, take the rears out with a nice delete kit, build yourself a cage, add all the necessary gauges and you have one of the nicest mustang interiors ever made. The engine options are endless... I have a soft spot for 351 swaps in foxes. Add a blower and with the right combo you have an easy 450-500 at the wheels in conservative tune. I'd go with a Gforce T5 over the popular T56 swap. A Torsen rear with some 3.55s mmmmmmmmm :rockon:
My Vert is gonna be somewhat of a bastard child... 93 Cobra front grill and rear bumper, 1.5" cowl hood, Saleen rear wing, Classic Design Concepts Styling bar, Maximum Motorsports Road and Track kit, Chrome Pony wheels, 93 Cobra rear disks, Recaro SE front seats, recovered rear seats to match, LX tail lights, Smoked fogs with clear headlights. I'm getting giddy thinking about its Carlisle 06 debut.
In my opinion you could do all this to a cobra but I would only rip apart a cobra if money was not an issue. Then we start talking about names like Moton, Fikse, Motec.... There is a great 93 Cobra for sale on the griggs site right now... http://www.griggsracing.com/garagesale/93Cobra.pdf
Good luck
I cant bring myself to "move up" to the newer body style cars. I love my Foxes. I want to find myself a nice SVO to build after i get done rebuilding the Vert (i bought it for 100 bucks from a friend of mine... the car is a basket case but this way i can do it the way I want from the start)
Look at the American Iron cars and the guys that run them successfully. There is a reason Maximum Motorsports and Griggs Racing win with Foxes.
Start with the Chassis.... Thru-the-floor subframe connectors, Tubular K-member, torque arm/panhard bar, coilovers, Baer 5 lug... thats the start of something truely beautiful. Move to the interior... add some Recaro SRD/Speed seats, take the rears out with a nice delete kit, build yourself a cage, add all the necessary gauges and you have one of the nicest mustang interiors ever made. The engine options are endless... I have a soft spot for 351 swaps in foxes. Add a blower and with the right combo you have an easy 450-500 at the wheels in conservative tune. I'd go with a Gforce T5 over the popular T56 swap. A Torsen rear with some 3.55s mmmmmmmmm :rockon:
My Vert is gonna be somewhat of a bastard child... 93 Cobra front grill and rear bumper, 1.5" cowl hood, Saleen rear wing, Classic Design Concepts Styling bar, Maximum Motorsports Road and Track kit, Chrome Pony wheels, 93 Cobra rear disks, Recaro SE front seats, recovered rear seats to match, LX tail lights, Smoked fogs with clear headlights. I'm getting giddy thinking about its Carlisle 06 debut.
In my opinion you could do all this to a cobra but I would only rip apart a cobra if money was not an issue. Then we start talking about names like Moton, Fikse, Motec.... There is a great 93 Cobra for sale on the griggs site right now... http://www.griggsracing.com/garagesale/93Cobra.pdf
Good luck
You ought to dump the Bullit.....in the meantime find a 93 GT to highly modify
at your pleasure. A local friend of mine has gone this route and has made a
SLICK, black 93 Cobra clone which went one more step....t-tops (how I'd love to add t-tops to my Teal 93 tho that temptation has been quashed by my t-topped 82 GT.) Then, if the 93 Cobra is still pulling at your heartstrings,
find one and enjoy it w/o modifying it........or find one which is already heavily
modified in the first place.
Whatever you do, don't get an :bowdown:unmodified 93 Cobra and do your deeds to it, PLEASE!!!
:coolman:
at your pleasure. A local friend of mine has gone this route and has made a
SLICK, black 93 Cobra clone which went one more step....t-tops (how I'd love to add t-tops to my Teal 93 tho that temptation has been quashed by my t-topped 82 GT.) Then, if the 93 Cobra is still pulling at your heartstrings,
find one and enjoy it w/o modifying it........or find one which is already heavily
modified in the first place.
Whatever you do, don't get an :bowdown:unmodified 93 Cobra and do your deeds to it, PLEASE!!!
:coolman:
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