Sct x3 vs x4 vs live wire + pro racer ?

[Maxspeed04svt]

Hey guys , I'm a new member here but I've had my 04 cobra for a few weeks now. It has a ported blower and the basic bolt ons with a 2.76 pulley

I'm a former owner of a few Ls cars/trucks and I'm very experienced with hp tuners, unfortunately I don't think they will be supporting 04 mustangs any time soon.

The cobra already has a tune from the previous owner and I haven't made any major changes to the car but would like to.

There's so many options with the sct , and I want to make sure I get a unit that lets me make timing and fuel changes myself without the need of a vender .

I'd also like the ability to log a output voltage from a Wideband , and on top of that log to a laptop if possible .

I don't want to spend the big money on the proracer + live wire if I don't have to, but I also don't want to buy a unit that is dependent on someone else.

Thanks

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

the handheld tuners, assuming your tune leaves the tune unlocked, will allow limited timing adjustments over an rpm range. If I remember right it might have timing advance/retard 0 -4krpm and 4k to 7rpm (depending on the car for the max rpm of course). The fueling changes through the handheld itself are pretty limited as well. If you want to make in depth/detailed changes you need the proracer software

Any SCT handheld will allow you to log two analog inputs, I believe most of them use a version of a fire wire cable (cut the connector off one end and splice into it there per the SCT directions).

You can log with a laptop using their free software.

I would check again on HP Tuners, they were hoping to have our cars supported late last year/early this year last I heard but I havent looked for any updates.

 

[Maxspeed04svt]

Ya I emailed hp tuners and they said they don't have a estimated support date, they have been saying "soon" for the past year.

So any of the handheld sct tuners , even the basic x3 combined with the pro racer will let me make make detailed and depth changes ?
I don't need the fancy screen on the x4 as long as the x3 has all the same features.

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

the pro racer software is what lets you make all the indepth changes, you dont even need a tuner hooked up to the laptop at the time. Once youve created the tune and saved it, you load the tune to the handheld then use the handheld to load it to the car.

The nice thing with the X4 that it can update wirelessly and that you can you can setup the PIDs available to log with the X4 and you can log a lot of things without having to hook up your laptop. But if that doesnt matter then yes, even an X3 will do fine.

The only thing Im not real sure of is the ease of datalogging when a laptop ISNT hooked up (ie making a blast down the drag strip, Ive never tried to log a pass like that)

 

[Maxspeed04svt]

I ordered the x4 for now since its pretty much the same cost as the x3, just so I can see the tune and maybe make minnor changes.

I'll wait on the pro racer in hopes hp tuners will support us soon ?

Thanks for the help .

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

remember that part of the adjustability depends on what options the person writing the tune leaves available. They can leave very limited options or even zero end user options. Id go with a tuner that allows unlimited revisions in the meantime if its a problem

 

[Maxspeed04svt]

That's what worries me as well.

The vehicle has been tuned before by a shop a very long distance away. ( I purchased it out of state)

What are my options if the tune is locked ?
Will the proracer version give me access ?

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

you need the original tune file to be able to make changes, youll need to contact the shop that tuned it and ask them to email you the tune file so you can load it onto the handheld. I would ask them what user options they leave open on their tunes and discuss it with them.

the pro racer version wont give you access to the current tune, typically the file the tuner sends you is a locked/secured file, you cant open it with proracer and modify it. Most tuners wont send out an unlocked file because they dont want people copying their work/selling it as their own. Youd pretty much need to start from scratch in proracer (although the value files already loaded in pro racer should get it pretty ballpark close for most setups)

 

[BO TY KLR]

Buy the pro racer package from don lasota. He' ll build you a base tune for your car/mods to work off of.

 

[Maxspeed04svt]

My car already has a base tune I don't need another , I want to be able to make additional changes myself.



If the current tune is locked, will I still be able to at least read the file ?

Any way around doing it without getting the stock file from the original tuner ?

I'm not exactly sure if who tuned it is around anymore , it was a shop out of Memphis named spectacle solutions that Ive read has folded

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

if the tune is locked you cant do anything with it. If you dont have the tune either already on a handheld or saved on a computer theres not much you can do from my understanding.

I thought I recalled in the past that Sniper tuning software could read an SCT file but I dunno how that works at all.

 

[lowranger96]

yes, if the ecu is flashed via an xcal, sniper can read the tune (bin file) off of the ecu and then you can modify it. This is also the case with binary editor. Either way, if you want to use PRP to make further changes you will either have to start from scratch or get the tune file from the tuner.. or have someone with binary editor/quarterhorse read the bin file off the ecu and then find someone that can translate it into an sct mtf.

I like the Binary editor stuff because I can make a change to the tune, hit update while the vehicle is running and immediately see the change that I made through the way the vehicle is running. This makes dialing in the MAF 20x faster.

 

[Maxspeed04svt]

How is the ease of use to the binary editor compared to the hp tuners software, is there more then one option for the binary editor ?

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

i have zero experience with that

 

[lowranger96]

Ease of use is basically the same in all OEM based tuning systems imo. BE vs SCT it seems the same, I find BE to be nicer.

With Binary editor and a 04-older car you can either direct flash or you can burn chips. Using the QH instead of the direct flash allows you to realtime tune the ecu with the car running and lightning fast updates. With 05+ direct flash is the only option

 

[Maxspeed04svt]

Is there any way of figuring out what kind of tune was used in it ?

How could I find out if it has one of the chip style tunes ? The previous buyer domes realy know much besides where it was tuned and the shop that did it is out of buisness

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

to check for a chip pull the pass footwell cover, the computer is in there, the opening for a chip is pointing towards the floor I do believe

 

[Don 95Vert]

The J3 port is on the upper part of the PCM. The connector is towards the floor. You have to pull the chip if it has one or you cannot flash the PCM with a handheld.

Honestly, you are always better starting from scratch with a tune. The tune you have in it now may be perfect, or it may not be perfect, or it may be a hack job that runs OK. With the old dealer out of business, you never know - not a knock on them as they may have been terrific, the point being, you really will never know. If you do it correctly, you know it will be right, then you'll be able to modify it for whatever you do in the future. Plus it is far easier starting from scratch than searching for errors in a tune.

Don't confuse 'locked tunes' with either 'tuning' or end user adjustability on a handheld. Many of us do not enable adjustments because they mostly are global adders/subtractors which are not a good way to do things. Think, pull 5% fuel in the heat of summer, then on a 50* day in the fall, it suddenly goes lean. Tuner correctly it is much less likely to do that. All editable tunes in SCT Advantage software are locked by SCT. They had an issue several years ago with some idiot stealing tunes from other dealers and selling them saying he did them.

SCT is really the gold standard for these these cars and I use them all extensively. The SCT value files make it a very powerful system - mainly for injectors and making your own value files. Moates/BE is terrific as long as you purchase your strategies from someone who really knows what they are doing, like Adam at Pops Racing. I would not want to run a QuarterHorse on an OBD2 vehicle because of the chip to PCM connection issues that can happen - poor connection to the PCM, hit a bump, fry the PCM and the QH. A direct flash option form Moates is the way to go - you cannot do live updates, but IMHO, that's mainly helpful for sorting out idle issues.

As soon as Eric gets all the 2015+ cars worked out and completes the earlier stuff the HP Tuners should be right up there with SCT.

Hope this helps!!

Don LaSota

 

[Maxspeed04svt]

Thanks Don , the reasons you specified are the exact reasons why I want to access the tune- ya it runs , but I feel like a lot can be left on the table , and the fact that the shop went under isn't very comforting. Starting From scratch isn't a bad idea, just seems like it's not achievable with just sct software.

I never realized how easy hp tuners was to use untill now

 

[Don 95Vert]

Starting from scratch with SCT software is very achievable - I have done it thousands of times - and IMHO, it is the easiest most complete solution out there. And I have experience with all of them.