Kooks 1 5/8 headers before and after

[Jumpmaster2015]

A few things:
You mention one pull was in 4th, what gear were the rest in? Should be 5th, lower gears should give lower numbers. Given that the 4th gear pull was the highest, were the rest in 3rd? That could be hurting your numbers.

Second, sur_real and grabber are right. You have pretty conservative cams and have strived to maintain a strong mid range. That typically limits your horsepower numbers but gives you a wider power band (and you have a very fantastically wide and flat power band from 6k straight to almost 8k, that is not a bad thing).

Which brings me to my third point: you don't stop making power at 6k, you level off at 6k and continue to make basically peak power for almost 2k rpm. Your top end is not by any means "murdered"

I'd expect your combo to be making about 460-470rwhp. Either the dyno is reading low or you are actually down on power for whatever reason, but the only way to know for sure is go get some trap speeds and see what she does at the track.

1. The other pulls were in 5th gear.
2. What is a wider power band going to accomplish? I am aware the dyno is only a tuning tool, numbers are only numbers. Is making peak power for 2k going to help me at all?
3. Yeah I need to get to the track, there is a big event coming up on labor day weekend. I will share my results!

 

[Grabber]

^^^^ X2.

Is your car a 6-speed manual? If so, any pull not in 5th, which is a 1:1 ratio, will result in skewed numbers.

Don't let this get you down. Datalog, figure out what's wrong, troubleshoot and move on. I don't think there is anything wrong with the CJ, but, dialing in a specific cam combo with the CJ can be tricky and requires manipulation.

Who is currently tuning the car?

 

[noldevin]

1. The other pulls were in 5th gear.
2. What is a wider power band going to accomplish? I am aware the dyno is only a tuning tool, numbers are only numbers. Is making peak power for 2k going to help me at all?
3. Yeah I need to get to the track, there is a big event coming up on labor day weekend. I will share my results!

2. - A wider power band allows you to make peak power for longer.
My car typically drops 1000-1500 RPM when I shift. I don't remember exactly what it was. But for simplicity's sake lets say you have two cars that both drop 1000rpm each shift. Which of these do you think would be faster (assuming each line is 500rpm)?

This is where average hp is more important than peak hp. If you are only able to make peak hp for a short time, it's not worth much more than a number for bragging rights. A car with a slightly lower peak but more average hp in the power band will be faster.

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

2. - A wider power band allows you to make peak power for longer.
My car typically drops 1000-1500 RPM when I shift. I don't remember exactly what it was. But for simplicity's sake lets say you have two cars that both drop 1000rpm each shift. Which of these do you think would be faster (assuming each line is 500rpm)?

This is where average hp is more important than peak hp. If you are only able to make peak hp for a short time, it's not worth much more than a number for bragging rights. A car with a slightly lower peak but more average hp in the power band will be faster.

I like it. Ill see where she sits at the track!

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

So im at NHRA Nationals at brainard intermational raceway rightway right now, and I was parking my car next to a town and country. Low and behold, I hear the charecteristic rattle of loose exhaust coming from my car. We were stuck next to each other for about 10 minutes, its definitely my car. I remember hearing it while camping a couple weeks ago too. Im going to datalog on the dyno asap. This is new since I logged on the street

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

It happened again today, a very loud rattle from my engine bay while I was driving/parked at Sears. I took a video but my phone recorded in 1280x720, so a 20 second video is 24MB, and it's too big to share here. It is usually not loud enough to hear over the exhaust, but I think it could still be causing a problem with false knock issues at high RPMs on the roller. I am looking forward to datalogging on the dyno and at least chasing down the rattle noise.

 

[sur_real1]

When they installed your headers, did they keep the studs or swap them out for the Stage 8 locking bolts that come with the kit?

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

When they installed your headers, did they keep the studs or swap them out for the Stage 8 locking bolts that come with the kit?

I need to call and verify. I asked what their procedure was before hand and can't quite remember the response. I bought new Ford gaskets, and wanted to buy new Ford studs while I was at it, and they said to go with the gaskets but not worry about new hardware.

 

[sur_real1]

Well, I think the kooks headers come with Stage 8 bolts, which have a clip that rides against the header itself to keep the bolts from backing off. Those clips could be loose on the header and making a small rattling noise. The other thing could be they used the studs and there is one stud on the drivers side that tends to either ride up against the long tubes or at least be super close. I'd check for those two things first.

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

Well, I think the kooks headers come with Stage 8 bolts, which have a clip that rides against the header itself to keep the bolts from backing off. Those clips could be loose on the header and making a small rattling noise. The other thing could be they used the studs and there is one stud on the drivers side that tends to either ride up against the long tubes or at least be super close. I'd check for those two things first.

I understand what youre saying, ive seen other threads say similar things about the hardware. Hopefully its something simple!

I once had a heat shield fail on a catalytic converter long ago, and it made the same sound as this, if that puts it into perspective.

 

[96gt02]

Check these spots

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

So yup, I have another dyno appointment next Thursday to datalog, and then we can chase any knock issues that we find afterwards. He has one of the dynos that is on a lift, so the car will be in the air and ready to be worked on immediately. I may get bored between now and then and start banging around on stuff with a rubber mallet like a caveman, but I need to shop around for a creeper and such.

It will be so nice to finally know where the car stands NA wise once and for all, and then I can start making power adder decisions for next season.

 

[Riddick]

I may get bored between now and then and start banging around on stuff with a rubber mallet like a caveman, but I need to shop around for a creeper and such.

I would highly recommend you do this before you put the car on a dyno. It will literally take 5 minutes once you get the car in the air. You do not want to be troubleshooting the car while its on the dyno unless your pockets are DEEP.

Have you done more logs on the street to see if its knocking? Again, this is something you should do before hitting the rollers. If you can hear something rattling around while driving it will be very easy to isolate and fix prior to going to the shop. Before hitting the dyno I would absolutely confirm you have false knock instead of thinking you may have an issue.

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

I would highly recommend you do this before you put the car on a dyno. It will literally take 5 minutes once you get the car in the air. You do not want to be troubleshooting the car while its on the dyno unless your pockets are DEEP.

Have you done more logs on the street to see if its knocking? Again, this is something you should do before hitting the rollers. If you can hear something rattling around while driving it will be very easy to isolate and fix prior to going to the shop. Before hitting the dyno I would absolutely confirm you have false knock instead of thinking you may have an issue.

The purpose of all this is to see what the car puts down on the dyno, so I want the datalogging to reflect those conditions. I dont want to show up to this guys shop trying to tell him about what I think I know in street logs, have the dyno logs look different, and feel like an idiot.

Also, I did a lot of street datalogging with AED and hated most moments of it. This guy is charging 150 bucks for an hour of logging pulls, its only 50 bucks more than the last three horse power pulls we did. We are going to review everything from fuel trims to cam timing to knock together. I want this car running perfect, so ill wait a week to log everything on the rollers. Who knows this car may be running great, or I may have to dump hundreds more into a remote session with Shaun again. I dont know unless we log. If it costs me an arm and a leg the cars gonna sit for the winter.

I will see if I can tighten anything up this weekend, thats definitely something I know I can handle.

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

Two things to say about the appointment today.

1) The shop did a horseshit job installing my headers a few months ago. They failed to use kooks locking hardware on my header to h pipe connections, and both bolts came undone/fell out. The flanges have been dangling for a while.

2) we could not get any knock to register on the datalogs, so my previous numbers stand. There is nothing wrong with my setup. I could be experiecing knock issues from the rattling while driving, and need to reorder replacement kooks hardware asap.

Power adder is coming next season no if ands or buts.

 

[sur_real1]

Well, one thing to note, I don't think there are locking bolts the area that attaches your headers to your mid-pipe. Sounds like they didn't tighten them all the way (I'll guess the name of the shop that did the work and you can tell me if it's the one I warned you about or not).
Boost should solve all of these power issues though

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

Well, one thing to note, I don't think there are locking bolts the area that attaches your headers to your mid-pipe. Sounds like they didn't tighten them all the way (I'll guess the name of the shop that did the work and you can tell me if it's the one I warned you about or not).
Boost should solve all of these power issues though

Yup it was that shop lol lol. The dyno operator thought it may have had some locking hardware, either way the bolts shouldnt have came undone. Its a good feeling to know my engine is running good, and there is nothing left that I can do to improve it. Im looking forward to working on the car all winter.

 

[sur_real1]

Well, I'm sorry to hear that they mucked up your stuff, it's just what they do best. Hopefully the new shop you are at will take better care of you.

 

[Jumpmaster2015]

Well, I'm sorry to hear that they mucked up your stuff, it's just what they do best. Hopefully the new shop you are at will take better care of you.

Well I was a technician in the military for the better part of ten years, and the only reason I had them install the headers was because I lost shop access while I was discharging. I have my own garage now, and am looking forward to getting back to work again!

 

[gt5.0coyote]

Are the 1 5/8 going to be too small for boost?