Is this a stupid idea?

[Too40gawlf]

I currently have a 2011 GT, which Im still paying off. The motor is stock and the rest of the car has MAC axle backs, steeda tri-ax, barton one post, and a bunch of street friendly suspension stuff (eibach pro-kit, Koni STR.Ts, LCAs, wheels, and tires). I totally love this car, and am happy with it as it is. At some point in the future, I may try to go the N/A 500rwhp route, but I will wait till its out of warranty and paid off before even considering that. Its got a little under 11K miles on it and at the moment, I cant daily drive it due to my parking situations at work and home. Its my 'nice' car that I drive 1-2 weeks and maybe a few hundred miles a month - if that.

I have a beater small pick up truck that I DD and am totally fine with this arrangement for now.

However, my first Mustang was a 96GT with the waffle rims that I completely and totally miss. I have been reading the Readheaded Step Child (RSC) series on MM&FF that they did back in 2006 and even though they fell short, I want to try my luck at a 300rwhp N/A emissions capable SN95. Im not wedded to non-PI like the MM&FF guys were. I totally understand that a blower would be more cost effective in getting power, but I kinda want to tear into the modular motor and get some familiarity with it and also have it be a project - with no time deadline or clock pressure to get it done.

My question is, is this feasible and aside from the below list, what am I overlooking?

• 96-98GT 5spd - between 100-150k miles
• ported PI heads
• performance cams
• PI intake
• catted x-pipe and after cat system
• long tubes??? (do they make longtubes for catted mid pipes?)
• bolt ons: pullies, CAI, mag, TB
• profesional tune

Aside from the tune, this would be a 'driveway project' as my time and money permits.

My question is, with a budget of $10K including the car, is this feasible? Keep in mind, my objective isnt to maximize power output - I want a project that will allow me to 'practice' on a mod motor, work on a car that I like aestetically, and not be rushed to finish because I need the car for a DD. I realize that for $10K I could be a used PI headed car and slap a blower on there and make 400rwhp.

Anyway, should I go ahead and plan for this or is it a fool's errand?

 

[iveyrobson]

I currently have a 2011 GT, which Im still paying off. The motor is stock and the rest of the car has MAC axle backs, steeda tri-ax, barton one post, and a bunch of street friendly suspension stuff (eibach pro-kit, Koni STR.Ts, LCAs, wheels, and tires). I totally love this car, and am happy with it as it is. At some point in the future, I may try to go the N/A 500rwhp route, but I will wait till its out of warranty and paid off before even considering that. Its got a little under 11K miles on it and at the moment, I cant daily drive it due to my parking situations at work and home. Its my 'nice' car that I drive 1-2 weeks and maybe a few hundred miles a month - if that.

I have a beater small pick up truck that I DD and am totally fine with this arrangement for now.

However, my first Mustang was a 96GT with the waffle rims that I completely and totally miss. I have been reading the Readheaded Step Child (RSC) series on MM&FF that they did back in 2006 and even though they fell short, I want to try my luck at a 300rwhp N/A emissions capable SN95. Im not wedded to non-PI like the MM&FF guys were. I totally understand that a blower would be more cost effective in getting power, but I kinda want to tear into the modular motor and get some familiarity with it and also have it be a project - with no time deadline or clock pressure to get it done.

My question is, is this feasible and aside from the below list, what am I overlooking?

• 96-98GT 5spd - between 100-150k miles
• ported PI heads
• performance cams
• PI intake
• catted x-pipe and after cat system
• long tubes??? (do they make longtubes for catted mid pipes?)
• bolt ons: pullies, CAI, mag, TB
• profesional tune

Aside from the tune, this would be a 'driveway project' as my time and money permits.

My question is, with a budget of $10K including the car, is this feasible? Keep in mind, my objective isnt to maximize power output - I want a project that will allow me to 'practice' on a mod motor, work on a car that I like aestetically, and not be rushed to finish because I need the car for a DD. I realize that for $10K I could be a used PI headed car and slap a blower on there and make 400rwhp.

Anyway, should I go ahead and plan for this or is it a fool's errand?

for that much you could build a pretty ba car

 

[HighCal]

For 10k you could deffinatly get yourself the car and those parts but you won't hit the 300rwhp mark. It would be a fun project though that I'm sure you'd learn a lot from and you don't have a time limit for it so I'd say go for it. If funds ever get in the way you don't need the car so you don't have to rely on it.

 

[Too40gawlf]

For 10k you could deffinatly get yourself the car and those parts but you won't hit the 300rwhp mark. It would be a fun project though that I'm sure you'd learn a lot from and you don't have a time limit for it so I'd say go for it. If funds ever get in the way you don't need the car so you don't have to rely on it.

Why would it be so hard to hit the 300rwhp? The new edge SOHC's do it relatively commonly with heads, cams, and intake + bolt ons, right? If the non-PI motors are essentially the same internally why wouldn't an non-PI SOHC respond the same way once you got ported PI heads and intake on there?

 

[mustanginky]

Non pi motors are not the same. They have either small or no dish pistons, which with pi heads will give you a full point higher compression. That's why the pi swaps are so popular on 96-98 gt's.

 

[Deceptive]

Go for it, I think with the CR bump of a PI swap and better cams that you should hit 300rwhp.

 

[blacksheep-1]

Why would it be so hard to hit the 300rwhp? The new edge SOHC's do it relatively commonly with heads, cams, and intake + bolt ons, right? If the non-PI motors are essentially the same internally why wouldn't an non-PI SOHC respond the same way once you got ported PI heads and intake on there?

Are you really stuck on N/A? because you can easily pass 350-400 with a blower and still have good mileage. to each his own but I think you really need to take a look at that. My 99 is almost bone stock, has a "little" KB at 6psi and a cat back, pulleys and a chip. On a 93 octane tune the thing pulls down 345rwhp, 330 torque and gets over 20 mpg on the highway. I've put over 20k on that setup w/o any problems at all.

 

[Too40gawlf]

Are you really stuck on N/A? because you can easily pass 350-400 with a blower and still have good mileage. to each his own but I think you really need to take a look at that. My 99 is almost bone stock, has a "little" KB at 6psi and a cat back, pulleys and a chip. On a 93 octane tune the thing pulls down 345rwhp, 330 torque and gets over 20 mpg on the highway. I've put over 20k on that setup w/o any problems at all.

You are totally correct in that the most cost effective way to get power in this scenario is to strap on a mild blower. But like I said, my motivation with this (potential project) is not to build the most power in the most cost effective way.

I want to get a hold of a straight body, relatively decent condition SN95 and R&R the car for the purposes of gaining the experience and learning the skill/knowledge. I've done basic bolt on stuff to my cars over the years, but never been as deep as pulling the heads. I dont want to get that involved in my current car, because its new, under warranty, and Im still paying on it.

However, if I get a project car I can go at my pace and budget. I just want to know the feasibility of hitting the 300rwhp mark N/A. Either way, Im not putting a blower on this car. I think it would be neat to have a 300rwhp N/A 2 valve as a DD and fun car.

 

[Too40gawlf]

Non pi motors are not the same. They have either small or no dish pistons, which with pi heads will give you a full point higher compression. That's why the pi swaps are so popular on 96-98 gt's.

Yes, you are correct - I'd read that before but it had slipped my memory.

 

[Too40gawlf]

Go for it, I think with the CR bump of a PI swap and better cams that you should hit 300rwhp.

Thats kinda what I was figuring. Taking a stock non-PI motor in good running condition and swapping PI heads and intake should get somewhere in the 230rwhp range on the conservative side. I also think with performance cams, ported heads, and a good tune that 275rwhp is a decent shot.

At that point, it comes down to wringing out another 25rwhp or so from stuff like headers, x-pipe, pullies, MAF, TB, and whatever other boltons Im over looking.

At that point, the 300rwhp mark will depend on type of dyno, weather conditions, etc, etc.

Granted, step 1 is to find a healthy 2V in a straight body sn95. I think this can be accomplished for $3K or so. After that, the trick will be not to let costs blow through the roof. If I end up spending $15K to have a 280rwhp car thats worth $4K, I will be mad. But oh well, thats the challenge of this project.

Now I need to start researching heads & cam combinations.

 

[HighCal]

Why would it be so hard to hit the 300rwhp? The new edge SOHC's do it relatively commonly with heads, cams, and intake + bolt ons, right? If the non-PI motors are essentially the same internally why wouldn't an non-PI SOHC respond the same way once you got ported PI heads and intake on there?

I'm sorry bud I misread your selection of cams. I thought I read PI cams(didn't even see the ported heads either). But yes your correct with aftermarket performance cams and ported heads and full bolt ons youll be in the 300rwhp mark.

 

[HighCal]

Do you plan on buying any of the bolt ons used?

 

[blacksheep-1]

You are totally correct in that the most cost effective way to get power in this scenario is to strap on a mild blower. But like I said, my motivation with this (potential project) is not to build the most power in the most cost effective way.

I want to get a hold of a straight body, relatively decent condition SN95 and R&R the car for the purposes of gaining the experience and learning the skill/knowledge. I've done basic bolt on stuff to my cars over the years, but never been as deep as pulling the heads. I dont want to get that involved in my current car, because its new, under warranty, and Im still paying on it.

However, if I get a project car I can go at my pace and budget. I just want to know the feasibility of hitting the 300rwhp mark N/A. Either way, Im not putting a blower on this car. I think it would be neat to have a 300rwhp N/A 2 valve as a DD and fun car.

Fair enough............

 

[froush]

Im sorry, some of you are really wrong. If all youre shooting for is 300 n/a, a non pi engine is easier. You will bump compression up with the pi heads and cams, if they were just stock you would make more than a stock new edge pi gt. With aftermarket heads and cams you would be close to 300 without boltons. With bolt ons yoh could possibly get around the 350 mark with full exhaust also. But with 10k, you could do all of that and slap a blower on amd max it out. Or you could take the extra money and make it look good

 

[froush]

Thisbis all because of higher compression. Higher compression the more power, the easier to detonate, the higher octane you NEED to run. Only run 93 with that setup. My car made 312/342 with full boltons, exhaust, cams, heads

 

[HighCal]

I was gunna recommend that he should just get trickflows 2v heads instead of PI improved ones. The PI intake ain't bad so he could probably pick one up pretty cheap and with full bolt ons I was thinking 320+rwhp

 

[Stanger00]

I was gunna recommend that he should just get trickflows 2v heads instead of PI improved ones. The PI intake ain't bad so he could probably pick one up pretty cheap and with full bolt ons I was thinking 320+rwhp

Not everyone will want to spend 2 grand for a set of heads and then have to pay another 600 for a custom cam. Thats a lot of loot for sub 400 hp. I also think the trickflows with a 10.0-10.5 compression motor will produce 340-350 to the tire.

Edit: I also think with a big bore setup with stock stroke and cast crank being spun to 6500ish with 10.5 compression may make closer to 400 to the tire. Of course the cam and intake will need to be paired correctly to accomplish this.

 

[spike_africa]

So you plan to sell the 2011 and use half the money on making a sweet 2v? I love this idea so much.

I would say you can get a nice 96-98 2v with 70-150k miles for $4,000 or less. Add in $2,000 for TFS heads, $600 for cams, $400 for new timing parts, and fluids, Full exhaust used can be found all day with searching for less then $900 for long tubes, mid pipe, and catback, then other bolt on's maybe $400 used for intake, pullies,TB, Plenum, a tune at $500. Thats only around $8,700 for a badass 2v. Granted all the rest of the car will be stock and that sucks. You can also find deals on everything. Most of my parts I got lightly used for cheap. I bet for $10,000 you could get the rear end built with some 3.73's, a new clutch, a newer and better TR3650 tranny from late 01-04 GT,Mach1. And have a solid car.

Makes me excited just thinking about it. Plus that body style is getting older and cooler looking to me every year.

 

[Kiohtee]

I guess someone outta tell you before you get started, but uh... No LT headers are technically legal from the federal government's point of view. None. All are sold as "off-road use only." You may get away with them as far as a sniffer goes, but your car will (should) fail a visual inspection. Just a heads up.

And no this is not a stupid idea IMO. I love it actually! Full bolt-on PI GTs usually make around 275-280rwhp. We all know how dynos are though. A '96-98 GT five speed with ported PI heads, a PI intake manifold and all the fixings is plenty capable of 300rwhp. Best of luck bud!

 

[Too40gawlf]

Do you plan on buying any of the bolt ons used?

Yes, Im sure there are plenty of bolt ons that I can pick up used that would fit the bill quite nicely - pullies for example.