Just curious what people are seeing wot through the rpm range, I'm still in the tuning process but have been seeing 27-28* through the middle of the curve right now, not sure what it normally runs at I never paid attention before
How much timing are people seeing on e85
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With the AED flex fuel drag tune, I see 31 or 32 degrees max timing.
On his regular flex fuel performance tune, it is maxed out at 27 degrees, because the flex fuel is limited to pump gas timing.
On his regular flex fuel performance tune, it is maxed out at 27 degrees, because the flex fuel is limited to pump gas timing.
That's what I wonder if adding a couple more degrees of timing will make any real difference
Naturally aspirated, it really doesn't.. E85 is worth 10 to 15 rwhp at most. It does help that knock is rare.
Those with forced induction will see the biggest benefit of E85.
Those with forced induction will see the biggest benefit of E85.
You should be able to run more than 27*, really going to depend on what your commanded lambda is. I'm set to .85 lambda and get 27* at most on 93 octane(e10). So you should be able to run more spark advance than 27* on e85. It's really going to depend on how your flex fuel multipliers are set and whether they are working correctly for you.
I wonder what's the point of no further gain with timing. 30?? 32?? There has to be a point where more even though there is no knock it doesn't make more power.
Once you hit MBT (Max Brake Torque, timing where you make the most power, normally you can't hit it due to octane limitations, but on e85 you can) you won't make any more power even if you keep increasing timing. Power adder cars pick up so much power on e85 because they are octane limited on pump gas . Most tuners back it off when they stop picking up significant power with timing increase. There is a flex fuel MBT adder ( bumps up the spark ceiling in the tune with more ethanol content), so I don't know if the MBT timing values in the tune are actually MBT or just a general ceiling for ignition timing that they call "MBT". MBT should be a condition specific to a motor not a fuel, but idk for sure. I can't imagine taking timing much past the low thirties.
Interesting question. I have VMP pump gas tunes on my 14 auto....and I've been adding in WOT spark a little at a time to see if I can perk up the low end. +4 has me at 27 and no issues on 91 fuel. I have a 94 tune from them but it doesn't mph any faster than the 91 and the 91 feels stronger off the bottom than the 94 tune does on Chevron 94. It seems the 91 tune was set pretty conservatively initially. I had the Procal tune on my last car and the highest it went was 28* and its low end punch couldn't be touched. What I'm doing is obvious killing a fly with a shotgun but, if it ain't pinging, it should be fine.
+4 datalogged with a couple degrees of KR so, I pulled 2 out and went back to +2.
Your adding global timing through device? Why not have Justim set it to add appropriate amount based off fuel quality?
Mainly bc Vmp can't really know my fuel quality so, a little data logging and testing will tell if it can handle it before I send in for a tune revision. The 94 tune is the one I'd like to see improvement on, since it makes no more power than my 91 and doesn't run as nice.
What? Your logs should show what your fuel quality is or is not. Bumping global timing which is overriding ecu is not what I would do for very minimal increase if any. Wow. Hope your sort your nitrous out before your next supercharger.
. Try new tuner...
Nitrous tune is all good, unmodified. Made 99 out of a planned 100 horse on the shot.
Logs won't necessarily show fuel quality. It might show some KR activity or misfire events but, not what causes them. I don't actually think the fuel quality is all that good, especially the 94, which is loaded with additives. The 91 is ok, based upon what I have seen over dozens of logs, FI or NA. A little fiddling with the tune is low risk, as long as you watch the logs. I've also jacked up the shift pressures, idle rpm, etc.
I like VMP, they sent me a really good basic tune for the automatic. I'm just seeing if I can get a bit more out of it, particularly off the bottom on the track. everything looks good thus far and I'll keep an eye on it.
Logs won't necessarily show fuel quality. It might show some KR activity or misfire events but, not what causes them. I don't actually think the fuel quality is all that good, especially the 94, which is loaded with additives. The 91 is ok, based upon what I have seen over dozens of logs, FI or NA. A little fiddling with the tune is low risk, as long as you watch the logs. I've also jacked up the shift pressures, idle rpm, etc.
I like VMP, they sent me a really good basic tune for the automatic. I'm just seeing if I can get a bit more out of it, particularly off the bottom on the track. everything looks good thus far and I'll keep an eye on it.
During WOT you should be using you "Borderline OP tables". If you want to add timing add timing to the .90+ load cells in the RPM range you want to add it in.
I would not apply a +2 to the entire table, you may get KR in some regions and not in others. I just had to remove 2* from 6k-7.5k on mine bc I was getting .7-1.4* of KR from 6400-7200 RPM.
I would not apply a +2 to the entire table, you may get KR in some regions and not in others. I just had to remove 2* from 6k-7.5k on mine bc I was getting .7-1.4* of KR from 6400-7200 RPM.
Yeah, I know it ain't really the right way. I'm just seeing if it can take a little extra WOT timing before I send back to Justin re. a tune revision. I've seen, on both of my S197s, when it happens, a KR spike at at 4-5k and they'll swallow the timing elsewhere without issue.
You need to be (if your not already) running an oil catch can or better IMO breathers. I deleted my PCV system at 3500 miles. When I swapped over to CJ intake at 5000 miles I was shocked at the amount of oil and residue on/in the cylinder head intake ports (wiped them all out real good). This will affectively lower your octane and can exacerbate knock issues. Thought I would throw that out there.
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My view is that is more a requirement for the stick shift cars, as they spend more time in the overrun. My auto car doesn't use any oil at all, largely because it is always shifting up at low rpms and doesn't generally hold higher gears on decel out of sport mode.
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