GT500 IC/HE Pump Comparison

[99SSls1]

Heat transfer takes place at a rate which has time as a factor. If the time of the water in contact with the hot surface is inadequate, less heat transfer takes place. The rate is also affected by factors like velocity and turbulence. The higher the velocity, the more turbulence you have which improves the heat transfer rate. (The reason you sling your finger through the air when you burn it - speeding up the cooling rate.)


But they are not linear. Doubling the water flow through the he (velocity) does not necessarily mean that you double the heat transfer rate or the duty.


So at some point, theoretically you can blast the water through so fast (if physically possible with your pumping system) that it picks up virtually no heat. Easy to theorize, hard to do. Now take into account the stock flow of the Bosch pump is for example 4 gpm. The high flow 29 gpm is 7.5 times more, just making a observation.

 

[Tob]

A faster flowing system will always be more efficient than a slower stagnant system.

I'm not so sure about that Sam. There is a ton of data out there to disseminate with respect to "efficiency" or the ability to remove heat at a specific rate (or variable rate). I look forward to having a more detailed understanding. I'm still trying to play catchup and at least provide some data on the hardware, let alone even begin to discuss how effective each may be, as well as some of the other pumps out there.

So let me start by sharing the rest of the hardware that was delivered to me yesterday. I received one of VMP's "2013 Intercooler Pump Installation kits for 07-12" GT500's. This won't be going on my car but I've spoken with the gentleman who will be putting it on his car and have asked him to share his install/observations with us here in this thread. Here's the contents of Justin's kit...

To begin with is a factory Ford pigtail that plugs right into the pump connector, made in Mexico.

Note that there are only two wires in this harness yet the pump uses a four prong connector (also note the numbers)...

The other end of the factory pigtail...

The pump end connector snaps into place with precision...

VMP supplies an extension harness that plugs into the factory Ford pigtail as well as the harness on the vehicle...

I don't know why VMP supplied two Adel clamps because it looks as if you can only use one at a time.

In that last photo above I had tightly wrapped the clamp around the rubber gasket that comes installed on the pump. The ends looked to be a bit apart but that may very well have been Justin's intent for a tight wrap. Hopefully he or BJ can chime in here.


This should give you a pretty good idea of the hardware at play here. I touched on it earlier - the pin count. It looks as if the Ford pump will be wired to be on/off and that the PWM function won't be taken advantage of. It's been mentioned and its my fault for not stating as such but I don't intend to test any number of pumps. There's enough data out there already. It's simply a matter of ensuring that the data is compared on the same scale, which may not be so simple.


If you're itching for data, Lingenfelter did some pretty comprehensive testing that you can find via a simple Google search. I also found a tech-rich thread on a Mercedes Benz forum. Here's a link to the lengthy thread (if you want to jump right to the charts scroll down and study posts 188 and 123).

http://mbworld.org/forums/m275-v12-...lers-heat-exchangers-circulation-pumps-5.html

 

[Catmonkey]

I'm sure those are free flow rates. You're not likely to see the same flow rates going through the intercooler system.

 

[Tob]

You'll have to read much of what he's posted as the discussion entails varying voltages, the effect of coolant vs water, etc. Some of the links he provides show testing done to emulate differing head pressures as well as addressing other variables. As I mentioned there is a lot of information to go through.

http://www.lingenfelter.com/LPEforu...tercooler-pump-flow-testing-results&highlight

 

[Robert M]

I'm not so sure about that Sam. There is a ton of data out there to disseminate with respect to "efficiency" or the ability to remove heat at a specific rate (or variable rate). I look forward to having a more detailed understanding. I'm still trying to play catchup and at least provide some data on the hardware, let alone even begin to discuss how effective each may be, as well as some of the other pumps out there.

So let me start by sharing the rest of the hardware that was delivered to me yesterday. I received one of VMP's "2013 Intercooler Pump Installation kits for 07-12" GT500's. This won't be going on my car but I've spoken with the gentleman who will be putting it on his car and have asked him to share his install/observations with us here in this thread. Here's the contents of Justin's kit...



To begin with is a factory Ford pigtail that plugs right into the pump connector, made in Mexico.

---------------------------------------


Ok Tob, so the short factory Ford harness shown above does not have the correct end to plug directly into the 2007-2012 H/E pump harness, but when using the extra length harness which is also included in the VMP kit, the correct end is on that long harness?


Or will this short Ford harness do the connection in the oem 2007-2012 pump location?




R

 

[Tob]

The factory harness uses a female connector that connects to the male connector that is molded to your original factory Bosch pump. The male connector at the very end of the VMP harness plugs into your factory harness.

In other words, this on-pump connector...

Is replaced (in essence) with the same shaped male connector from VMP's harness...

...which simply plugs into what came on your car.

 

[19COBRA93]

Heat transfer takes place at a rate which has time as a factor. If the time of the water in contact with the hot surface is inadequate, less heat transfer takes place. The rate is also affected by factors like velocity and turbulence. The higher the velocity, the more turbulence you have which improves the heat transfer rate. (The reason you sling your finger through the air when you burn it - speeding up the cooling rate.)


But they are not linear. Doubling the water flow through the he (velocity) does not necessarily mean that you double the heat transfer rate or the duty.


So at some point, theoretically you can blast the water through so fast (if physically possible with your pumping system) that it picks up virtually no heat. Easy to theorize, hard to do. Now take into account the stock flow of the Bosch pump is for example 4 gpm. The high flow 29 gpm is 7.5 times more, just making a observation.

I disagree with part of what you're saying. The quicker the coolant flow through the intercooler the more efficient it will be. Not to be confused with the heat exchanger. That's different. On the intercooler side, the faster the coolant flow, the more heat it will pull out. The coolant flow is constant, not a quick "blast" as you suggest. Heat something to 200 degrees then cool it in either a tub of water, or a raging river. The raging river will always cool faster because of the constant rush of cool water whisking away the heat at a faster rate. Slow down the flow, and you slow down the rate of heat transfer.

At the heat exchanger side, things work differently. You're trying to pull heat out of the coolant. On this end, increasing airflow through the heat exchanger will be more efficient than increasing coolant flow.

 

[Robert M]

The factory harness uses a female connector that connects to the male connector that is molded to your original factory Bosch pump. The male connector at the very end of the VMP harness plugs into your factory harness.

In other words, this on-pump connector...

Is replaced (in essence) with the same shaped male connector from VMP's harness...

...which simply plugs into what came on your car.

But does it require that complete VMP 2-pc. long harness to do the connection? or can the short Ford harness only be bought without all of the extra length?


VMP provides enough length to mount the pump behind the drivers bumper/headlight area, I want to stay in the oem 2007-2012 location if possible and would not need that extra length in the VMP kit.

R

 

[19COBRA93]

But does it require that complete VMP 2-pc. long harness to do the connection? or can the short Ford harness only be bought without all of the extra length?


VMP provides enough length to mount the pump behind the drivers bumper/headlight area, I want to stay in the oem 2007-2012 location if possible and would not need that extra length in the VMP kit.

R

The short harness won't work on its own. It doesn't have the correct connector on either end.

 

[Robert M]

The short harness won't work on its own. It doesn't have the correct connector on either end.

The short harness has the correct end for the 2013/14 pump on one end? but not the correct 2007-2012 end on the other, right?


So to mount the 2013/14 pump in the 2007-2012 location, which will not require that looooong extension wiring, there will have to be some cutting, soldering and heat shrinking done to get the harness to a shorter length in the oem 2007-2012 H/E location



R

 

[19COBRA93]

The short harness has the correct end for the 2013/14 pump on one end? but not the correct 2007-2012 end on the other, right?



R

Correct.

Honestly, the VMP harness design doesn't make sense to me. Why would it need the additional connector in the middle? A "true" adaptor harness, IMO, would have the '13/14 connector on one end, and the 07-12 connector on the other, and that's it. Eliminate the middle guy.

 

[Robert M]

Correct.

Honestly, the VMP harness design doesn't make sense to me. Why would it need the additional connector in the middle? A "true" adaptor harness, IMO, would have the '13/14 connector on one end, and the 07-12 connector on the other, and that's it. Eliminate the middle guy.

Any additional connection point is a possible trouble point.

I know that VMP plan was/is to mount the 2013/14 pump behind the bumper on the drivers side. That would require a long extension from the 2007-2012 oem harness plug over to that side of the car, but I was hoping that long VMP section of wire was only an "extension cord" as it were, and that the short Ford harness would do the same thing, except without the VMP extension................maybe not?

I have a soldering iron, solder and heat shrink so I won't have a wad of wire tie wrapped somewhere.


^^^This is assuming that the 2013/14 H/E pump will be able to mounted in the 2007-2012 location with some bracket creativity.





R

 

[Tob]

Honestly, the VMP harness design doesn't make sense to me. Why would it need the additional connector in the middle? A "true" adaptor harness, IMO, would have the '13/14 connector on one end, and the 07-12 connector on the other, and that's it. Eliminate the middle guy.

I agree completely. But if the long harness was an existing piece (don't know if Justin is doing those or he merely sources them elsewhere) I could see it.

 

[Tob]

CU2Z*14S411*AYA $14.47 from us.

-Steve

Steve, I went through the Motorcraft "Wiring Pigtail Kit Identification Guide" looking through the four cavity connector section and found this one (WPT-1309)...

That is the one you were referencing earlier, yes? I do see four wires coming from it (which would make hooking up the PWM feature via a custom controller that much easier) as opposed to only two on the harness Justin supplies. Do you know how long the wires might be...roughly? My WAG would be 6" or so...

 

[fullboogie]

I'm going to encourage you guys to take 10 minutes and read the following thread, particularly those posts by "gmitch" who is an accomplished road racer. Read his posts, check out the photos of his setup, and decide for yourself if there is such a thing as too much flow through the H/E on our cars. Every single time he upsized his H/E pump, his IAT2's went down. That's enough real-world proof for me.

http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=111197

 

[Tob]

Just quote the relevant text if you can.

 

[fullboogie]

There's an abundance of good info in that thread - the whole thing should be read.

But here's one nugget:

"You can’t have too much water pump. The GT500 pumps put out about 5 gallons per minute (gpm). We have run 20gpm, 55gpm and in one case two 55gpm pumps and they always show an improvement."

 

[Tob]

Many aren't registered there and as such can't view the thread.

 

[Justin@VMP]

When I sourced the harness a year ago nobody could find the oe pump connector by itself hence the two piece harness. This is how I mounted the 13 pump with my vmp he:
http://www.mustangandfords.com/how-...ate-performance-kit-install/photo-gallery/#20

The inlet points to the rear of the car.

The outlet can be rotated depending on which HE you are using, dual pass, the new triple pass or something else.

 

[65fastback2+2]

There's an abundance of good info in that thread - the whole thing should be read.

But here's one nugget:

"You can’t have too much water pump. The GT500 pumps put out about 5 gallons per minute (gpm). We have run 20gpm, 55gpm and in one case two 55gpm pumps and they always show an improvement."

Ive always disagreed with this. You can move it so fast that heat doesnt transfer properly. If moving it faster was always better, I am certain Ford would have done that already.