Following too close state trooper encounter ...

[emerica4601]

What's up guys,

Let me start out by saying I'm human like everybody else. Even LEO's. We eat and breathe the same. I show respect, but am sick and tired of guys acting all tough headed.

here's my story:

I was on my bike, on a local 2 lane highway. Posted speed 65mph limit. I'm cruising along with several cars, around 70ish mph. No biggie. I pass a cop on the side of the road who must have just pulled somebody over, and finished his citation. I continue to cruise another 2 miles lets say, and then the person in front of me (right lane) slows down to under the speed limit. I put my turn signal on to pass him, turn my head and look in my mirror for assurance to get in the passing lane, then pass. So now I'm passing slowly .. but faster than the guy in the right lane, and I look in my mirror and this officer I passed 2 miles back, is ON MY ASS. I say that as in not even a car length in between his front bumper and my rear tire. Ok .. so he was definitely speeding .. and now is too close to a motorcyclist. I pop it down a gear, give it some throttle to get back in the right lane, then slow down to speed limit again.

He pulls me over.

He said he pulled me over because I sped up and made a quick and dangerous turn back into the right lane. I explained I was trying to get the f out of his way after he floored it up to my rear tire. I said he was too close to me and it was dangerous and I felt the need to move quickly out of his way. Then he tells me how he didn't fly up on me, nor was speeding. So, I got a little frustrated, and being an engineer I broke down some simple constant velocity and acceleration equations for him. Granted, he cut off my sentence, and just said "ok .. ride safe please". No tickets or warnings were issued.

here's my question:

-Do LEO's have the right to break the speed limit if they are NOT in pursuit of another vehicle or have their lights on?

- There is a law in my state for following too closely, but nothing stated as far as proper distance. There's just a 'rule of thumb' around here if you're going 60, you should be 6 cars away. Did he have the right to fly up on my ass like that?

- Your faceshield is allowed up, as long as you also have proper eyewear, correct?

Thanks

Joe

 

[crfrider16]

My guess is the trooper was probably running your plate. Since MC plates are so small, you have to really get up on them to read them. Is it the safest thing to do? Probably not. But you did the right thing by getting out of the way when you recognized that you were being tailgated.

Of course, an officer can exceed the speed limit without lights or sirens. There are many, many calls where you have to get there with some urgency, but don't necessarily need to go full tilt. That's what I think a lot of people don't realize. They see cops speeding everyday and just think "look at this speeding for no reason dick". But quite often, they're heading to some type of call.

 

[wjlane]

If an officer feels the need to speed because a call requires urgency, it should be lights and siren every time. If urgency is not required, the officer should obey all traffic laws. Lights and siren are meant to alert the general public for safety purposes and allow the officer to proceed quickly, but SAFELY to his call. Even going "half tilt" is still a danger to the public and unnecessary. Either the call justifies running code or it doesn't.

 

[BAMM BAMM]

wjlane - you need to stay out of this section. You have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[svtcop]

-Do LEO's have the right to break the speed limit if they are NOT in pursuit of another vehicle or have their lights on?

We must follow the same traffic regulations as every other vehicle on the roadway if not in some type of emergency response. But even in emergency response we still must drive with due regard for the safety of all persons and property. Here's reality though...do we speed while trying to get to certain calls that don't fit our departmental guidelines of "emergency response": yes. Do we drive into residential areas with our headlights off at night to try to sneak up on crimes in progress so as not to alert criminals of our presence: yes But if we were involved in an accident would we be held liable? yes. Those are the chances we personally choose to make depending on the circumstances. Some take less risks than others, not saying it's right, just the nature of the beast. If I "bend" a rule or policy while performing my duties (within reason of course) I am fully aware and should be prepared to suffer the consequences if something goes bad. Police Officers are not perfect and any officer who says they are is a liar.

- There is a law in my state for following too closely, but nothing stated as far as proper distance. There's just a 'rule of thumb' around here if you're going 60, you should be 6 cars away. Did he have the right to fly up on my ass like that?

His "right" to fly up on you like that would depend on his reasoning. He is not here to answer that. So who knows :shrug:. See answer to first question

- Your faceshield is allowed up, as long as you also have proper eyewear, correct?

Not sure about PA motorcycle laws, you should know them since you operate a motorcycle. Did the trooper say something in regards to your eye wear? I would recommend you research the mc laws in PA on your own.

Thanks



Joe

You're welcome. :lol1:

 

[wjlane]

wjlane - you need to stay out of this section. You have no idea what you're talking about.

And you do? You have contributed nothing to this thread.

What I stated has been the written policy everywhere I've been stationed. SVTCop said it well when officers are willing to take the risk in certain situations and that's fine as long as they can justify their actions if an accident were to happen.

 

[emerica4601]

thanks for the responses guys. good to hear I did the right thing by getting out of his way. If he was in a hurry to a call, or some kind of emergency, then he wouldn't have had the time to pull me over for some stupid reason. Just another tough ass out there. Grated, most of my 'pull-overs' are nice officers/troopers that show respect and act proper. That's all anybody really asks for.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

If its one thing ive learned, is that cops will justify any of their actions based on proceedure or law. Even if thats not the spirit of the law. You cant win.

 

[FordSVTFan]

If an officer feels the need to speed because a call requires urgency, it should be lights and siren every time. If urgency is not required, the officer should obey all traffic laws. Lights and siren are meant to alert the general public for safety purposes and allow the officer to proceed quickly, but SAFELY to his call. Even going "half tilt" is still a danger to the public and unnecessary. Either the call justifies running code or it doesn't.

You have no clue of what you speak. There are plenty of calls where there is dire urgency but lights and sirens (code three) are not appropriate. Such as a burglary in progress or D.V. Lights and Sirens scare off the perp.

wjlane - you need to stay out of this section. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Agreed.

And you do? You have contributed nothing to this thread.

What I stated has been the written policy everywhere I've been stationed. SVTCop said it well when officers are willing to take the risk in certain situations and that's fine as long as they can justify their actions if an accident were to happen.

Where you have been stationed as what? Not a LEO. Please provide this written policy as you obviously have seen it.

If its one thing ive learned, is that cops will justify any of their actions based on proceedure or law. Even if thats not the spirit of the law. You cant win.

Thanks for your generalization and bias BS.

 

[Spoolx]

wjlane - you need to stay out of this section. You have no idea what you're talking about.

+1, hate when people talk out of their ass

 

[wjlane]

I am aware that certain calls don't necessitate code as you arrive closer to the scene. I was specifically addressing the need to run code while still enroute and safely clearing major intersections along the way. Perhaps I should've been more specific but I didn't expect to get attacked.

I have 22 years as a military police officer. The policy everywhere I have been states that if we feel the need to exceed the speed limit by more than 10 MPH, we should run the appropriate code to ensure we are seen and heard for public safety. Our policy dictates that in certain situations terminating that code is required as the officer approaches the scene.

I'm not sure why you always feel the need to respond to posts with such a sarcastic tone.

 

[Njc0las]

being an engineer I broke down some simple constant velocity and acceleration equations for him.

:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes

 

[joeg215]

:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes

Better that than saying what he really wanted to say.

 

[svtcop]

If its one thing ive learned, is that cops will justify any of their actions based on proceedure or law. Even if thats not the spirit of the law. You cant win.

I hope you didn't pay for that "knowledge"

Seems like it's just you that can't win.

 

[emerica4601]

Better that than saying what he really wanted to say.

Well put. I knew I was just pissing him off. I could have had other choice of words but I think my physics terminology just took the cake.

 

[sanfordb1]

I am aware that certain calls don't necessitate code as you arrive closer to the scene. I was specifically addressing the need to run code while still enroute and safely clearing major intersections along the way. Perhaps I should've been more specific but I didn't expect to get attacked.

I have 22 years as a military police officer. The policy everywhere I have been states that if we feel the need to exceed the speed limit by more than 10 MPH, we should run the appropriate code to ensure we are seen and heard for public safety. Our policy dictates that in certain situations terminating that code is required as the officer approaches the scene.

I'm not sure why you always feel the need to respond to posts with such a sarcastic tone.

Military police officer is alot different than civilian police officer. Of course your policy would be the same since u were military. I was USAF SF for four years before becoming civilian PO

 

[FordSVTFan]

I am aware that certain calls don't necessitate code as you arrive closer to the scene. I was specifically addressing the need to run code while still enroute and safely clearing major intersections along the way. Perhaps I should've been more specific but I didn't expect to get attacked.

You criticized without knowledge and you got called out, sorry you feel it was an attack.

There are still plenty of reasons not to run the code, especially if dispatched that way.

I have 22 years as a military police officer. The policy everywhere I have been states that if we feel the need to exceed the speed limit by more than 10 MPH, we should run the appropriate code to ensure we are seen and heard for public safety. Our policy dictates that in certain situations terminating that code is required as the officer approaches the scene.

I'm not sure why you always feel the need to respond to posts with such a sarcastic tone.

This has been covered in detail many times over, but there is little correlation between being in the military and having an MOS of "police" and actually being a sworn L.E.O. This is likely the reason you did not know that certain calls you dont run code three.

 

[wjlane]

I didn't criticize without knowledge. Like I said earlier, I am well aware (through policy and training) that many calls don't require code when arriving at the scene. I was referring to instances when the officer was miles away from the call and still enroute to the scene. My fault for not making that clear from the beginning but I guess you just don't want to believe that.

While military police are not sworn LEOs, they perform many of the same duties, and receive similar training as civilian police, in addition to kicking in doors in combat zones. The correlation is a lot closer than you may think or want to believe.

 

[Njc0las]

Well put. I knew I was just pissing him off. I could have had other choice of words but I think my physics terminology just took the cake.

:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes

I bet he was so thankful that your big bad genius 24 year old self didn't really let him have it. :rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes

 

[joeg215]

:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes

I bet he was so thankful that your big bad genius 24 year old self didn't really let him have it. :rollseyes:rollseyes:rollseyes

Mental function begins to peak around that age so your ageist comment is invalid.