Do you belive in Evolution?

[carrrnuttt]

National Geographic:

Oldest Writing in New World Discovered, Scientists Say

Oldest Writing in New World Discovered, Scientists Say

A writing system lost for 3,000 years has been rediscovered on an ancient stone tablet in Mexico, archaeologists say

Another source:

Sumerian Language & Writing

Writings only date back to about 3,100 BC (that are dated from their original authors).

And, Wikipedia, of all places:

Ancient history - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




op:

Do you even read YOUR OWN LINK?

Prehistory is a term often used to describe the period before written history. The early human migration patterns in the Lower Paleolithic saw Homo erectus spread across Eurasia. The controlled use of fire occurred about 800 thousand years ago. Near 250 thousand years ago, Homo sapiens evolves in Africa. Around 70–60 thousand years ago, modern humans migrate out of Africa along a coastal route to South and Southeast Asia and reached Australia. About 50 thousand years ago, modern humans spread from Asia to the Near East. Followed by about 40 thousand years ago, in which Europe was first reached by modern humans. By about 15 thousand years ago, the migration to the New World occurred.

The 10th millennium BC, Invention of agriculture is the earliest given date for the beginning of the ancient era. Göbekli Tepe was erected by hunter-gatherers in the 10th millennium BC (c. 11,500 years ago), before the advent of sedentism. Together with Nevalı Çori, it has revolutionized understanding of the Eurasian Neolithic. In the 7th millennium BC, Jiahu culture began in China. By the 5th millennium BC, the late Neolithic civilizations saw the invention of the wheel and spread of proto-writing. In the 4th millennium BC, the Cucuteni-Trypillian culture in the Ukraine-Moldova-Romania region develops. By 3400 BC, "proto-literate" cuneiform is spread in the Middle East. The 30th century BC, referred to as the Early Bronze Age II, saw the beginning of the literate period in Mesopotamia and Ancient Egypt arise. Around 27th century BC, the Old Kingdom of Egypt and the First Dynasty of Uruk are founded, according to the earliest reliable regnal eras.

RECORDED HISTORY. As in, we have actual, written records written by the hand of man, is 5K years old or so. It doesn't mean HISTORY started at the moment someone started writing something down. Idiot. In our VERY OWN COUNTRY we have the natives that crossed into what is now Alaska estimated at around 60,000 BC.

 

[SCBQQSTN]

I don't care about the past, the only thing that matters is the present/future. The only lesson I learned in my life that matters is to be kind to one another. There is so much damn hate in this world, everyone will stab each other in the back in a heart beat. Jesus of Nazareth taught about love and compassion, and in the end of the day (whether you're religious or not) loving one another as you would love yourself is the only thing that matters.

 

[7.62x51]

Do you even read YOUR OWN LINK?



RECORDED HISTORY. As in, we have actual, written records written by the hand of man, is 5K years old or so. It doesn't mean HISTORY started at the moment someone started writing something down. Idiot. In our VERY OWN COUNTRY we have the natives that crossed into what is now Alaska estimated at around 60,000 BC.

It's pretty solid evidence, IMO - since we really don't have anything else to go off except guesstimates. You would think in all of the ancient research man has done, that there would be atleast a single tablet w/ a written date on it farther back than ~5,000 years, but we don't, and we never will. Anything older than that has been dated through man's 'scientific methods'.

Go ahead and call me an idiot, insult me, do your thing..

Notice - estimated. It's hilarious to me that we have a Earth that is 'dated' to about 4.5 BILLION years old, yet we only have OFFICIAL, recorded history by man that dates back about 5,000 years (if that). It lines up perfectly with the Bible, among other things.

The underlying issue that nobody realizes is that man is trying so desperately hard to get rid of God, so people cling so tightly to these ridiculous theories, because, well - they make no room for God. People want to be their own God, and nobody wants to accountable. Whether it is consciously apparent or not, it is the underlying issue to all of this.

 

[carrrnuttt]

Go ahead and call me an idiot, insult me, do your thing..

Notice - estimated. It's hilarious to me that we have a Earth that is 'dated' to about 4.5 BILLION years old, yet we only have OFFICIAL, recorded history by man that dates back about 5,000 years (if that). It lines up perfectly with the Bible, among other things.

That's because papyrus rots, wood carvings fade, and even rock carvings wear out over time. Speaking of the Gobekli Tepe, feel free to debunk the science that was used for dating the structures...you know, the same dating methods used on your precious Cuneiforms you're using for your argument: Göbekli Tepe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (direct link to dating methods).

Do it. I can use the hilarity.

EDIT: And no, no one is "trying so desperately hard to get rid of God." It's more like "you're trying desperately hard to hang on to your tribal fairytales." Heck, you and your kind even eschew reason to hang on.

EDIT 2: Oh, and there's "written records" and there's "records." Have you looked up how old the cave paintings discovered around the world are?

 

[7.62x51]

That's because papyrus rots, wood carvings fade, and even rock carvings wear out over time.

How convenient for you :coolman:

 

[thomas91169]

How convenient for you :coolman:

Sorta like a book of open ended generalized fairy tales meant to predict the future, thats been re-written how many times is convenient for you :coolman:

 

[7.62x51]

Sorta like a book of open ended generalized fairy tales meant to predict the future, thats been re-written how many times is convenient for you :coolman:

Well, I think what has needed to be said, has been said. Good luck with all that man.

 

[CBrowning84]

People want to be their own God, and nobody wants to accountable. Whether it is consciously apparent or not, it is the underlying issue to all of this.

Ding ding ding! That's the very FIRST underlying issue. (meaning that's what Adam and Eve wanted... or thought they wanted). :thumbsup:

Sorta like a book of open ended generalized fairy tales meant to predict the future, thats been re-written how many times is convenient for you :coolman:

It's pretty awesome when a single book is written through a compilation of 66 books written by more than 40 separate authors over a period of 1,600 years... Even though all these authors lived in different time periods, centuries apart from each other, each book of the entire Bible corresponds one with another.


The Bible has revealed in detail the past and future to us with names, places, and dates that has been confirmed/proven in scientific and archaeological evidence. In fact all of archaeological history has never proven the Bible wrong... on the contrary it's proven it correct.







Did you know that the bible describes the Earth as round centuries before people knew?

Have ye not known? Have ye not heard? Hath it not been told you from the beginning? Have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?

It is he who sitteth upon the "CIRCLE" of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in: Isaiah 40:21-22 KJV

Many of the remaining Archaeological evidences are not only already discovered, but "ALL" of the evidence stands the test of science in the sense that all the evidence dates to the correct time period in history and is just as the Bible described.

* The city of Ur is mentioned 5 times in the Bible as the hometown of Abraham. Excavations of Ur, in today Iraq, have continued off and on since the late 1800's. Ur is found in: Genesis 11:28, 11:31, & 15:7, I Chronicles 11:35, & Nehamiah 9:7.

* Many Horned Altars have been excavated in places like the cities of Dan and Beersheba that date back to the 10th Century B.C. These Altars are mentioned in: Exodus 27:2 & I Kings 1:50.

* Jericho is mentioned in the Bible more than 50 times, most famously in Joshua chapter 6. Not only has Archeology found the city by may have discovered the actual "Wall of Jericho".

* Between 1929-1939 excavators found hundreds of stories about Canaanite gods and goddesses written on clay tablets in the ancient city of Ugarit, in today Syria. The Old Testament repeatedly refers to gods and goddesses like Baal & Ashtaroth, which were worshiped by the Canaanites that lived among the Israelites in the Promise Land. The prophets strongly warned God’s people not to worship these false gods in Numbers 25, I Kings 11, Jeremiah 23, and Hosea 13.

* The city of Ashkelon, a Philistine Seaport, has been being excavated since 1985. Nebuchadnezzar destroyed Ashkelon in 604 B.C. as predicted by the prophet Jeremiah. The prophets Amos, Jeremiah, Zephaniah, and Zechariah all pronounced condemnation on the city of Ashkelon in: Amos 1:6-8, Jeremiah 25:15-20 and 47:5-7, Zephaniah 2:4-7, and Zechariah 9:5.


* Archaeology has discovered the city of Dan which was originally a Canaanite stronghold in Israel’s northern boundary. The tribe Dan conquered the city in Judges chapter 18. The high place where Jeroboam I erected a gold calf has been found in Dan that is mentioned in I Kings 12:28-31.

* In 1956 Archaeology discovered the Pool of Gibeon in the city of Gibeon. The city of Gibeon dates to around 1000 B.C. The Great Water Pool at Gibeon is mentioned in II Samuel 2:13 and Jeremiah 41:12.

* The City of Beth Shean still remains today, but only its ruins. The Philistines took over the city of Beth Shean from King Saul (Judges 1:27) and they hung the bodies of King Saul and his sons from the walls of Beth Shean, see I Samuel 31:10.

* In 1993 & 1994 Archaeologist working at an excavation in the city of Dan found a stone inscribed in Aramaic the words "the House of David". This is one of the most important finds for the Bible. Until this discovery there was no Archaeological evidence of King David outside the Bible. Now there is. The stone also referred to Israel’s King at the time.

* Excavations between 1969-1976 uncovered the Israelite city of Beersheba. Beersheba eventually became Israel’s key fortress city in the south during the period of King Solomon in I Kings 4:25

* There are few cities mentioned more in the Bible than Samaria (more than 100 times). Excavations have discovered much of the city and found it to be a strong & prosperous city. See I Kings 16:24, II Kings 6-22, and Chronicles 18.

* Archeology has discovered the Siloam Tunnel. In the 1880's an ancient Hebrew inscription found in the tunnel talks about King Hezekiah (701 B.C.) who ordered the tunnel to be built so water from Jerusalem’s Gishon Spring could be sent to the man-made Pool of Siloam. The inscription celebrates the completion of the tunnel as mentioned in II Kings 20:20, and II Chronicles 32:30.

* The tomb of the Priestly Hezir family was discovered in Jerusalem’s Kindron valley. A list of Levitical Priest during King David’s time, including the Hezir family is found in I Chronicles 24. Later, another priest named Hezir is listed as on of the priest who signed a covenant to keep God’s Law in the restored temple around 450 B.C. found in Nehemiah chapter 10.

* Jacob’s well can be found today beside what Archaeologist have identified as the ancient North/South rd. near Mt. Gerizim in the eastern part of Nablus. To this day the well is still fed by an underground stream. In John 4:1-42 tells the story of Jesus’s encounter with the Samaritan women at Jacobs’s well.

* In 1968 the bones of a young man who had been crucified during the New Testament times was found in Jerusalem. The heel bone still had the 7" nail embedded in it confirming one way the Romans crucified their victims, nailing them to a cross.

* The cities of Damascus & Ephesus are still thriving cities to this day and are mentioned often in the Bible. The road to Damascus is where Jesus came to the apostle Paul and transformed him. The Bible mentions Damascus more than 60 times and Ephesus 17 times. A few of these passages are: Genesis 14:15, Acts 9:1-25, Acts 19:1-41, and Ephesians 1:1.

* In 1929 Archaeologist found a paving stone near the Theater at Corinth in Greece that contains Erastus’s name, meaning he was indeed a Roman public official as thought. Erastus in mentioned in Romans 16:23.

* Critics have tried to say that the Biblical description of the Hittite Empire was wrong because the Hittite Empire did not exist, so they thought. Then Archaeologist discovered the Hittite capital in 1906 and discovered that the Hittite’s were actually a very prominent civilization. Just a few places to find the Hittite’s in the Bible is: Genesis 15:20, I Kings 10:29, and II Chronicles 1:17

* 32 inscriptions have been found that have the term "Politarchs" (city authorities) and 19 of them come from Thessalonica. At least 3 inscriptions date to the time of Paul. Because the Greek term "Politarchs" could not be found in existing ancient literature outside the New Testament, (Acts 17:6) some critics argued that Luke must have been wrong in the use of the term in Acts 17:6. The discovery of theses inscriptions with the term Politarch’s prove Luke was not wrong in the use of his words, actually Luke is known for being quite precise. Sir William Ramsey one of the greatest Archaeologist that ever lived, demonstrated that Luke made no mistakes in reference to 32 countries, 54 cities, and 9 islands!!





But yeah, I guess it's all a "book of open ended generalized fairy tales" ;-)

 

[SLOW95]

Awesome man.

 

[SCBQQSTN]

Good post

 

[7.62x51]

It's funny with atheism. The more undeniable proof you lay out (notice, not the word 'evidence'), it just infuriates them. Salt to an open wound. Atheists have been challenged for hundreds and hundreds of years to disprove or discredit the Bible, and nobody can do it, and it will never be done. Why they cling to their belief in nothingness that leads them to the pit is just absurd and beyond me. They will attack you, ridicule you, mock you, insult you, but they will never be able to discredit you, or the Bible. Fighting a losing battle.

 

[carrrnuttt]

It's funny with atheism. The more undeniable proof you lay out (notice, not the word 'evidence'), it just infuriates them. Salt to an open wound. Atheists have been challenged for hundreds and hundreds of years to disprove or discredit the Bible, and nobody can do it, and it will never be done. Why they cling to their belief in nothingness that leads them to the pit is just absurd and beyond me. They will attack you, ridicule you, mock you, insult you, but they will never be able to discredit you, or the Bible. Fighting a losing battle.

LOL

Your delusions are simply overwhelming. The Bible, among other religious nonsense, have been disproved and discredited in so many different ways. It's just that fantastical hangers-on like you refuse to acknowledge any of them and usually figure out a way to rationalize your minds out of researched facts. For one thing, the The Bible does a good job of discrediting itself: Infographic of the Day: What The Bible Got Wrong | Fast Company

______________________________________

The organization here is pretty simple. You’ve got bars at the bottom representing the 1,189 verses of the King James Bible. White’s for the Old Testament, gray’s for the New Testament. Then a red arc links all the verses that contradict each other.

Steve Wells, the guy who compiled the data, cites 439 -- 439! -- questions the Bible equivocates on, often in several places. Even something as seemingly incontrovertible as how old Abram was when Ishmael was born has more than one answer (see Genesis 11:26; Genesis 11:32; Genesis 16:16; and Acts 7:2-4). For the full key, download the chart as aPDF.

So to anyone who thinks the Bible’s the last word on anything, remember this: It isn’t even the last word on itself.​

______________________________________

In case you missed the link in the article itself, here's the infographic as a PDF: http://www.project-reason.org/bibleContra_big.pdf

Speaking of which, here's an article you should read: The Science of Why We Don't Believe Science | Mother Jones

Consider a person who has heard about a scientific discovery that deeply challenges her belief in divine creation—a new hominid, say, that confirms our evolutionary origins. What happens next, explains political scientist Charles Taber of Stony Brook University, is a subconscious negative response to the new information—and that response, in turn, guides the type of memories and associations formed in the conscious mind. "They retrieve thoughts that are consistent with their previous beliefs," says Taber, "and that will lead them to build an argument and challenge what they're hearing."

 

[7.62x51]

If the Bible is such nonsense, why are you so persistent in trying to discredit it? I have asked this question several times but can not get an answer! Truth is, you don't know why. It blows my mind that these atheists will spend so much time and effort trying to discredit Jesus! They will write books, hold seminars, create atheism clubs, etc all in a stand to prove that God was not real! Does this make any sense to you? I don't see the 'anti-spaghetti monster' club anywhere! Truth is, JESUS is salt to an open wound, and everybody - every man, woman and child knows deep down that God is real, and these vain efforts to discredit His existence is all a residual affect of that. You will deny this fact, but it does not it make it less true. I know you take pleasure in insulting God and His people, but it does nothing for your cause, except provide a small, temporary relief. I don't need to insult others because I stand on solid ground - that solid ground being the truth.

If you want to know the truth, put God to the test yourself. Ask Him to reveal Himself to you, carrrnuttt, and He will. Problem is, you won't. There is a great fear that God actually might...reveal Himself to you! And that is NOT want an atheist wants. An atheist wants to be his own god.

 

[bad360rt]

It's pretty awesome when a single book is written through a compilation of 66 books written by more than 40 separate authors over a period of 1,600 years... Even though all these authors lived in different time periods, centuries apart from each other, each book of the entire Bible corresponds one with another.

The Bible has revealed in detail the past and future to us with names, places, and dates that has been confirmed/proven in scientific and archaeological evidence. In fact all of archaeological history has never proven the Bible wrong... on the contrary it's proven it correct.

But yeah, I guess it's all a "book of open ended generalized fairy tales" ;-)

There are many conflicting stories in the bible, such as the story of Jesus' birth and the events leading up to it. Even the Catholic Church has stated that the bible is not completely truthful or accurate.

Most good works of fiction include actual places and events, it helps make the story more believable, but it doesn't make it true.

It's funny with atheism. The more undeniable proof you lay out (notice, not the word 'evidence'), it just infuriates them. Salt to an open wound. Atheists have been challenged for hundreds and hundreds of years to disprove or discredit the Bible, and nobody can do it, and it will never be done. Why they cling to their belief in nothingness that leads them to the pit is just absurd and beyond me. They will attack you, ridicule you, mock you, insult you, but they will never be able to discredit you, or the Bible. Fighting a losing battle.

Read my comment above, the only proof that's in the bible is that certain people and places did in fact exist, there is no proof at all for the fairy tales that surround the spattering of factual information.

Back to the thread topic, the theory of evolutions is in fact the best explanation currently available for our existence. Does science have all of the answers? Of course not, at least not yet. But it's far better to continue to explore and seek out the truth than to just give up and say that some imaginary being is responsible for everything.

 

[7.62x51]

There are many conflicting stories in the bible, such as the story of Jesus' birth and the events leading up to it. Even the Catholic Church has stated that the bible is not completely truthful or accurate.

Even the Catholic Church? The Catholic Church has completely strayed from Jesus' teachings and the Bible itself. They have become their own entity, also know as "Religion". What Jesus teaches in the Bible is NOT Religion, but a relationship. In fact, God DESPISES Religion, and it responsible for turning more people away from God than anything else.

The catholic church has 'compromised' in many regards and has lost most credibility.

 

[carrrnuttt]

If the Bible is such nonsense, why are you so persistent in trying to discredit it?

Your circular arguments make my head hurt. How do you tie your shoes everyday?

I told you, The Bible does a GREAT job of discrediting itself!

Prophecies to Identify the Messiah, Which Jesus Does Not Fulfill:
1) Matthew 1:23 says that Jesus (the messiah) would be called Immanuel, which means "God with us." Yet no one, not even his parents, call him Immanuel at any point in the bible.
2) The Messiah must be a physical descendant of David (Romans 1:3 & Acts 2:30). Yet, how could Jesus meet this requirement since his genealogies in Matthew 1 and Luke 3 show he descended from David through Joseph, who was not his natural father because of the Virgin Birth. Hence, this prophecy could not have been fulfilled.
3) Isaiah 7:16 seems to say that before Jesus had reached the age of maturity, both of the Jewish countries would be destroyed. Yet there is no mention of this prophecy being fulfilled in the New Testament with the coming of Jesus, hence this is another Messiah prophecy not fulfilled.

Prophecies Christians Use to Verify Jesus as the Messiah, Yet Clearly Fail:
4) The gospels (especially Matthew 21:4 and John 12:14-15) claim that Jesus fulfills the prophecy of Zechariah 9:9. But the next few verses (Zechariah 9:10-13) show that the person referred to in this verse is a military king that would rule "from sea to sea". Since Jesus had neither an army nor a kingdom, he could not have fulfilled this prophecy.
5) Matthew (Matthew 2:17-18) quotes Jeremiah (Jeremiah 31:15), claiming that it was a prophecy of King Herod’s alleged slaughter of the children in and around Bethlehem after the birth of Jesus. But this passage refers to the Babylonian captivity, as is clear by reading the next two verses (Jeremiah 31:16-17), and, thus, has nothing to do with Herod’s massacre.
6) John 19:33 says that during Jesus’ crucifixion, the soldiers didn’t break his legs because he was already dead. Verse John 19:36 claims that this fulfilled a prophecy:"Not a bone of him shall be broken." But there is no such prophecy. It is sometimes said that the prophecy appears in Exodus 12:46, Numbers 9:12 & Psalm 34:20. This is not correct. Exodus 12:46 & Numbers 9:12 are not prophecies, they are commandments. The Israelites are told not to break the bones of the Passover lamb, and this is all it is about. And Psalm 34:20 seems to refer to righteous people in general (see verse Psalm 34:19, where a plural is used), not to make a prophecy about a specific person.
7) "When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt." Hosea 11:1. Matthew (Matthew 2:15) claims that the flight of Jesus’ family to Egypt is a fulfillment of this verse. But Hosea 11:1 is not a prophecy at all. It is a reference to the Hebrew exodus from Egypt and has nothing to do with Jesus. Matthew tries to hide this fact by quoting only the last part of the verse ("Out of Egypt I have called my son").
8) "But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting." Micah 5:2 The gospel of Matthew (Matthew 2:5-6) claims that Jesus’ birth in Bethlehem fulfils this prophecy. But this is unlikely for two reasons.
A) "Bethlehem Ephratah" in Micah 5:2 refers not to a town, but to a clan: the clan of Bethlehem, who was the son of Caleb’s second wife, Ephrathah (1 Chronicles 2:18, 2:50-52 & 4:4).
B) The prophecy (if that is what it is) does not refer to the Messiah, but rather to a military leader, as can be seen from Micah 5:6. This leader is supposed to defeat the Assyrians, which, of course, Jesus never did. It should also be noted that Matthew altered the text of Micah 5:2 by saying: "And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Judah" rather than "Bethlehem Ephratah" as is said in Micah 5:2. He did this, intentionally no doubt, to make this verse appear to refer to the town of Bethlehem rather than the family clan.
Statements Jesus Made Which Are False:
9) Jesus in John 14:12 & Mark 16:17-18 said: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth in me, the works that I do shall he also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father." This implies that Jesus’ true followers should be able to routinely perform the following tricks: 1) cast out devils, 2) speak in tongues, 3) take up serpents, 4) drink poisons without harm, and 5) cure the sick by touching them and MANY other of Jesus’ "works". Curiously I have yet to see a Christian that can do any of the above on demand.
10) In John 14:13-14 Jesus stated: "And whatsoever ye ask in my name I do, that the Father may be glorified in the son. If ye ask any thing in my name, I will do it." In reality, millions of people have made millions of requests in Jesus’ name and failed to receive satisfaction. This promise or prophecy has failed completely.
11) Paul says Christianity lives or dies on the Resurrection (1 Corinthian 15:14-17). Yet Jesus said in Matthew 12:40 that he would be buried three days and three nights as Jonah was in the whale three days and three nights. Friday afternoon to early Sunday morning is only one and a half days, so he could not have been the messiah by his own and Paul’s admission.
12) Jesus’ prophecy in John 13:38 ("The **** shall not crow, till thou [Peter] hast denied me three times") is false. Mark 14:66-68 shows the **** crowed after the first denial, not the third.
13) In Mark 10:19 Jesus said: "Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, do not steal, do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother." Jesus needs to re-read the Ten Commandments. There is no Old Testament commandment against defrauding. The only relevant statement about defrauding is in Leviticus 19:13 , which says : "Thou shalt not defraud thy neighbor." This is an OT law, but is not listed with the Ten Commandments. Surely, if Jesus was god incarnate he would know the commandments.
14) "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven" (John 3:13). If Jesus is in heaven, how can he be down on earth speaking? Moreover, according to 2 Kings 2:11 ("and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven") Jesus was not the only person to ascend into heaven, nor was he the first. Elijah preceded him and apparently Enoch did also ("And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him"--Genesis 5:24).
15) In Luke 23:43 Jesus said to the thief on the cross, "Today shalt thou be with me in paradise." This obviously has to be false, for Jesus was supposed to lay dead in the tomb for three days following his crucifixion.
1 6) Jesus says : "Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbor, and hate thine enemy" (Matthew 5:43). This statement does not exist in the OT either. In fact, Proverbs 24:17 says, "Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth…"
17) Jesus is reported to say: "The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it" (Luke 16:16). Certainly every man is not pressing to enter the kingdom of God. The very fact that I am an atheist (one third of the world’s population does not believe in a god) proves this verse to be false.
18) "Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the Sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the Sabbath, and are blameless?" (Matthew 12:5) Nowhere does the OT state that the priests in the temple profaned the Sabbath and were considered blameless.
19) "Yea; have ye never read, 'Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise'" (Matthew 21:16). Jesus is quoting Psalm 8:2, which says, "Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength because of thine enemies…". "Perfect praise" has little to do with "ordaining strength because of thine enemies." Another misquotation!
20) "But I say unto you, That Elias is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him" (Mark 9:13). There are no prophecies in the OT of things that were to happen to Elijah.
Jesus, in all his "God incarnate" wisdom, contradicts himself:
21) Jesus consistently contradicts himself concerning his Godly status. "I and my father are one." (John 14:28) Also see Philippians 2:5-6 Those verses lead us to believe that he is a part of the trinity and equal to his father being a manifestation of him. Yet, Jesus also made many statements that deny he is the perfect men, much less God incarnate. Take the following for example: "Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is God" (Matthew 19:17). "My father if greater then I." (John 14:28) Also see Matthew 24:26 Clearly, Jesus is denouncing the possibility of him being the Messiah in those three verses.
22) Jesus said, "whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire" (Matthew 5:22). Yet, he himself did so repeatedly, as Matthew 23:17-19 and Luke 11:40 & 12:20 show. Clearly Jesus should be in danger of hell too?
23) Does Jesus support peace, or war? Matthew 5:39 "Resist not evil, but whoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also." Also note Matthew 6:38-42 & 26:52 where Jesus teaches non-resistance, Non-violence. Now read (Luke 22:36-37) Where Jesus commands people to take arms for a coming conflict. (John 2:15) Jesus uses a whip to physically drive people out of the temple.
24) Matthew 15:24 Jesus said, "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of lsrael,". This would of course mean that he is here only to save the Jews. The scriptures repeatedly back up this notion that Christ is savior to the Jews and not the gentiles (see Romans 16:17, Revelations 14:3-4 & John 10). The contradiction lies in what Jesus later tells his followers: "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations" (Matthew 28:19).
25) Can we hate our kindred? Luke 14:26 Jesus says "If any man come unto me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brother, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he can not be my disciple." John 3:15 "Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer." Also see Ephesians 6:22, 5:25, & Matthew 15:4
26) Even many of the staunchest defenders of Jesus admit that his comment in Matthew 10:34 ("I came not to send peace but a sword") contradicts verses such as Matthew 26:52 ("Put up again thy sword into his place: for all that take the sword shall perish with the sword").
27) Deuteronomy 24:1 & 21:10-14 all say that divorce is allowed for the simple reason if a "man no longer delighteth in his wife". Yet Jesus comes along and breaks his father’s law by saying in Matthew 5:32 that adultery is the only way one can be divorced.
28) In Mark 8:35 Jesus said: "...but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s the same shall save it." How could Jesus have said this when there was no gospel when he lived? The gospel did not appear until after his death.
29) Matthew 6:13 Jesus recites a revised prayer and states, "Don’t bring us into temptation." God is the cause of everything, even Satan. God has been leading people into temptation since the Garden of Eden. Otherwise, the trees of life and knowledge would have never been there.
30) Matthew 12:1-8 Jesus thinks it’s okay to break his father’s laws, by breaking the Sabbath day. He states that he is basically exempt for such fiascoes and that he is Master of the Sabbath.
31) John 3:17 Jesus contradicts himself when he says, "God didn’t send his son into the world to condemn it, but to save it." Jesus seems to forget his own stories.
32) James 4:3 If your prayers are not answered, it’s your own damned fault. This is in direct contradiction to where Jesus says "seek and ye shall find, ask and it shall be known to you".
33) "If Jesus bears witness of himself his witness is true" John 8:14, "If I bear witness of myself it is not true." John 5:31
34) "I am with you always, even unto the end of the world" (Matthew 28:20), versus "For ye have the poor always with you; but me ye have not always"(Matthew 26:11 , Mark 14:7, John 12:8) and "Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am thither ye cannot come" (John 7:34). Is this the kind of friend one can rely on?
35) "And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her" (Mark 10:11 & Luke 6:18), versus "And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery" (Matthew 19:9). In the book of Matthew, Jesus said a man could put away his wife if one factor-- fornication--is involved. In Mark and Luke he allowed no exceptions.
36) Jesus is quoted: "Judge not, and ye shall be not judged; condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven" (Luke 6:37 & Matthew 7:1), versus "Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment" (John 7:24). Jesus stated men are not to judge but, then, allowed it under certain conditions. As in the case of divorce, he can’t seem to formulate a consistent policy.
37) "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Matthew 27:46, (also note the time before crucification where Jesus prays for the "cup to passeth over me") versus "Now is my soul troubled. And what shall I say? ‘Father, save me from this hour?’ No, for this purpose I have come to this hour" (John 12:27 RSV). Jesus can’t seem to decide whether or not he wants to die. One moment he is willing; the next he isn’t.
38) In Luke 23:30 ("Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, fall on us, and to the hills, cover us") Jesus quoted Hosea 10:8 ("...and they shall say to the mountains, cover us; and to the hills, fall on us"). And, like Paul, he often quoted inaccurately. In this instance, he confused mountains with hills.
39) "And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things. But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they know him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist" (Matthew 17:11-13). John the Baptist was beheaded, but Jesus was not. And what did John the Baptist restore? Nothing!
40) We are told salvation is obtained by faith alone (John 3:18 & 36) yet Jesus told a man to follow the Commandments-Matthew 19:16-18 (saving by works)-if he wanted eternal life.
41) In Luke 12:4 Jesus told his followers to "Be not afraid of them that kill the body." But Matthew 12:14-16, John 7:1, 8:59, 10:39, 11:53-54, & Mark 1:45 show that Jesus consistently feared death. Jesus went out of his way to hide, run, and attempt escape from the Roman and Jewish authorities.
42) Matthew 5:28 says to sin in "your heart" is considered a sin in itself. The messiah is supposed to be God incarnate, not able to sin, yet in Matthew 4:5 & Luke 4:5-9, Jesus was tempted by Satan in the desert, which is sinning in his heart. Jesus also took upon all the sins of the world during his crucifixion, so how can it be said that "Jesus was the perfect man without sin"? This would lead one to believe he was not the Messiah.
43) Jesus told us to "Love your enemies; bless them that curse you," but ignored his own advice by repeatedly denouncing his opposition. Matthew 23:17 ("Ye fools and blind"), Matthew 12:34 ("0 generation of vipers"), and Matthew 23:27 (". . . hypocrites . . . ye are like unto whited sepulchres. . .") are excellent examples of hypocrisy.
44) Did the people of Jesus’ generation see any signs? (Matthew 12:38-40) Jesus announced that no signs would be given to that generation except the Resurrection itself. (Mark 8:12-13) Jesus announced that no signs would be given to that generation. (Mark 16:20) They went out preaching, and the Lord confirmed the word through accompanying signs. (John 20:30) Jesus provided many wonders and signs. (Acts 2:22) Jesus provided many wonders and signs. (Acts 5:12 & 8:13) many signs and wonders were done through the apostles.
45) Jesus commands the disciples to go into Galilee immediately after the resurrection. Matthew 28:10 Jesus commands the disciples to "tarry in Jerusalem" immediately after the resurrection.
46) Matthew 28:18 & John 3:35 both tell that Jesus said he could do anything. Yet Mark 6:5 says Jesus was not all powerful.
47) Jesus says in Luke 2:13-14 that he came to bring peace on earth. Matthew 10:34 Jesus back peddles and says he did not come to bring peace on earth.
48) Did Christ receive testimony from man? "Ye sent unto John and he bare witness unto the truth. But I receive not testimony from man." John 5:33-34 "And ye shall also bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning." John 15:27
49) Christ laid down his life for his friends. John 15:13 & 10:11 Christ laid down his life for his enemies. Romans 5:10
50) Deuteronomy 23:2 says that bastards can not attend church unto the tenth generation. If Jesus was spawned by Mary and Jehovah as the Bible claims then he is technically a bastard and should not be the leader of the church.

If you want to know the truth, put God to the test yourself. Ask Him to reveal Himself to you, carrrnuttt, and He will. Problem is, you won't. There is a great fear that God actually might...reveal Himself to you! And that is NOT want an atheist wants. An atheist wants to be his own god.

*sigh* I guess I have to go through this again: I was born and raised as a Catholic, went to Catholic schools growing up, was even a Jesuit pre-Novice (pre-Seminarian) with a goal of doing missionary work. My self-study in Theology showed me the errors of Catholicism, I was eventually baptized as a Born-Again, and as a Baptist as a young man in the USAF. The one thing I retained in all my sojourns? The ability to think critically.

 

[7.62x51]

*sigh* I guess I have to go through this again: I was born and raised as a Catholic, went to Catholic schools growing up, was even a Jesuit pre-Novice (pre-Seminarian) with a goal of doing missionary work. My self-study in Theology showed me the errors of Catholicism, I was eventually baptized as a Born-Again, and as a Baptist as a young man in the USAF. The one thing I retained in all my sojourns? The ability to think critically.

I say this with respect, carrrnuttt - but so many people say that they "grew up catholic", or I "have been to church", I have "been baptized", or I "belong to such and such religious group" Who cares! It is meaningless. The only thing that matter is that personal relationship between you and God himself. NO middle man.

Religious affiliation has no significance, and holds ZERO weight. So many people think they are justified because they have been a part of some religious sanction!

If you are a product of Religion than you are going to probably have a slanted view towards God, more times than not. This is the result of following religious teachings. If you knew the New Testament, you would know that JESUS CAME TO DISCREDIT RELIGION. In fact, it was the "Religious" Pharisees that sentenced Jesus to death!

I can assure that God does not personally know many people that are affiliated with Religion! God wants you to follow Himself! To have a personal relationship with Jesus! Not to follow some religious group who is running on their own agenda!

If you know the Bible at ALL, then you KNOW that all JESUS wants is a personal relationship with him! Religion will cause death. Religion is man-made. Your religious affiliation is no more good to God than somebody who never has sat in a church service! If He doesn't know you personally, than He can not save you. It is such a simple thing to meet Jesus personally, it is simply a prayer away.

 

[CBrowning84]

I'll just put this here....





The Bible has many seeming contradictions within its pages. For example, the four Gospels give four differing accounts as to what was written on the sign that hung on the cross.

“And above His head they put up the charge against Him which read, ‘THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS’.”
—Matthew 27:37

“The inscription of the charge against Him read, ‘THE KING OF THE JEWS’.”
—Mark 15:26

“Now there was also an inscription above Him, ‘THIS IS THE KING OF THE JEWS’.”
—Luke 23:38

“Pilate also wrote an inscription and put it on the cross. It was written, ‘JESUS THE NAZARENE, THE KING OF THE JEWS’.”
—John 19:19

Those who are looking for contradictions may therefore say, “See—the Bible is full of mistakes!” and choose to reject it entirely as being untrustworthy.

However, those who trust God have no problem harmonizing the Gospels. There is no contradiction if the sign simply said, “This is Jesus of Nazareth the King of the Jews.”

The godly base their confidence on two truths: 1) “all Scripture is given by inspiration of God” (2 Timothy 3:16); and 2) an elementary rule of Scripture is that God has deliberately included seeming contradictions in His Word to “snare” the proud. He has “hidden” things from the “wise and prudent” and “revealed them to babes” (Luke 10:21), purposely choosing foolish things to confound the wise (1 Corinthians 1:27).

If an ungodly man refuses to humble himself and obey the gospel, and instead desires to build a case against the Bible, God gives him enough material to build his own gallows.

This incredible principle is clearly illustrated in the account of the capture of Zedekiah, king of Judah. Jeremiah the prophet told Zedekiah that God would judge him. He was informed that he would be “delivered into the hand of the king of Babylon” (Jeremiah 32:4). This is confirmed in Jeremiah 39:5-7 where we are told that he was captured and brought to King Nebuchadnezzar, then they “bound him with chains, to carry him to Babylon.”

However, in Ezekiel 12:13, God Himself warned, “I will bring him to Babylon …yet he shall not see it, though he shall die there” (emphasis added). Here is material to build a case against the Bible! It is an obvious mistake. Three Bible verses say that the king would go to Babylon, and yet the Bible in another place says that he would not see Babylon. How can someone be taken somewhere and not see it? It makes no sense at all—unless Zedekiah was blinded. And that is precisely what happened. Zedekiah saw Nebuchadnezzar face to face, saw his sons killed before his eyes, then “the king of Babylon… put out Zedekiah's eyes” before taking him to Babylon (Jeremiah 39:6,7).

This is the underlying principle behind the many “contradictions” of Holy Scripture (such as how many horses David had, who was the first to arrive at the tomb after the resurrection of Jesus, etc.).

God has turned the tables on proud, arrogant, self-righteous men. When he proudly stands outside of the kingdom of God, and seeks to justify his sinfulness through evidence he thinks discredits the Bible, he doesn't realize that God has simply lowered the door of life, so that only those who are prepared to exercise faith, and bow in humility may enter.




The fact of the matter is no matter WHAT YOU SEEK YOU WILL FIND. If you seek that there is no God then you will find that. God won't harass you, if you don't want to know Him, that's your choice and part of free will. But if you use your brain and see that life is designed and realize there must be a designer and seek with your heart to figure it out it WILL happen. It's amazing the many things God has shown me in the past year... only because i've been open and seeking. The 10 years before that (or most of my life) I really didn't seek and questioned most things, but as I seek I get answers to pretty much every question that never made sense.

Bottom line... It doesn't matter what anyone says, you can't tell us "bible thumpers" something that we have felt and experienced doesn't exist, simply on the base that YOU have never felt nor experienced it. ;-)