Can we talk F250's for a second? (vs F150)

[kevinatfms]

Why not tune the F150 Ecoboost to improve the part throttle efficiency during towing? It may help better the mileage while towing.

Isnt the tow rating on an F150 like 11,000lbs? 6,000lbs should be cake walk for an F150.

 

[jsquared_25]

And my truck has a 4" lift with 35" m/t's.

 

[mc01svt]

Why not tune the F150 Ecoboost to improve the part throttle efficiency during towing? It may help better the mileage while towing.

there's a reason why they are detuned and run rich from the factory, its for longevity/durability. Increasing boost, fuel rates and more aggressive timing will win you some drag races but when towing heavy for 10k per year thats the last thing you want to do.

 

[nicktoney]

While towing this much shouldn't be hard on the f150, towing it where we do, I would say makes that trailer seem like 8000-10000lbs because of the terrain. Load kills motors and this ecoboost feels like it's always lugging.

 

[SVT-BansheeMan]

So you are going to buy a 60k truck to gain a few more mpg. How many miles do you have to drive to recoup that 60k spent?

Every mech shop i talked to here stays stay away from diesels unless you absolutely need one. Most guys here dont even need a diesel, they just like having big trucks.

 

[AAG]

Why not buy a used one and save some money? Whatever money you're trying to save with towing mpg you're going to lose in the cost of a new vehicle plus the price increase in maintenance going from a gasser to diesel.

 

[kevinatfms]

there's a reason why they are detuned and run rich from the factory, its for longevity/durability. Increasing boost, fuel rates and more aggressive timing will win you some drag races but when towing heavy for 10k per year thats the last thing you want to do.

I wasn't meaning to say a ragged edge performance tune but just something to maybe clean the factory tune up to help better the mileage. Plenty of guys running the 5 star tow tune. They are reporting almost 80wtq at peak over the factory tune. 5 star also offers warranty protection if need be for the powertrain.

http://5startuning.com/product/2011...t-x4-with-choice-of-5-star-custom-tunes-7015/

 

[black92]

If the truck runs and tows great other than the lack of power and poor MPG, I'd throw a tune on (maybe some downpipes) and call it good enough. A tune will really wake these motors up and possibly improve your mpg a tad. For a tune, I'd give Livernois Motorsports a call.

 

[SVT-BansheeMan]

They are reporting almost 80wtq at peak over the factory tune.

Got a link to the gain during normal driving while towing? Id like to see power on the whole hp and tq curves. off idle to 2500ish and not even half throttle.

 

[VENOM1]

I know this is a Ford based forum but I strongly encourage you to look into a GM diesel truck. My '17 Denali 2500HD Diesel stays at a constant 17.5 mpg with a mix of city and highway driving. I drive a couple hundred miles per day in Colorado and on various different elevations. Lastly, when towing on the same elevations as well as distances I'm seeing 15.8mpg. That said the elevation may play into this but thought it was worth mentioning.

 

[DHG1078]

If you never need to tow more than 6k pounds, and you want better mpg while towing, I would consider the diesel F-150 coming out next year. It won't be fast as it will probably only have 270-ish hp 450 tq, and may "struggle" up hills but will get way better gas mileage year round whether you are towing or not. Should be rated at 9k+ pounds when equipped properly.

I don't think you will save money with a 6.7 diesel.

 

[ford fanatic]

Doesn't triple. And no, it doesn't cost thousands either. Get a warranty if you aren't mechanically inclined just like with any vehicle.




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I've had 3 F150's and 3 Powerstrokes....but hey, what do I know...?

 

[Stevenbekah]

if you are buying a diesel f250 to "save money on gas" just stop right there. The mpg gain while towing is mere cents per mile while the total cost of ownership with the f250 will be tens of thousands $$$ more than the half ton.

in reality you will likely never recoup the purchase price, maintenance fuel and repairs for the diesel. The math doesnt work

cost delta between diesel f250 vs f150 is approximately $13k for equal trim levels

based on fuel cost alone (fuel at $2.00/gal)
8mpg = 25cents per mile
12mpg = 17cents per mile

so the diesel saves you 8 cents per mile while towing. In order to recoup your fuel cost you would need to drive 162,500 miles. When you factor increased insurance, maintenance, and repair cost for the diesel you can put that in the 250k realm.


The only reason to go with the diesel is power. If you're towing a ginormous 5th wheel camper or gooseneck heavy equipment trailer and want to do 75mph up a mountain then you want the diesel. If you want the diesel, then get it but dont convince yourself that there exist any economic justification for it.

the other option is if you own a small business which requires a truck then you can write off the entire cost of the f250 since it has a high enough GVWR to be considered commercial use.

This. All day.

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[kevinatfms]

Got a link to the gain during normal driving while towing? Id like to see power on the whole hp and tq curves. off idle to 2500ish and not even half throttle.

Ill have to search for it again. It was just the peak power listed but the curve was quite a bit over from 1500ish to around 4500 before settling on the 80wtq number.


Another one on a quick search that shows 60wtq through the curve.
http://www.f150ecoboost.net/forum/1...star-91-octane-performance-tune-vs-stock.html

Another showing a 50wtq gain but up top
http://www.morepowertuning.com/2015-f150-ecoboost-3.5-review

One with 125wtq under the curve @ 3000rpm, tune only....
https://www.full-race.com/articles/full-race-f-150-dyno-testing/


There seems to be quite a bit left mid range from the stock tune. Also, the exhaust, while hateful in sound, if opened up seems to generate a bit more under the curve if needed. And i know that this is one shop posting dyno results to sell products but they all seem to gain very large torque numbers on the basic tune alone.

 

[allister]

Thank you all for your helpful input! I am happy to hear everything that was said and plan on going through with purchasing an F250 as soon as I can find the right one.

To be clear, I am not buying it because of the gas mileage, but was more so curious as to what to expect as I knew it would be better than 8mpg, just wasn't exactly sure what.

It's hard to explain what the F150 is like towing, but believe me when I say it's not good, around here at least. If we lived where it was flat then we'd probably be having 0 issues with it and no plan to trade. However in western pa we have lots of curvy hills and it's the hills that scare us We can tell and feel the truck is struggling. Since it has 68k miles, if something major breaks on us that's on our wallet and knowing how it struggles to tow, we would deserve it if we keep going with it.

I should also mention we tow about 11-15k miles a year. If it was just a couple thousand miles, I would probably keep it but we travel a lot with the trailer so everything just makes sense to upgrade. Thank you all again, looking forward to our next Ford purchase!

 

[13COBRA]

I think you might as well just purchase an F-450.

 

[gimmie11s]

Towing mpg depends on a few things:

1. The surface area your trailer presents (wind).
2. How much the trailer weighs.
3. How fast you go while towing.


I came to this thread late, but all of the diesel guys usually tout how great their towing mpg is. Fact is your towing mpg with the 6.7 will improve, but not by much. If you get 8mpg with the F150, expect 9-10 with a new diesel in the exact same conditions (same trailer, same towing miles per hour).

Full disclosure: I owned a 2011 F150 FX4 ecoboost and towed a 10.5k lb toyhauler half a dozen times per year. I now have a 2016 Ram 2500 diesel.

The real reason to upgrade to the 3/4 ton is the far superior towing-focused suspension, brakes, and more powerful motor which all allows you to tow more comfortably with better peace of mind.

My $.02.

 

[BJCobra99]

I own a '16 F350 6.7 CC Long bed, and while towing 75-80mph I get 8mpg towing my toy hauler(only 7k lbs gross) in winter. Lots of hills, high altitude, and winter diesel kill my mpgs. Unloaded I average around 13.5-14.5. If I slow to 65mph, I average around 10mpg towing. Hope this helps!

 

[rotor_powerd]

A Super Duty will pull any load night and day different over a half ton. A diesel one will be even better yet. You won’t even feel 6,000 pounds behind a 6.7. My truck doesn’t even come out of overdrive while pulling a mountain with a load behind it. I’ll never own any truck that isn’t a Super Duty. That said, they are very expensive to buy, maintain, and fix. Very, very expensive. Make sure it will be worth it to you. I’d also skip the 250 and just get a 350. The ride while empty is not noticeably different IMO, especially on a longer wheelbase truck (8 foot bed comes in handy more than you’d think), and the rear end wont sag with a trailer on it.


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[nxhappy]

have you tried a tune on your ecoboost? the HP gains are substantial ....