Any lawyers/law school students?

[ayo232]

Is it worth it? It's not the course material I'm worried about, but primarily the amount of debt for tuition and living expenses for three years.

I'm finishing up my Junior year as a Legal Studies major (should be with honors in the major/program) and I'm sitting on a 3.7 GPA. Technically, upon graduation I would be very desirable to law firms as a paralegal (large law firms only higher paralegals with a bachelor's degree). So that's an option.

Is it worth it? The money for LSAT prep, the test, the fees in applying and sending scores, in addition to the unavoidable debt of tuition and living expenses?

:beer:

 

[lobra97]

i heard it was from a co-worker who just got her bachelors. she said she should've done it and that the LSAT was tricky, not really hard.

another ATTNY i spoke to said its a good idea and investment but expensive. i'm trying to get my bachelors and apply to law school as well, 3 more classes until my assoc so still got along way. good luck

 

[divided]

I work at a law school and I can tell you it's HARD! In every way you can imagine. It's next to impossible to go to school and work at the same time for 90% of the students. It's going to require close to 100% of your attention for the 3-4 years you're there.

Not to mention your 100K+ tuition costs cause most people take extra to cover the fact they're not working.

 

[chrisheltra]

Depends how much debt is involved. Do you know because I dont? You do realize lawyers get paid very well right?

 

[ayo232]

i heard it was from a co-worker who just got her bachelors. she said she should've done it and that the LSAT was tricky, not really hard.

another ATTNY i spoke to said its a good idea and investment but expensive. i'm trying to get my bachelors and apply to law school as well, 3 more classes until my assoc so still got along way. good luck

Yeah, the LSAT is all games and if you can figure them out then you'll do well... with massive studying of course. Good luck to you as well. :cheers:

I work at a law school and I can tell you it's HARD! In every way you can imagine. It's next to impossible to go to school and work at the same time for 90% of the students. It's going to require close to 100% of your attention for the 3-4 years you're there.

Not to mention your 100K+ tuition costs cause most people take extra to cover the fact they're not working.

What do you do at the school? (If you don't mind me asking; just curious). I know most (if not all) prohibit the students from working during school.

Depends how much debt is involved. Do you know because I dont? You do realize lawyers get paid very well right?

Depends on what type of school you go to (public or private) and the actual school. Some schools are as low as $15k a year and some go up to $35k a year but that's just for tuition and excluding living fees, books, etc.

Yes, I know they do. I currently work for a large prestigious law firm. However, how much you make depends on what school you go to, connections, and your class ranking. Some graduate law school and make less than $50k. Of course, there is also the other end of the spectrum as well.

 

[divided]

I work in the I.T. department.

Students are allowed to work while attending school, but under a certain number of hours. I think it's less than 20 a week. Alot of students work for the school in some fashion and that makes it easier for them. Either in admissions, the library, or even I.T.

 

[SID297]

Law school is what you make of it. It can be very difficult if you really put in a lot of effort. There are those that just skate by as well. My advice is, if you want to be a lawyer or work in a field where a law degree is helpful (that's what I do) then do it.

 

[FordSVTFan]

LSAT prep courses are great for those looking to get into an Ivy League school. I bought a book from LSAC that had five old exams and did three of them before taking the LSAT.

As SID pointed out Law School is what you make of it. If you bust your ass for the first year you will cruise through the 2nd and 3rd years, as the first year is the foundation.

The trick is passing the bar.

 

[stangin99]

Anyone here have any experience with IP Law?

One thing that has seriously caught my attention is becoming a patent lawyer....

 

[txyaloo]

Depends how much debt is involved. Do you know because I dont? You do realize lawyers get paid very well right?

Average starting salary is $50k. I don't consider that very well. In general, unless you're top 10% of your class and can go into big law, you're not going to be making a ton of money your first few years.

Anyone here have any experience with IP Law?

One thing that has seriously caught my attention is becoming a patent lawyer....

I know you need a degree in a hard science (chemistry, physics, biology), computer science, or engineering to sit for the patent bar, and if you have one of those degrees, you can be a patent agent w/o a law degree.

 

[stangin99]

I know you need a degree in a hard science (chemistry, physics, biology), computer science, or engineering to sit for the patent bar, and if you have one of those degrees, you can be a patent agent w/o a law degree.

Right, I know that part. I already have a B.S. in Computer Engineering.


I should have said that I was wondering if anyone knows how different the coursework was from normal law or even what the field is like in the day to day.

 

[SID297]

Anyone here have any experience with IP Law?

One thing that has seriously caught my attention is becoming a patent lawyer....

I do some IP law. I've taken a lot of patent law classes and was planning on perusing patent law at one point. Unfortunately, I found the subject extremely boring.

Average starting salary is $50k. I don't consider that very well. In general, unless you're top 10% of your class and can go into big law, you're not going to be making a ton of money your first few years.



I know you need a degree in a hard science (chemistry, physics, biology), computer science, or engineering to sit for the patent bar, and if you have one of those degrees, you can be a patent agent w/o a law degree.

Base salary depends on where you are and what you're doing. It's about 65k in WV. You are correct about the degree requirements. Patent attorneys can make much more than a typical associate.

Right, I know that part. I already have a B.S. in Computer Engineering.


I should have said that I was wondering if anyone knows how different the coursework was from normal law or even what the field is like in the day to day.

Some schools have a number of patent law classes, others may have none. You don't need any specialized classes to sit for the patent bar, but they will really help. The patent bar is very difficult. You basically have to memorize the patent laws and how they work in order to pass.

 

[F8L BYT]

I have taken multiple law classes and am currently in a political science law class this semester. My prof is a lawyer as well and after hearing how much she had to go through and how hard and expensive it was, I don't think I am going to continue trying to get into law school here. There is no specific degree you must have to get into law school, You just must have a bachelors degree.

Law school is extremely competitive and hard to get into. This year they didnt take anyone off the wait list and the average was 3.8gpa and 168 on the lsat.

She said the test after you graduate law school to become a lawyer was the hardest thing she had ever taken and she said if she had not of passed it the first time she would not have taken it again. She studied for a month straight.

It would be awesome to go through with it all but you must be completely dedicated and focused on it all the time.

 

[txyaloo]

Base salary depends on where you are and what you're doing. It's about 65k in WV. You are correct about the degree requirements. Patent attorneys can make much more than a typical associate.

It's hard to justify even at 65k considering the cost of loans unless you get substantial scholarships. I have a friend who is a patent attorney. He was laid off around April year and still hasn't found a job in Texas. Prior to being laid off, he was making around $240k working for a smaller firm.

The money is definitely there, but there are also the attorneys working contract gigs at $10-20 an hour.

 

[SID297]

It's hard to justify even at 65k considering the cost of loans unless you get substantial scholarships. I have a friend who is a patent attorney. He was laid off around April year and still hasn't found a job in Texas. Prior to being laid off, he was making around $240k working for a smaller firm.

The money is definitely there, but there are also the attorneys working contract gigs at $10-20 an hour.

Notice I said base salary, that's what you get just for showing up. If you bill a lot of hours and bring in a lot of money to the firm the bonus can be quite substantial. Most people I know start out getting bonuses in the 10k range. Also, law school in WV at WVU is relatively cheap for in state students (most lawyers in WV are from WV). It's only a few hundred dollars more per semester than undergrad.

 

[PSUCOBRA96]

I am in my final semester at law school, yes it is very hard, your first year is killer, second has more work load, but I found it easier as you already know how to take a law school exam and the work is more application based rather than pure memorization. Law school can be what you make of it.
I will say money wise that I have no idea if it will be worth it, but I do believe that it was worth it to me because I am accomplishing a goal I have wanted all my life. I have also involved myself in the school as the Student Bar Association President, I deal with the Deans of the law school and board of the Alumni on a daily/weekly basis and it has been very rewarding to make positive changes in my school on behalf of the students. I really enjoy politics and even in an academic environment such as a law school politics play a large part. I have made many great friends as well.
Also I have found an area of law that I love and I get to work 20 hours a week doing zoning, ordinance, land use, and urban development law and I get paid. I do not make a ton of money as a student, but in the future I see the work I have put in now will pay off in the future. I also get to make a real life difference in post conviction DNA cases, real life people in jail with real life problems. If I make a difference in just one of those individuals life I feel that it was worth it for that sole reason.
I talk to many prospective students about law school in general so any specific questions you may have please send me a pm.

 

[PSUCOBRA96]

Notice I said base salary, that's what you get just for showing up. If you bill a lot of hours and bring in a lot of money to the firm the bonus can be quite substantial. Most people I know start out getting bonuses in the 10k range. Also, law school in WV at WVU is relatively cheap for in state students (most lawyers in WV are from WV). It's only a few hundred dollars more per semester than undergrad.

very correct, you must also think of it this way, I will graduate at 25, I will work until I am 70, that gives me 45 years to increase that base salary which has much higher potential than a majority of careers. Also I can't think of any older attorneys I know who have completely retired, many work 2 or 3 days a week part time from their homes drafting contracts or wills, or giving legal advice. So you can continue to make money even after you retire as you feel like it. Few other professions can offer that.

On an interesting note today is the 37th anniversary of Roe V. Wade

 

[SID297]

I also want to throw in that the base salary often increases every year (if you earn it) until you make partner.

 

[jshen]

Lawyer for 27 years. If you get into private practice with a law firm- expect to "bill" 2000-2500 hours per year to keep your job. For a new attorney it is easy to have 10+ hours in one billable hour. ( i.e. you will work 80+ hour weeks for years until you become proficient or break down.

If you have a solo practice you will starve for a few years and IF you make it, make sure you have some retirement program- most here do not.

Govt. lawyer- I chose this path as salary is less but is a certainty, also medical and retirement benefits. Trial work is a bear and never gets easier as every case is unique. Prosecuting murders is neither easy nor fun, however some of my fellow prosecutors like the limelight. Major crime cases such as wire taps require working police hours and currently I am putting in an average of 60 hours per week.

Was it worth it? I guess arguing a case before the state supreme court is exciting and for a moment in time, you are the star. Same for national news doing interviews. All in all, I just want to say I made a difference....

I am retiring when I finish litigating some wire tap cases. This is a young man's business and I leave it to the "Adams" of the world.

Good Luck in your decision

 

[ayo232]

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Greatly appreciated.

I will say money wise that I have no idea if it will be worth it, but I do believe that it was worth it to me because I am accomplishing a goal I have wanted all my life.

This is the situation I am in. I love law and I have never viewed myself in another profession. I don't believe there are many moments more memorable than getting accepted, graduating, and passing the bar exam. I want to accomplish this goal as it is what I've always wanted. However, the monetary aspect is a hard one to overlook. :shrug:

Tomorrow, I think I'm going to drive two hours to the school I want to attend and see if I can stir up some motivation. :rockon: