Wont start, no spark on either bank

[DVJ38]

So I started my car a week ago and it misfired and died. I started again and gave it a little gas to hold it so it would atleast run. I did that for two seconds and then thought that I would wait till another time to look into it. It seemed to be flooded to me though.

Then the other day I started it and it died, then wouldn't restart. I pulled all the plugs and they all smelled like fuel and were wet, the tops of all the pistons were wet and some even had puddles of fuel. At this point I'm thinking maybe ignition problem, or maybe the injector O-rings were leaking. Then I drained the fuel from the line and pulled the fuel pump fuse and cranked it. All the fuel blew out, and then I tested for spark. I put a plug in the end of a plug wire and cranked.. no spark. I then placed a plug wire boot against the valve cover bolts in the middle so I could see the spark jump from the boot to the bolt (maybe the plug wasn't in all the way somehow or whatever). I made sure to use a wire that was connected to the driver side coil pack, then a wire that was connected to the passanger side coil pack. Neither of them sparked. I'm assuming I should check for power and ground on both coil packs, then signal wire. I haven't had time to do this yet, but I'm wondering if anyone has any ideas for me.

Cliff Notes: I'm getting fuel, but no spark on either bank. What should I test next?

Thanks guys.

 

[1989Gt.]

coils in ok shape? connections on the coils ok?

 

[crazycarlo]

If your not getting any spark with the line connected and trying to see an arc to the VC then see if your getting power at the plug to the coil pack. If your getting power there Id assume its a bad coil.

 

[pacific4v]

Have u checked crank position sensor?

 

[vettez062002]

cam or crank sensor I would say if BOTH sides are not firing.

the easiest way to tell is to crank the car.

if the RPMs do NOT MOVE at all. its a bad cam or crank sensor.

 

[STAMPEDE3]

Did you have the plug resting on metal (Grounded) when looking?
Screwdriver in end of wire when checking for spark?

 

[DVJ38]

If your not getting any spark with the line connected and trying to see an arc to the VC then see if your getting power at the plug to the coil pack. If your getting power there Id assume its a bad coil.

Well the thing is that I doubt both coils would just go out at the same time, so I figured it was a deeper issue.

Did you have the plug resting on metal (Grounded) when looking?
Screwdriver in end of wire when checking for spark?

Actually I didn't have the plug grounded when I looked at it DOH. However the end of the plug wire boot was against a bolt that should be grounded, and the spark was not jumping out onto the bolt. I guess that's why I did two tests, to account for me being a dumbass lol

cam or crank sensor I would say if BOTH sides are not firing.

the easiest way to tell is to crank the car.

if the RPMs do NOT MOVE at all. its a bad cam or crank sensor.

Bingo! Thanks for jogging my memory on that. I just checked and I have ZERO tach needle movement when cranking. Couldn't remember the trick to telling.

Have u checked crank position sensor?

I unfortunately can't remember how to test it. I would bet that it is the crank sensor instead of the cam sensor though since the front crank seal is seaping oil. I'll bet the little amount of dampness and dirt stuck in there have ruined the sensor. Guess I'll replace that front crank seal the same time as the crank sensor.

Any quick way to test the crank sensor?

Thanks guys! I might get one last burnout on vid before it's put away now! :beer:

 

[Slow95Cobra]

usually if the Check Engine Lamp is on steady while cranking the engine, the PCM isnt getting a RPM signal. put a sensor in and see what ya get

 

[DVJ38]

usually if the Check Engine Lamp is on steady while cranking the engine, the PCM isnt getting a RPM signal. put a sensor in and see what ya get

Ya I think I may just throw a sensor in and see how it goes. I think I would need an O-scope or something to see the electrical pattern the sensor is putting out since it goes back and fourth from 0 to 5. Can't remember though.

 

[Slow95Cobra]

Ya I think I may just throw a sensor in and see how it goes. I think I would need an O-scope or something to see the electrical pattern the sensor is putting out since it goes back and fourth from 0 to 5. Can't remember though.

it should be a square wave form on oscill. with a IDS youd have to back probe with the red and black wire while cranking to trigger it

 

[earico]

Put an ohm meter on the CrankPS. If it shows full continuity (no resistance) then it is bad.

 

[DVJ38]

Cool thanks guys, hopefully I can find time to do this soon!

 

[earico]

If the CrankPS is bad you will also not be getting fuel. Just FYI

 

[DVJ38]

If the CrankPS is bad you will also not be getting fuel. Just FYI

Well I'm definately getting fuel, pump and injectors are working. Hmmm

 

[DVJ38]

Well I tested the crank sensor and the ohms read 330 or somewhere in there. I read online the spec is 300-1000 ohms depending on temperature. Also I had 1.5 V at each wire. I read the spec was between 1-3 V at each wire. So it checks out good there. However, is it supossed to be coated in oil? I don't really think it is. I ordered a crank sensor anyways, then a front crank seal. I never thought about it, but could the timing cover be leaking too? Would I need to remove the timing cover to replace the front crank seal anyways? I'm going to just install a new ford crank sensor and see what happens.. then go from there.

sooooo
Is the crank sensor supossed to be covered in oil?
If not what could be causing it to be covered in oil? Crank seal? Timing cover seal?
Are my able to replace the crank seal without removing the timing cover?

 

[KCRN12]

No, its not "supposed" to have oil on it, but the crank sensor is magnetic, so the oil shouldn't matter. I THINK the crank seal can be replaced without taking off the timing cover, but I don't know for sure. I suppose it's possible the timing cover could be causing the oil soaking, but the crank seal is far more likely.

 

[KCRN12]

Oh, and do you have a scanner? Can you check for codes?

 

[DVJ38]

No, its not "supposed" to have oil on it, but the crank sensor is magnetic, so the oil shouldn't matter. I THINK the crank seal can be replaced without taking off the timing cover, but I don't know for sure. I suppose it's possible the timing cover could be causing the oil soaking, but the crank seal is far more likely.

Oh, and do you have a scanner? Can you check for codes?

I was thinking the oil on the magnetic sensor shouldn't affect the reading either, but who knows. Thanks for your second opinion on the crank seal. I'll let you know how that goes. Ya honestly I was just going to put the sensor back in after disconnecting it and reconnecting it to see if it started due to the connection being moved around/cleaned up.. but decided I might as well fix the oil problem and put in a new sensor while I'm at it.

Of course I don't have a scanner lol. I'll see where I'm at after this.