What do you all consider to be baggage?

[DenverJay]

I just had a conversation with some co-workers about this subject and their answers were a little disturbing to me. Several of my co-workers say that when it comes to politics, the lack of baggage in one's life is baggage in itself. Now, I'm not thinking of running for public office and I really don't even know how we got on this subject. But I wanted to ask you all what you thought on the subject.

First, a little background about myself. I'm 31, a white guy that has a college degree and an IT professional. I've had many girl friends from the age of 16 on up. I haven't had a relationship for the last 2 or 3 years. I have no desire to have children. At this point I'm questioning whether I will ever get married or whether I even desire to be and no I'm not gay (not that there's anything wrong with that ). I have had no children out of wedlock. I've never done drugs, even experimentation. I don't drink alcohol to excess. I've been drunk only 3 times in my life and those times were all during college. I haven't had a speeding ticket in 14 years (knock on wood). I've never been in trouble with the law at all. I never even had detention in highschool. I'm pretty conservative in my political views and I would say my views toward relationships at this point are somewhat synical if I had to put a word to it.

This isn't to say I haven't ever done anything in my life. I just know when enough is enough and I've been responsible about the choices I've made throughout my life.

I personally feel that the lack of baggage in one's life is just that, a lack of baggage. Am I crazy? The people I work with looked at me like I was crazy when I disputed their claims.

I'm curious what others think about this. How do you think society views someone like me? Thanks.

DenverJay

 

[JoeNashville]

For starters, you label yourself as a conservative yet your views on gays are not the right ones for conservatism.

If you engage in a political career be ready for things you never imagined. You'll wake up one morning to find most of your sacred cows slaughtered and hanging in the meat cooler.

It doesn't matter one iota what you actually *did* or *did not* do. If a fellow candidate feels that he has to do it, he (or she) can place a spin on your history (and suggestion is very powerful if there is no way to dispute it) to make you un-electable. Your celibacy is a good point...do you have *any* gay friends? Is *anybody* that you hung out with in high school, college, or your social life now gay, even if they weren't before? I'm afraid that most conservatives won't take it well if there is even a *hint* that you are OK with homosexuality.

I thought about running for political office myself, but eventually abandoned the thought. If you do, make sure you have MANY people, influential people, that understand EXACTLY who you are and who can run interference behind the political battle lines if you need for them to. Politics are VERY strange, and can be impossible for the naiive but well-intentioned (such as myself).

Good luck.

 

[JoeNashville]

Oh, also...anything and everything, including where you go, in the internet is fair game. If you've engaged in a flame war in the past and said some things you shouldn't have, be prepared for your statements to be made public...anti-semitic, anti-black, anti-white, anti-establishment, you name it.

Politics is rough.

 

[xilix]

Well, this is a difficult one. Having gone through, and still going through, the hell that is my life, I look at people like you (no offense at all) and I see lack of experience of what life can actually do to a person, and maybe a real lack of understanding of how bad life can get. BUT.. at the same time, I wish I didn't go through the things I've gone through, and wish I made different decisions in order to lead a life just like yours.

I think it comes down to WHY you haven't experienced the bad (or overwelming) things in life. Is it because of responsible decisions you yourself made, or is it because you were sheltered your whole life by your parents and family? If it is because of decisions you yourself made in order to be a responsible person, then I say :beer:

 

[DenverJay]

Thanks for the replies. I'm not at all comtemplating going into politics. I think the whole subject spawned out of a comment made by a co-worker that I didn't agree with.

I don't really want to get into the whole "how I feel about gays" subject. Except to say that I think my view on gays is pretty much in line with other conservatives. I'm not going to condemn someone because they're gay. I'm not a homophobe or a biggot. People that are gay are still people BUT... I don't agree with gay marraige and I don't feel it should be "promoted" to children as an alternative lifestyle.

That being said, I for one don't see how whether I have any gay friends or not has anything to do with anything. Just because you have a friend that's a minority doesn't mean you aren't a racist biggot. The same holds true for gay friends in my opinion.

It has to do with perception I think. To this day, the democratic party is held by many to be the party that champions minority causes. But the facts dispute that. For example it was the democratic party that was the most outspoken against putting an end to slavery. It was the democratic party that was the biggest obstructionists to the civil rights act, etc etc. Perception however is different and that's what people go on.

I guess after the assault on conservatism that has been happening the last week or so, with democrats of all kinds bashing me and everything I believe in and saying how dumb all of us are that voted for Bush etc, I'm getting a little touchy. I'm pretty sick of it and I refuse to just keep silent when my beliefs are under attack. I guess it's carrying over to other things.

Thanks for your kind words xilix. I don't really think I've been sheltered at all. I just think my parents did a great job raising me and instilling an accute sense of right and wrong. I remember when I was a kid, if I screwed up and got punished by my father for example, the next time that situation came up I thought about it and decided I didn't want to go there again. So, I chose differently the next time.

Speaking of life experience. I recently persued a career in law enforcement. Now, up to this point I've gotten certified and jumped through all the hoops the state said I needed to but to this point I haven't gotten on anywhere. Could it be that my problem getting on with an agency is that I haven't ever done drugs, been strung out on alcohol, been kicked out of school, had run-in's with the law, don't smoke, never been divorced etc etc etc? I know this is changing the subject slightly but it relates a little more closely with what I'm going through personally and I'd like your input.

Sometimes getting feedback from people that don't know you helps to give you some feedback you wouldn't get from friends and family so any input is appreciated.

Sorry this is so long. I just wanted to throw these things out there for comment.

DenverJay

 

[xilix]

Law enforcement is different from state to state, but I'll tell you how it is here in masshole.

It's not too complicated, if you score too high on the academics, you don't get in. I forget the reason for this exactly, I think it might have to do with being "over-qualified". They might think you could just leave the force for another higher paying job or something like that. My father in-law was a detective for 16 years, and he's seen countless people be turned down because they score high, although the testees aren't told this. Kind of rediculous isn't it? I'm not sure if city or state police is what you were going for, but that's all I know about how law enforcement is here in MA. Not sure about anywhere else.

I could ask my father in-law exactly what state and city police departments are looking for if you want and why they don't hire academically gifted people, he knows all the little details that aren't usually expressed by the departments. Some departments and branches are very anal in who they have on their force.

 

[dorky LS1 chick]

I consider kids and/or divorce baggage. Not KIDS..but all of the baby mama drama associated with having kids out of wedlock or having them and then divorcing..

 

[DenverJay]

Yeah xilix I'd love to have some insight into that from someone on the other side so to speak.

Traditionally, I've always scored really high on tests. Most of the apptitude tests I've taken for agencies I've scored 95% or higher on. One test I took for the county sheriff's office where I live I was told I scored higher than anyone ever has. I think I missed one. So, yeah if that's the case, that people who score high on tests get passed over, that could be my problem. As SAD as that is....GAH I can't believe some places do that! That makes no sense to me at all.

The decision to want to get into police work is not an easy one as I'm sure you know. Long hours, crappy shifts, working all holidays. You have to really want to do the kind of work where 95% of the people you come into contact with don't want you there and probably have some personal reason to dislike you. Most important I think is that you have make the decision before you ever pursue a career in law enforcement if in fact you have it in you to take someone's life if you have to. That decision doesn't come easily for most. That and the fact that I put myself through the academy at my own expense and graduated with honors as the top shooter should say a lot about my level of committment to the job.

I'm sorry for the rambling. Anyway, it's frustrating to say the least. Any insight your father-in-law has I would appreciate. Thanks again.

DenverJay

 

[DenverJay]

Yeah, I agree with you dorky LS1 chick. I don't want any part of that.

 

[JoeNashville]

Jay, the way I look at the law enforcement deal is like this (Xilix, as usual, has excellent points, so I won't touch on those):

In the past, the criminals made the best law enforcement officers. Why? They know the ropes. They think like criminals, therefore they know what to anticipate, where to go, who to talk to. The best sheriffs in the Old West were reformed criminals. The CIA and FBI have uses for people that have been on the "inside" and now want to come clean...they are valuable to the bureau.

People like us, who have kept our nose clean all our lives, frankly have little to offer. When I was in management I was astounded weekly (daily on bad weeks) on the types of schemes that were perpetrated in my place of business. I was astounded simply because I don't have a criminal mind. I haven't the single devious fiber in my entire body...I can't live with myself if I act otherwise.

This, in conjunction with what Xilix has already mentioned, may be food for thought for you. I have already been asked by recruiters to leave certain things off my resume because I look "too good". Initially I dropped every recruiter that said that to me because I thought they were full of ish. Now I think they make a lot of sense. Graduating magna cum laude from grad school, plus being a member of an academic honor society, may not get you where you think you should be.

Also, Xilix...from the short period of time that I've talked to you on this board I think you're a standup guy. Whatever you did in the past, is in the past guy. You're making a fresh start.

-Joe

 

[JoeNashville]

Originally posted by DenverJay
That being said, I for one don't see how whether I have any gay friends or not has anything to do with anything. Just because you have a friend that's a minority doesn't mean you aren't a racist biggot. The same holds true for gay friends in my opinion.

It has to do with perception I think. To this day, the democratic party is held by many to be the party that champions minority causes. But the facts dispute that. For example it was the democratic party that was the most outspoken against putting an end to slavery. It was the democratic party that was the biggest obstructionists to the civil rights act, etc etc. Perception however is different and that's what people go on.

I guess after the assault on conservatism that has been happening the last week or so, with democrats of all kinds bashing me and everything I believe in and saying how dumb all of us are that voted for Bush etc, I'm getting a little touchy. I'm pretty sick of it and I refuse to just keep silent when my beliefs are under attack. I guess it's carrying over to other things.

I had to cogitate on your answer for a few minutes before I replied.

Far be it from me to attack someone on the basis of their beliefs, especially when they have thought about them well in advance and have a defensible position.

I believe you understood my point in a roundabout way. You mentioned that it's all about perception...I brought up the gay thing as a case in point. All someone has to do is sense the general mood of a constituency, and if they know that your view would not sit well with them then they can spin it out of control into the "baggage" problem first mentioned.

Of course it's not fair. It shouldn't matter what anybody else thinks, and what we think shouldn't have a bearing on whether we can do a good job in our chosen professions or not, especially if its only tangentially related. However, perceptions do matter...especially in public sector positions.

It's not right, but that's the way it is. I used to be so frustrated over perceptions at one of my former positions I just flat decided not to play the game. What happened was that I did not adequately manage the perceptions of me elsewhere in the company, and it made life very hard for me in the job.

It's only advice (not even unsolicited)...it's worth what you paid for it.

 

[DenverJay]

Very good points

Excellent points all around CarpetCityCobra. I understand what you're saying. At this point I'm not totally sure if law enforcement is what I'm supposed to be doing. Frankly, the whole hiring process you have to go through has got me completely burned out. I would have to say at this point that I'm probably a little jaded when it comes to the process itself and I know that doesn't help me at all.

Right now though, I have a good job in IT working with people I really like and for a company I really like. I don't have to do shift work or work nights. I don't have to work weekends and all holidays. I don't have to work out in the cold. I don't have people cussing me out for doing my job or worse yet, shooting at me.

It's a different world being a cop. A different lifestyle. At this point I'm looking at what I have and I'm pretty thankful to have it. I'm starting to think that law enforcement should have given me a chance in the beginning because I'm not sure they're going to get another shot.

If and it's a big IF I apply to another agency I'm not sure what to expect really. My outlook on the process has changed. Perhaps my outlook on law enforcement as a career has changed. And I'm not sure whether my current attitude will help me win them over.

Thanks very much for all your replies, I really appreciate your input.

DenverJay