Watts Link Time: Fays2 or BMR

[03DSGMach1]

I’ve decided it’s time to move on from the PHB setup to a Watts Body Mounted setup. My biggest reason for the move is the extra stability over rough/uneven roads. The car is mainly street driven, cruising and the occasional on ramp fun. What experiences does everyone have with either setup i.e install, NVH, street manners? I’d prefer to keep NVH to the minimum.

 

[kazman]

I went with Fay's. I perused his website and had a few questions, so I called him and he explained that he mostly replicated the Ford engineered design from their Trans-Am racing days, as they had a depth of engineering not available to many. I like the idea of having Ford engineering involved.
Instructions were clear and install was straight forward, not ideal on jack stands, but can be done. NVH is a non-issue as there is only one contact from the body to the axle, and it is a bearing.
Jim is always available for support and a straight shooter IMO.
However, I would suggest you research and query both companies, and make your decision from there.



*never mind the FR plaque, it is a Fays2 5 position as opposed to the 3 position Shelby unit offered by Jim.

 

[98 Saleen Cobra]

Neither. Cortex racing

 

[Vinnie_B]

Shelby Watts link here. No complaints! It just works and does exactly what it is suppose to do. Never had any NVH issues. As stated above. Cortex Racing would be my choice if I ever decide to upgrade from the shelby watts link.

CorteX 2005-2014 Mustang Xtreme-Grip™ Watts Link System - Street

CorteX 2005-2014 Mustang Xtreme-Grip™ Watts Link System - Street

www.cortexracing.com

 

[kazman]

^^^ made by Jim Fay for Shelby. I have a three hole bracket in blue like that also, no propeller, arms or tube clamps. I acquired a huge lot of GT500 suspension parts a while back, which started my investigation.
Jim told me he made the three hole because SAI didn't want the axle dropping so much when on a lift, which happens with the 5 hole. However, you lose adjustability with only three holes.



ps. The red one in the photo was painted blue and is installed as shown in my first post.

 

[Vinnie_B]

^^^ made by Jim Fay for Shelby. I have a three hole bracket in blue like that also, no propeller, arms or tube clamps. I acquired a huge lot of GT500 suspension parts a while back, which started my investigation.
Jim told me he made the three hole because SAI didn't want the axle dropping so much when on a lift, which happens with the 5 hole. However, you lose adjustability with only three holes.

View attachment 1827289

ps. The red one in the photo was painted blue as is installed as shown in my first post.

I wonder if SAI did this because they were concerned about the rear tunnel brace on there anti hop upgrade? Per.......BMR when you raise the vehicle on a lift, you have to watch that the driveshaft clears the tunnel brace do to suspension hanging down on 13-14's.... Hmmm? I guess i'll be finding out real soon when I install a new rearend and do the antihop upgrade this spring!

 

[03DSGMach1]

Shelby Watts link here. No complaints! It just works and does exactly what it is suppose to do. Never had any NVH issues. As stated above. Cortex Racing would be my choice if I ever decide to upgrade from the shelby watts link.

CorteX 2005-2014 Mustang Xtreme-Grip™ Watts Link System - Street

CorteX 2005-2014 Mustang Xtreme-Grip™ Watts Link System - Street

www.cortexracing.com

View attachment 1827261

Thanks for the input Vinnie. Can I ask why you would choose the Cortex? I was pretty much set on a body mount watts link for its easier install.

I need to do more research but I’ve read that one of the cons of the diff mounted units is that they put extra stress on the diff.

 

[03DSGMach1]

^^^ made by Jim Fay for Shelby. I have a three hole bracket in blue like that also, no propeller, arms or tube clamps. I acquired a huge lot of GT500 suspension parts a while back, which started my investigation.
Jim told me he made the three hole because SAI didn't want the axle dropping so much when on a lift, which happens with the 5 hole. However, you lose adjustability with only three holes.

View attachment 1827289

ps. The red one in the photo was painted blue and is installed as shown in my first post.

Thanks for the info. How was the install and any NVH? Would you choose a Fays2 again?

 

[Vinnie_B]

Thanks for the input Vinnie. Can I ask why you would choose the Cortex? I was pretty much set on a body mount watts link for its easier install.

I need to do more research but I’ve read that one of the cons of the diff mounted units is that they put extra stress on the diff.

I like my shelby (AKA fays) watts link.....don't get me wrong. But just like Kazman stated it has its cons. For cruising around and helping out with the solid axle hopping around on you from bumps, it works just fine. If i ever felt the need to upgrade it......cortex racing hands down. They have some really high quality..... well engineered suspension equipment that gives you better flexibility in adjustments.

 

[Fat Boss]

I put a Fays2 on my Boss 302 and wouldn't do it again. Weight and NVH added for not a lot of gain IMO, and that was on a street/track car. For street only I wouldn't even consider it.

 

[Bad Company]

I run the CorTex Racing watts link. It is a bolt on installation kit that has both a street version and a race version. The only thing I'd consider in the install that can be a pain is if you have a Track Pack option. The rear cover comes with the ports for the oil cooler and a boss for the oil temperature sensor. You would also need to include in the purchase of the Watts Link, the differential oil plumbing kit, if your car is a TP car and has a diff cooler. This Watts Link does require you to install the CorTex differential cover. The CorTex rear cover does incorporate a rear axle girdle also. Now my Watts Link is the race version with spherical bearings, along with his rear axle lower control arms, lower control relocation brackets and a torque arm. I love it, but it does transmit NVH. I was looking for all out performance and didn't care about the NVH. If you purchase the CorTex Watts Link you can add the Torque Arm at a later date when the funds become available. I can't tell you how much or how little the NVH is present with street version of the Watts Link. What I can say is that Fillip at CorTex works diligently to provide the best products and is a larger supporter of the Mustang road race community.

Here is a video of it in action

 

[03DSGMach1]

I run the CorTex Racing watts link. It is a bolt on installation kit that has both a street version and a race version. The only thing I'd consider in the install that can be a pain is if you have a Track Pack option. The rear cover comes with the ports for the oil cooler and a boss for the oil temperature sensor. You would also need to include in the purchase of the Watts Link, the differential oil plumbing kit, if your car is a TP car and has a diff cooler. This Watts Link does require you to install the CorTex differential cover. The CorTex rear cover does incorporate a rear axle girdle also. Now my Watts Link is the race version with spherical bearings, along with his rear axle lower control arms, lower control relocation brackets and a torque arm. I love it, but it does transmit NVH. I was looking for all out performance and didn't care about the NVH. If you purchase the CorTex Watts Link you can add the Torque Arm at a later date when the funds become available. I can't tell you how much or how little the NVH is present with street version of the Watts Link. What I can say is that Fillip at CorTex works diligently to provide the best products and is a larger supporter of the Mustang road race community.

Here is a video of it in action

Thanks for all the info. I’ve been reading up on the CorTex setup and was wondering if a breather was needed for install? I saw it as an option on their site.

 

[Bad Company]

Thanks for all the info. I’ve been reading up on the CorTex setup and was wondering if a breather was needed for install? I saw it as an option on their site.

On mine I moved the breather to the driver's side axle tube. The axle housing comes predrilled and threaded to do this from Ford. This is the original placement for the vent that Ford used on the earlier or less optioned Mustangs with a standard stamped steel cover. I installed a catch can in the trunk with the catch can plumbed in a manner so that if any gear lube made it to the catch can that it would drain back to the axle. I also plumbed a vent for the catch can back under the car so I wouldn't smell gear lube in the car. I did this in this manner so as to not have to worry about any gear lube possibly leaking from the axle at high speeds. The CorTex vent I'm sure will work well without any issues also. My CorTex Watts Link is an earlier version that didn't have the features he now incorporates into this newer design to facilitate an easy bolt on installation, plus support the GT500s with the TP option and aluminum rear cover with the vent located there vesus a Mustang GT 5.0.

 

[850SNCobra]

I've read a few posts that mention something about the weight of the Fays2....Is the Cortex Watts link any lighter?

 

[kazman]

Thanks for the info. How was the install and any NVH? Would you choose a Fays2 again?

I believe I covered that in my first post and yes I would.

No ragrets..

 

[Fat Boss]

Didn't Sam Strano win an SCCA title using a panhard bar? Might want to talk to him to get his thoughts.

 

[Bad Company]

I've read a few posts that mention something about the weight of the Fays2....Is the Cortex Watts link any lighter?

Yes it is significantly lighter compared to the Fays2 or SAI unit.

Didn't Sam Strano win an SCCA title using a panhard bar? Might want to talk to him to get his thoughts.

The big difference in the Watts Link versus a Panhard Bar is the Roll Center of the vehicle is constantly changing as the suspension is traveling through it's range of motion with the Panhard Bar. This changes how the vehicle is handling as the suspension moves while going through a turn, whereas with a Watts Link the rear axle Roll Center is constant regardless of how the suspension is moving making the car feel more predictable while going through a turn.

Here is a quote from CorTex's website.

"Four possible pivot location points of the center pivot, which is the rotation center of the rear of the vehicle. Moving it up or down relative to the center of gravity of the vehicle allows the roll stiffness of the suspension to be changed."

This allows you to play with how the car feels in the corner. You can adjust it to feel heavy in the front(pushing) or Neutral or Loose(tail end wanting to slide out on you). A Panhard Bar can't do this unless you can raise or lower the mounting point of the bar at the car frame or rear axle mounting point. But again even if you did these modifications for the PB it still moves the roll center as the axle moves up and down. A PB is a compromise and the reason it is done is the fact it is cheaper and easier to do.

 

[850SNCobra]

Hell yeah, awesome thread with some solid info. Thanks!