Underage Drinking ticket.....need some advice

[TREBlack02]

Been on this board for awhile and finally decided to sign up. I just got an Underage drinking ticket in NJ. The cop wrote the wrong date on the ticket. It says 8/16/04 when it actually happened 7/16/04. Do you think this could dismiss the case or have any effect on it? The fine is for $380 and then 2 hours of community service or an extra $100. The cops never breathalized me, nor saw me with a beer in my hand, nor did they even ask me if i was drinking. They saw my friends and I outside at around 6pm with red cups and just walked up and came into the house where they found some cases of beer. The funny thing is they left the keg for us because they said it was too much of a pain in the ass to take with them. Let me know what you guys think. I'm gonna try and fight it but I don't think it's going to be easy. Thanks.

Tim

 

[BLUBLLS]

I would assume they need proof. I mean it is pretty much thier word against yours. Especially if you just had cases in the house and they didn't see anyone drinking it or breathalize anyone, however I could be wrong.

By the way how old are you?

 

[TREBlack02]

I'll be 19 in September. It was just a bunch of college kids having a good time. I could understand late at night but it was right around dinner time. This was in Seaside,NJ which has a history for cops busting kids for things like this. Thanks for the input.

Tim

 

[BluePastU]

Im not positive, but wouldnt they need some sort of search warrant to enter your house to search it? Unless of course you said it was OK for them to search the house. You could say that they got the evidence without proper warrant...

 

[poorboy]

not that I'm condoning this or saying that I am 100% positive because I am not a LEO or a lawyer, but you should not have too much of a problem getting this dropped because they left the alcohol in posession of people that are underage they are risking a potential lawsuit.

 

[mswaim]

Were the officers simply driving by and saw you guys outside with red cups, or were they dispatched there due to some kind of disturbance or other reason?

How many people are we talking about in attendance that evening?

Were there any adults present, or anyone of legal drinking age?

Who owns the house?

Lots of questions to answer before proper advice can be provided.

 

[DoomsDay]

First off YES the cops do have to have evidence like a breathalizer, BAT (Blood alcohol test), ect to write you a ticket like that. I would concider maybe some legal representation if you go to court (which I would instead of just paying the fine outright) because the judge will probably look at you guys for what you are, a bunch of college guys and treat you like you are guilty before you walk in the door.

As far the the search warrent goes, I would think that they would need a search warrent to enter the premisses but then again i know when the cops used to hit up our parties they would just walk through like they owned the place and never said anythign about a warrent.

Esqueddy would be the guy on here to ask about stuff like this

 

[Trooper4985]

Sack up and pay your fine... Be an adult and accept responsiblity for the things you do. $380 is a little steep compared to an ABC violation in NY but it's the price you pay for playing the game. The cops could have made you dump your alcohol but, like me, they didn't... They let you have your fun up to the point that it becomes a problem beyond their control. The police saw you so Joe Public could see you too and none of us like it when Joe Public calls the brass and complains that we aren't doing our job. Be smart... keep your illegal activity out of public view and you wont be hassled by the police.

 

[Mr.Shortround]

I'm not familiar with Jersey's laws, but this sounds like an easy case to beat. They need some sort of proof that you were drinking, IE some sort of sobriety test. Did your cups say anything relating to alcohol on them?? Because that will also get you a underage drinking ticket. Also, if there was no one underage with a alcohol container that ran inside, it sounds like they don't have any reason to go in the house. Definately go to court and fight this.

 

[hillie16]

Originally posted by Cobra04
First off YES the cops do have to have evidence like a breathalizer, BAT (Blood alcohol test), ect to write you a ticket like that. I would concider maybe some legal representation if you go to court (which I would instead of just paying the fine outright) because the judge will probably look at you guys for what you are, a bunch of college guys and treat you like you are guilty before you walk in the door.

As far the the search warrent goes, I would think that they would need a search warrent to enter the premisses but then again i know when the cops used to hit up our parties they would just walk through like they owned the place and never said anythign about a warrent.

Esqueddy would be the guy on here to ask about stuff like this

In PA, don't know about NJ the law is "Posession, consumption or transportation", meaning if you are at a party where underage drinking is taking place, you are just as guilty for being there. However, most times we just give everyone there a PBT (portable breath test) and only cite those who have been drinking. As for a search warrant, they witnessed in plain view the drinking occuring outside, and therefore can enter the house as part of the investigation due to extigent circumstances. Again, this is PA, not sure if NJ is the same.

 

[Mr.Shortround]

meaning if you are at a party where underage drinking is taking place, you are just as guilty for being there.

not to pick a fight with you... but how can I be responsible for someone else drinking??? the mear act of attending a party doesn't constitute "Posession, consumption or transportation" could you explain this a bit more?

As for a search warrant, they witnessed in plain view the drinking occuring outside, and therefore can enter the house as part of the investigation due to extigent circumstances.

Once again, doesn't that depend on if the cups were alcoholic containers or just plain cups? If they were just cups, what rights do the police have to come onto someone elses property and check to see what they are drinking?


also MRoadster, feel lucky. If you get caught in Colorado, you automatically lose your drivers license.

 

[TREBlack02]

To answer a few of the questions:

Were the officers simply driving by and saw you guys outside with red cups, or were they dispatched there due to some kind of disturbance or other reason?

They were just driving by and saw some kids with red cups.

How many people are we talking about in attendance that evening?

Probably about 10 outside and another 15 inside.

Were there any adults present, or anyone of legal drinking age?

There was one of our friends who is 22, and he didn't get a ticket.

Who owns the house?

We rented it for the week, so whoever the landlord is.

As for the cups, they were the generic red SOLO cups and had no writing or anything on them.

I'm in the process of talking to a lawyer to see what he thinks.

Thanks for the replies. And Trooper4985 , I'm assuming you are a cop so you have a certain bias toward this matter. Thanks for the input though.

Tim

 

[hillie16]

Originally posted by Mr.Shortround
not to pick a fight with you... but how can I be responsible for someone else drinking??? the mear act of attending a party doesn't constitute "Posession, consumption or transportation" could you explain this a bit more?

You are not responsible for their drinking, but you are a participant in their doing so. (I don't write the laws just enforce them, this is how the state defines it) By being there when a crime is commited, even the summary of underage drinking, you are considered to be a participant, by being in the immediate vicinity, and neither leaving, turning it in, or preventing it from occuring further. Therefore you are considered to be in "posession" whether you are holding one or not by being in the immediate vicinity.

Originally posted by Mr.Shortround
Once again, doesn't that depend on if the cups were alcoholic containers or just plain cups? If they were just cups, what rights do the police have to come onto someone elses property and check to see what they are drinking?

It can be as simple as saying hi to them, then smelling the alcohol. Possibly a neighbor called in a noise complaint, or any other number of reasons. They may not have been there for the sole reason to see if they were drinking I can't say because I wasn't there. MRoadster98 states that they were just driving by and saw people with red cups. Maybe they said hi and one of the people walked over and said hi, maybe the officer simply asked what was in the cup, and someone told him, maybe someone called anonymously and ratted them out, there could be any number of reasons that they (those cited) wouldn't know about, maybe not until a hearing. As I said, I wasn't there, and I'm going by PA law, not NJ.

 

[FordSVTFan]

Originally posted by hillie16
In PA, don't know about NJ the law is "Posession, consumption or transportation", meaning if you are at a party where underage drinking is taking place, you are just as guilty for being there. However, most times we just give everyone there a PBT (portable breath test) and only cite those who have been drinking. As for a search warrant, they witnessed in plain view the drinking occuring outside, and therefore can enter the house as part of the investigation due to extigent circumstances. Again, this is PA, not sure if NJ is the same.

Hillie, it is the same in NJ. No tests need to be administered and the entrance of the home is part of the investigation into a current crime so no warrant is needed.

 

[~Lucky 13~]

Originally posted by Trooper4985
Sack up and pay your fine... Be an adult and accept responsiblity for the things you do. $380 is a little steep compared to an ABC violation in NY but it's the price you pay for playing the game. The cops could have made you dump your alcohol but, like me, they didn't... They let you have your fun up to the point that it becomes a problem beyond their control. The police saw you so Joe Public could see you too and none of us like it when Joe Public calls the brass and complains that we aren't doing our job. Be smart... keep your illegal activity out of public view and you wont be hassled by the police.

Heres some advice SHUT YOUR MOUTH. He posted about how to get out of this crazy expensive ticket or if anyone thought he could fight it and win he didnt need you commanding him to pay :nono:

Playing the game haha your a fruit. "Like me, they didn't"... so what do you do? Just ticket kids and leave so they can keep drinking and then drive home drunk after they are done drinking what you didnt bother making them dump? Smart move! :nonono: Way to make yourself liable and put your job at risk smart guy :loser:

 

[Mr.Shortround]

You are not responsible for their drinking, but you are a participant in their doing so. (I don't write the laws just enforce them, this is how the state defines it) By being there when a crime is commited, even the summary of underage drinking, you are considered to be a participant, by being in the immediate vicinity, and neither leaving, turning it in, or preventing it from occuring further. Therefore you are considered to be in "posession" whether you are holding one or not by being in the immediate vicinity

WOW. That's crazy! heh, I would hate to be in a bar if a underager got in then :uh oh:

Thanks for the explanation, but I still have 1 more question for you. Even if they could smell the alcohol, do officers have the right to go onto someone elses property and ID people??? Don't they have to look grossly underage?? Sorry about all the questions, this has jsut perked my interest a little. :beer:

 

[hillie16]

Originally posted by Mr.Shortround
WOW. That's crazy! heh, I would hate to be in a bar if a underager got in then :uh oh:

Thanks for the explanation, but I still have 1 more question for you. Even if they could smell the alcohol, do officers have the right to go onto someone elses property and ID people??? Don't they have to look grossly underage?? Sorry about all the questions, this has jsut perked my interest a little. :beer:

If an underager got into a bar, then it's the bars responsibility, and they would be subject to a fine from the liquor control board. A bar is a place where one would reasonably expect to find alcohol, and be expected to produce some type of age verification, so other in the bar would expect their fellow patrons to be of age. However at a party where other underage people are drinking, they do not expect everyone to be of age, it is not a place where one would reasonably expect alcohol, nor is there any type of age verification.
As for the question, they only have to appear underage, not grossly underage. It's the opinion of the officer. I can't really say what was what abou what occured as I wasn't there.

 

[Mr.Shortround]

Thanks for the info.

-Stu

 

[hillie16]

No problem, it's why we are here.

 

[LogiWorld123]

Go for broke and appeal the ruling under the premise you are not offered equal rights as a 21 year old, and as such, the state law is in violation of the us constitution



<wish i had gotten a MIP>