Timing issues??

[PHILLY_SVT]

Just bought a 98 cobra (there is a recent post about purchase). I knew the car had some motor work required but it wasn't blowing smoke, knocking, and I didn't hear any tapping or metal sounds when I saw the car so I felt the engine was good except for some "tweaking". The car won't idle and there is no throttle response after about 3000 RPM. The car did have the IMRC valves zip tied so I know this isn't the issue (i think).

Once I got the car back to my home I replaced the spark plugs, wires, and cleaned the MAF. I was hoping for some improvements but I did not get much. Only think is that I didn't smell the fuel out the exhaust anymore. I plugged my neighbors scanner and ran the car. At a 22% throttle position, it was showing 25-32 degrees in advance timing. Could this be the cause for the rough/no idle and no power? What would be my next steps to confirm or fix?

Any help would be great!

 

[ashleyroachclip]

I see you are about maxed in timing in your second picture , of idle and timing .
I dont know a lot about the ecm strategy on those B head engines.
But this is an opinion.
The runners being tied open , is not what the computer is expecting to see , and is lost .
Your fuel trims look good , both long and short .

Any chance you have checked to see that the runners are Intact and would function if you had the cables and controller?
Just a thought .
It has been stated here , you need to have some tuning, when deleting the runners , so that is where you probably are .
Find a way to close them at idle , see what happens .
Sorry I cant be of more help .

 

[PHILLY_SVT]

I was thinking about cutting the zip ties to see if that helped but then they would be stuck closed until I could get new cables and maybe a controller. Another thought I had is that I haven't checked to see if the car is chipped and with a crappy tune. I've heard some folks simply pulling the upgraded chip out and the car running better.

 

[ashleyroachclip]

The picture showed at one point shows , no cables , but maybe the co trailers and cables are there , just stuffed out of sight ?
Pull the computer , you can see if there is a chip easy enough .
Someone here probably has a used set and controller you can buy .check around .
I dont think the delete / tune gains you much in this case.
Those heads were designed for those imrc's , and it is a design used today on the coyote .

 

[scottydsntknow]

Pull the ecu out and see if the yahoo who had the car has a chip in it. Next would be to get in touch with a good remote tuner or take it to a local dyno guy and get them to read some datalogs. I've had two cars where there was weird shit like this going on and pull the ecu and sure enough there is duct tape on the end and some random assed chip in there.

 

[PHILLY_SVT]

Started to pull the ECU but didn't have a 5.5mm to unscrew the one screw. Leaving on business until the weekend so this will give me a nice weekend project ahead. I also switched out the IAC with no result. Still fell flat on its face after letting go of the throttle. Will report back once I get back and pull the ECU.

 

[PHILLY_SVT]

Alright so I am back at it. Pulled the ECU and the black plastic plate is still on the ECU. Pulled it out and confirmed there is no chip. Still doesn't idle or have good power. How, I started to review everything in the motor and noticed something. See attached. This is my current wiring from when I bought the car. I think 5 and 6 are swapped. Considering they are bang-bang in the firing order, this would mean 2 back-to-back cylinders wouldn't fire - easily killing RPM and idle. Am I wrong? Should I simply swap the 2 and see what happens?

 

[Tillerman77]

From my 97 SM.

 

[PHILLY_SVT]

Quick update: Swapping the wires seemed to make it idle better. I also noticed a vacuum leak with my gauge so once I got that fixed it seem to idle near perfect. As for the timing, on cold startup its no around 25 degrees adv but after about 2 minutes and the idle drops, it goes down around 9-12. I think this is about right. Yes?

 

[cbrown9064]

You can't really judge timing without looking at the calibration. And on a stock box, there are lots of variables that will adjust the main timing table.

If you don't have a chip, don't worry about timing. Nothing you can do about it. Keep tracking down the errors and vacuum leaks.

FYI, it is a simple 5 minute deal for a tuner with a Mongoose cable and right software to disable the IMRC and flash it back. Then tie them open or better yet remove with replacement plates. However, on a stock motor, best thing is to get the IMRC working again.

 

[PHILLY_SVT]

I have a mustang performance shop minutes up the road so I may call them up and see if they can do some diagnostics and potentially a tune.