procharger on e85

[97crystalwhite]

i have a p1sc setup on a 11:1 motor with e85. 3 core intercooler with a red race BOV. 11 lbs. the car made 515rwhp and 454rwtq, i added a short runner intake and a boost a spark to widen the gap. i had the plugs gapped at .18 on ngk tr6 plugs. and after the boost a spark i opened them up to .28. the power went higher instead of peaking around 6500, but i lost 10rwhp and 20 rwtq. it was building 12's but not making any more power. can anyone shed some light? im doing wire upgrade on my divison x fuel hat, it has two walbro 255's and 80# simen deka injectors. i need advice on what may be the problem. i think im going to put the stock intake back on and add a 14# pulley

 

[My2003Mach1]

i have a p1sc setup on a 11:1 motor with e85. 3 core intercooler with a red race BOV. 11 lbs. the car made 515rwhp and 454rwtq, i added a short runner intake and a boost a spark to widen the gap. i had the plugs gapped at .18 on ngk tr6 plugs. and after the boost a spark i opened them up to .28. the power went higher instead of peaking around 6500, but i lost 10rwhp and 20 rwtq. it was building 12's but not making any more power. can anyone shed some light? im doing wire upgrade on my divison x fuel hat, it has two walbro 255's and 80# simen deka injectors. i need advice on what may be the problem. i think im going to put the stock intake back on and add a 14# pulley

I have a Procharger myself and run a couple different tunes for a couple different fuel combinations. My car is complicated...

Your compression is way to high for supercharging.(issue #1)
Your making good power for having a P1-SC.../ Good boost. However when you over spin the procharger this will happen... you will begin to get belt slip, power loss and ruin the supercharger while over spinning it.

Regardless of what procharger or anyone tells you about that P1-Sc or even an F1-A, the head unit can only produce HP levels its parts can hold. Unless you upgraded your supercharger bearings (internally) to ceramic or something as such along with better seals it will never reach the HP levels advertised.
IE: I have an F1-A.. barely 2 years old, aprox 1000 miles, never hit more than 22lbs of boost, its adult driven, with only about 15 dyno pulls. My Mach 1 sits in the garage 90% of the time. I have a seal that needs replacing. :nono: obviously this shouldn't happen, I mean this F1-A supercharger is rated up to 38lbs boost right? I can't see it holding that kind of power, unless I upgraded my internals. (which I'm currently doing)

I'm going to be completely honest here and tell you all the upgraded wiring and special coils is just a waste of money at your power level.

I'm currently safe tuned, however my set up will produce well over 850 RWHP and im still using stock COP, Wiring etc

Once again your issue is your block being 11:1! your going to BLOW that engine with more boost if you ask me.

Centri's like to be 9:2.1 to 9:5 ratio a roots you can be close to 10:1 but still thats pushing it.

I'd say your at the max.... I would take that procharger off, get $1600 for it on this site and buy yourself a 150 to 175 shot NO2 kit...
OR build a bottom end with the correct compression for supercharging.

Save some extra cash too, that P1-SC is going to hold you back even on the correct compression block.(issue #2)

Good Luck
any questions PM me :bash:

 

[firemanlightnin]

I have a Procharger myself and run a couple different tunes for a couple different fuel combinations. My car is complicated...

Your compression is way to high for supercharging.(issue #1)
Your making good power for having a P1-SC.../ Good boost. However when you over spin the procharger this will happen... you will begin to get belt slip, power loss and ruin the supercharger while over spinning it.

Regardless of what procharger or anyone tells you about that P1-Sc or even an F1-A, the head unit can only produce HP levels its parts can hold. Unless you upgraded your supercharger bearings (internally) to ceramic or something as such along with better seals it will never reach the HP levels advertised.
IE: I have an F1-A.. barely 2 years old, aprox 1000 miles, never hit more than 22lbs of boost, its adult driven, with only about 15 dyno pulls. My Mach 1 sits in the garage 90% of the time. I have a seal that needs replacing. :nono: obviously this shouldn't happen, I mean this F1-A supercharger is rated up to 38lbs boost right? I can't see it holding that kind of power, unless I upgraded my internals. (which I'm currently doing)

I'm going to be completely honest here and tell you all the upgraded wiring and special coils is just a waste of money at your power level.

I'm currently safe tuned, however my set up will produce well over 850 RWHP and im still using stock COP, Wiring etc

Once again your issue is your block being 11:1! your going to BLOW that engine with more boost if you ask me.

Centri's like to be 9:2.1 to 9:5 ratio a roots you can be close to 10:1 but still thats pushing it.

I'd say your at the max.... I would take that procharger off, get $1600 for it on this site and buy yourself a 150 to 175 shot NO2 kit...
OR build a bottom end with the correct compression for supercharging.

Save some extra cash too, that P1-SC is going to hold you back even on the correct compression block.(issue #2)

Good Luck
any questions PM me :bash:

Words from a very wise man.... :bowdown: im trying to upgrade to a F1A

 

[50q's]

I have a Procharger myself and run a couple different tunes for a couple different fuel combinations. My car is complicated...

Your compression is way to high for supercharging.(issue #1)
Your making good power for having a P1-SC.../ Good boost. However when you over spin the procharger this will happen... you will begin to get belt slip, power loss and ruin the supercharger while over spinning it.

Regardless of what procharger or anyone tells you about that P1-Sc or even an F1-A, the head unit can only produce HP levels its parts can hold. Unless you upgraded your supercharger bearings (internally) to ceramic or something as such along with better seals it will never reach the HP levels advertised.
IE: I have an F1-A.. barely 2 years old, aprox 1000 miles, never hit more than 22lbs of boost, its adult driven, with only about 15 dyno pulls. My Mach 1 sits in the garage 90% of the time. I have a seal that needs replacing. :nono: obviously this shouldn't happen, I mean this F1-A supercharger is rated up to 38lbs boost right? I can't see it holding that kind of power, unless I upgraded my internals. (which I'm currently doing)

I'm going to be completely honest here and tell you all the upgraded wiring and special coils is just a waste of money at your power level.

I'm currently safe tuned, however my set up will produce well over 850 RWHP and im still using stock COP, Wiring etc

Once again your issue is your block being 11:1! your going to BLOW that engine with more boost if you ask me.

Centri's like to be 9:2.1 to 9:5 ratio a roots you can be close to 10:1 but still thats pushing it.

I'd say your at the max.... I would take that procharger off, get $1600 for it on this site and buy yourself a 150 to 175 shot NO2 kit...
OR build a bottom end with the correct compression for supercharging.

Save some extra cash too, that P1-SC is going to hold you back even on the correct compression block.(issue #2)

Good Luck
any questions PM me :bash:

Compression isn't too high for a supercharger if he is running e85 which has yet to detonate. 11.1 would be extremely to high for pump gas car, but e85 is a whole different animal. Many members on here are building e85 based motors for eatons and running high compression around 11.1. If anyone ever tells you that boost and compression aren't good for each other they do not know what they are talking about, boost and compression on low octane will detonate but e85 has yet to detonate. Go check out the terminator forum and you can read up on an e85 lysolm build that's high compression motor. go to the distillery and talk in there about your problem. Much more helpful because of the knowledge many have about e85. Your problem could be not enough timing. A non ported eaton running 15 pounds with 26 degrees of timing on e85 just put down some mid 550.

Head over to the distillery and don't listen to anyone thats says compression is too high. Its not for e85 not even close.

 

[My2003Mach1]

Compression isn't too high for a supercharger if he is running e85 which has yet to detonate. 11.1 would be extremely to high for pump gas car, but e85 is a whole different animal. Many members on here are building e85 based motors for eatons and running high compression around 11.1. If anyone ever tells you that boost and compression aren't good for each other they do not know what they are talking about, boost and compression on low octane will detonate but e85 has yet to detonate. Go check out the terminator forum and you can read up on an e85 lysolm build that's high compression motor. go to the distillery and talk in there about your problem. Much more helpful because of the knowledge many have about e85. Your problem could be not enough timing. A non ported eaton running 15 pounds with 26 degrees of timing on e85 just put down some mid 550.

Head over to the distillery and don't listen to anyone thats says compression is too high. Its not for e85 not even close.

I stand corrected.... On High Compression and E85... Still.... You are maxing that P1-SC.

And... be-careful running too much timing....

I still am not convinced that its only a timing issue.. that's just MHO....

 

[Chances50]

I have a Procharger myself and run a couple different tunes for a couple different fuel combinations. My car is complicated...

Your compression is way to high for supercharging.(issue #1)

Once again your issue is your block being 11:1! your going to BLOW that engine with more boost if you ask me.

Centri's like to be 9:2.1 to 9:5 ratio a roots you can be close to 10:1 but still thats pushing it.
I'd say your at the max.... I would take that procharger off, get $1600 for it on this site and buy yourself a 150 to 175 shot NO2 kit...
OR build a bottom end with the correct compression for supercharging.

Save some extra cash too, that P1-SC is going to hold you back even on the correct compression block.(issue #2)

Good Luck
any questions PM me :bash:

:lol::bash:Quite possibly the worst advice i have ever seen..

For starters Centris and high compression are WAY safer than roots and high compression.

I have 10.2 compression and on 9lbs made 536whp and 444rwtq on e85 and 22* timing, i have a buddy that just built a motor with 10.7 compression has a ported eaton on 19lbs and e85 and made 580rwhp 618rwtq with 23* of timing.

OP You may be over spinning the blower there is a way to calulate that on prochargers site. your car should be a tough SOB with that compression and boost on corn. Boost is a measurment of restriction so dont worry so much about the boost as much as the impeller/bearing speeds.

Also take your plug gap back to where you had it and test it again.

 

[97crystalwhite]

sounds good. and trust me i have done the research on the high compression and its becoming more and more. i have a abundent amount of e85 around me so thats what i run. e85 will cool a combustion chamber almost 20* over regular gas. im prollay just taking the short runnner off and adding more boost and play with with the spark. the guy that tunes the car is not a newb

 

[98 Saleen Cobra]

WTF you had the spark closed to .018??!! Holy shit that's tight as hell!! Why so tight? I'd say .028 MAX..

 

[My2003Mach1]

:lol::bash:Quite possibly the worst advice i have ever seen..

For starters Centris and high compression are WAY safer than roots and high compression.

I have 10.2 compression and on 9lbs made 536whp and 444rwtq on e85 and 22* timing, i have a buddy that just built a motor with 10.7 compression has a ported eaton on 19lbs and e85 and made 580rwhp 618rwtq with 23* of timing.

OP You may be over spinning the blower there is a way to calulate that on prochargers site. your car should be a tough SOB with that compression and boost on corn. Boost is a measurment of restriction so dont worry so much about the boost as much as the impeller/bearing speeds.

Also take your plug gap back to where you had it and test it again.

I guess your right I don't know a fuc..king thing about mustangs My set up backs that up
How about you go get yourself some real horsepower and torque then come talk shit

With those numbers you couldn't break a interior light in your car

500+ hp? That's near factory # still !!
9# boost?! Lol
Your joking right!? You don't even need head gaskets with that amount of boost

Son do me a favor go get me my slippers and the paper then change the oil on a real mustang. While your there take a look at what a real build looks like. When your done come back and sit down and lets have a talk about real power that you have to watch timing, fuel, air flow, compression ratios and senierios

Bragging at 500 kitty cats of power you should be ashamed

Until your responce mr machanic

Ps what do you run in that thing? Juicy juice?

 

[BADD281]

I guess your right I don't know a fuc..king thing about mustangs My set up backs that up
How about you go get yourself some real horsepower and torque then come talk shit

With those numbers you couldn't break a interior light in your car

500+ hp? That's near factory # still !!
9# boost?! Lol
Your joking right!? You don't even need head gaskets with that amount of boost

Son do me a favor go get me my slippers and the paper then change the oil on a real mustang. While your there take a look at what a real build looks like. When your done come back and sit down and lets have a talk about real power that you have to watch timing, fuel, air flow, compression ratios and senierios

Bragging at 500 kitty cats of power you should be ashamed

Until your responce mr machanic

Ps what do you run in that thing? Juicy juice?

"Kitty Cats"

 

[djsKS93]

op:

 

[My2003Mach1]

op:

:lol: op:

Too funny I re-read what I wrote.. Still laughing... All in good fun.
Even funnier when people take it seriously ...

Hell I even said "I stand corrected" you'd think he would have read that part and left it alone... So I had to give the guy a little shit for beating on the dead horse.

 

[Chances50]

:lol: op:

Too funny I re-read what I wrote.. Still laughing... All in good fun.
Even funnier when people take it seriously ...

Hell I even said "I stand corrected" you'd think he would have read that part and left it alone... So I had to give the guy a little shit for beating on the dead horse.

LMAO! I didn't read past your comment guess that's my fault, but none the less just because you made 750hp with a f1 on 22lbs doesn't give ANY credit to your knowledge and anyone with a big enough checkbook can drop off a car and have a 750hp car.... The fact that your car makes big numbers means nothing.

Sadly your reply to the question at hand is far more hilarious than you trying to look down your nose at my setup. Shows who the "real man" is in here.

 

[My2003Mach1]

LMAO! I didn't read past your comment guess that's my fault, but none the less just because you made 750hp with a f1 on 22lbs doesn't give ANY credit to your knowledge and anyone with a big enough checkbook can drop off a car and have a 750hp car.... The fact that your car makes big numbers means nothing.

Sadly your reply to the question at hand is far more hilarious than you trying to look down your nose at my setup. Shows who the "real man" is in here.

Interesting enough That if you knew any better, you'd see I built my car my self. And if searching around some threads I'm not one to talk shit unless I can back it up.
But you missed the point
I got yours It's crystal clear you do not read before running your big mouth your very typical forms guy.
Talk shit Talk some more shit never acknowledging your stupidity.

A simple " I stand corrected" I was wrong should have been good enough... Try it sometime instead of trying to look cool online next time...

In the end you win because your cooler than me... Lol

 

[AluminatorSnake]

I have a Procharger myself and run a couple different tunes for a couple different fuel combinations. My car is complicated...

Your compression is way to high for supercharging.(issue #1)
Your making good power for having a P1-SC.../ Good boost. However when you over spin the procharger this will happen... you will begin to get belt slip, power loss and ruin the supercharger while over spinning it.

Regardless of what procharger or anyone tells you about that P1-Sc or even an F1-A, the head unit can only produce HP levels its parts can hold. Unless you upgraded your supercharger bearings (internally) to ceramic or something as such along with better seals it will never reach the HP levels advertised.
IE: I have an F1-A.. barely 2 years old, aprox 1000 miles, never hit more than 22lbs of boost, its adult driven, with only about 15 dyno pulls. My Mach 1 sits in the garage 90% of the time. I have a seal that needs replacing. :nono: obviously this shouldn't happen, I mean this F1-A supercharger is rated up to 38lbs boost right? I can't see it holding that kind of power, unless I upgraded my internals. (which I'm currently doing)

I'm going to be completely honest here and tell you all the upgraded wiring and special coils is just a waste of money at your power level.

I'm currently safe tuned, however my set up will produce well over 850 RWHP and im still using stock COP, Wiring etc

Once again your issue is your block being 11:1! your going to BLOW that engine with more boost if you ask me.

Centri's like to be 9:2.1 to 9:5 ratio a roots you can be close to 10:1 but still thats pushing it.

I'd say your at the max.... I would take that procharger off, get $1600 for it on this site and buy yourself a 150 to 175 shot NO2 kit...
OR build a bottom end with the correct compression for supercharging.

Save some extra cash too, that P1-SC is going to hold you back even on the correct compression block.(issue #2)

Good Luck
any questions PM me :bash:

:bored: Lots of bad info in there. I dont know what pulley size you have on there to make 11# but you should calculate your impellar speed vs how much boost. A 3.0 inch pulley is about as small as you can use if you have a stock crank pulley and only go to 6800 rpm... after than you lose efficiency and make heat.
Go here to calculate your info to see if you have room to grow.
.Welcome to Force Fed Performance.

Example:
Crank pulley: 6.625
Blower pulley: 3.0
Supercharger drive ratio: 4.10
Engine RPM: 6800

Total Impeller speed: 61568
Max P1sc impellar speed: 62000

The only good solid info that is in the quote above is that the P1 will hold you back. You can see around 550 with all the bells and whistles but thats usually where the train stops and you have to upgrade your head unit.

 

[98 Saleen Cobra]

All you guys quoting the My2003Mach1 guy are beating a dead horse.. He already said he was mistaken.. So lets move on on how to help this guy huh?

To the OP gap the plugs at .028 and see what happens. You can up the boost but like others have said find out the impeller speed. Also get your fuel system together like you mentioned.

 

[AluminatorSnake]

All you guys quoting the My2003Mach1 guy are beating a dead horse.. He already said he was mistaken.. So lets move on on how to help this guy huh?

To the OP gap the plugs at .028 and see what happens. You can up the boost but like others have said find out the impeller speed. Also get your fuel system together like you mentioned.

Well i did show him a place to calculate impellar speed to find where he will max his p1. And im with 98 run .028, thats what my car is set at. Im not on e85 either. I figured you would have been able to run a bit wider gap on the corn but idk. I do know anything lower than .028 i had drivability issues.

But whatever you do, before you put that 14# pulley on check to see if that will overspin your blower.

 

[Chances50]

Interesting enough That if you knew any better, you'd see I built my car my self. And if searching around some threads I'm not one to talk shit unless I can back it up.
But you missed the point
I got yours It's crystal clear you do not read before running your big mouth your very typical forms guy.
Talk shit Talk some more shit never acknowledging your stupidity.

A simple " I stand corrected" I was wrong should have been good enough... Try it sometime instead of trying to look cool online next time...

In the end you win because your cooler than me... Lol

The irony of you calling me a typical forum guy is priceless. I never said a bad thing about you or your car, I even stated I didn't see you admit your ignorance.

 

[corysmach1]

11:1 with boost and E85 is fine. Regap the plugs take it back to dyno and leave the SRI on!

 

[02blownGT]

Dont want to be part of the debate but i have personally seen a p1 spun to 19psi on an 03 cobra.Why an 03 cobra would bolt on a p1 i cant say but it did happen.So dont worry about that talk of overspinning it. Your not.