On the subject of helmets..

[TroyV]

The very first SA (2000) rated helmet I ever bought was the G-Force Hybrid. G-Force Modified SA2010 Helmet - SafeRacer At the time I was doing lots and lots of AX events, and doing maybe a couple or three track events a year. The things I liked about it was there was plenty of space in the mouth/chin area to mount the chatterbox microphone, and that the visor has a tinted edge for those moments when you are driving with the sun in front of you and need that extra dimming for a moment.

My current helmet (SA2005) is the HJC AR10. HJC Motorsports AR10 II SA2010 Auto Racing Helmet - SafeRacer

At the time I got the HJC first because I thought I needed a plexi-visor, and secondly because I knew the SA2000 helmets would phase out within the next year.

Even though the SA2005 cert will be good for another few years (typically about 5 years after the next cert drops), I'm finding myself wanting another helmet for a few reasons. No matter what I do, and no matter what the weather, The plexi visor on the AR10 fogs instantly when I close it. I have tried all manner of anti fog solutions, and even tried rain-x, to no avail. I never use the visor as a result and just keep it flipped open. Also, being that I have no sun visors in the race car, I'd like a helmet that has a physical visor like the G-Force, but I don't see a lot of alternatives to it.

The question I would pose is:

In your opinion, does the hybrid truly qualify as a closed face helmet if it has no plexi-visor? ....and if it does qualify as one, then why don't the other manufacturers have a version of this design available? Is there a safety concern I'm not seeing?

 

[TXPD]

troy, i assume your visor is fogging from the inside. if you can find a photo of jeff gordon with his helmet on and his visor up, you will see that he has a breath deflector that keeps the air from his nose and mouth from getting to his visor.

i have a bell helmet and the breath deflector is an inexpensive add on($19.95). i would imagine that its available with the other mfc's as well.

the reason you dont see most helmet companies with that hybrid is the safety concerns. i used to wear sunglasses and leave my visor up. i got hit in the cheek near my eye with track debris under caution. had it been under green it would have been bad. had it been in the eye, it would have been worse.

my mentor at the time sold me hard that i should never race with my visor up and i dont anymore. thats why.

edit: its also worth mentioning that forced air helmets are becoming more affordable to the average driver and you must keep your visor down with forced air.

 

[David Hester]

Rob makes a good point. I had a G-force hybrid for years. I used Scott goggles when I 1st got it, but have gone to a G-Force full face with HANS for next year. I, too, have been hit in the face with tire boogers and rocks.
Note G-Force full face come with breath deflectors. I think I have 2 or 3 laying around.

 

[gcassidy]

Mouth breather.

Troy, I used to have trouble racing bikes because we had to keep the visors down all the time. But anti-fog wiped on it usually worked. With my Bell I often keep the visor at the lowest detent (they can be adjusted), so I have enough of a gap that it doesn't fog, but provides almost complete face protection.
But I wonder if I have less of an issue in a vert as I get a bit more air turbulence around me I suspect. Take your top off and see if it still fogs as bad.

 

[Sirl]

Just got my G Force Hybrid, haven't used it yet, but, it came with a breathe deflector, for what ever reason.

 

[TroyV]

My window net keeps just about everything from coming in the cabin. I've never been struck by debris of any kind. that's not to say that It'd never happen.

I asked this question to a few other people, and the one reply I got back from a local SCCA racer was that helmets, even SA rated that have no plexi-visor are not allowed to pass tech at an SCCA race. He has seen folks failed that had removed their visors for whatever reason. He had not noticed that someone specifically sporting the hybrid was failed, but I can certainly believe that they could/would based on that information. I don't run with SCCA, and I'm free to run whatever SA rated helmet I wish, but if I decide to move to some form of racing, I would need to follow those rules.

I still think the hybrid is a good helmet, especially if you wear big glasses, like I do.

 

[gcassidy]

Can that huge visor fit in that tiny car? oke:

Troy, just in case you consider NASA, this is from their 2011 CCR:

15.17.3 Helmet
All drivers are required to wear an approved a properly fitted and secured helmet while on track. Helmets must be approved by Snell and carry a sticker of Snell 2000(SA2000) or better newer*. Ratings other than that of “SA” (Special Application), i.e. “M1995, M2000”, are not acceptable. *Alternatively, helmets with an FIA certification of 8860-2004 or newer, or an SFI label showing the rating of 31.1A, 31.2A, or 31.1/2005 or newer are acceptable. It is strongly recommended that any helmet sustaining any substantial impact be replaced.
Note- the minimum helmet standard starting January 1, 2012 will be: All drivers are required to wear a properly fitted and secured helmet while on track. Helmets must be approved by Snell and carry a sticker of Snell SA2005 or newer*. Ratings other than that of “SA” (Special Application), i.e. “M2000, M2005, or CMR2007”, are not acceptable. *Alternatively, helmets with an FIA certification of 8860-2004 or newer, or an SFI label showing the rating of 31.1/2005 or newer are acceptable. It is strongly recommended that any helmet sustaining any substantial impact be replaced.

15.17.5 Eye and Face protection
A full-face helmet with an impact resistant face shield is required in “open” cars (FFR, sports racers, and formula cars) and highly recommended for all vehicles. Eye protection is required. Face shields, safety glasses, or goggles all made of impact resistant material are permitted as “eye protection.” However, the choice of eye protection used, and the responsibility for any failure, belongs to the driver. Drivers with beards or long hair must also wear a face cover (balaclava) made of approved fire
68 resistant materials. A full helmet skirt made of Nomex or other fire resistant material
shall also satisfy this rule.

 

[TXPD]

My window net keeps just about everything from coming in the cabin. I've never been struck by debris of any kind. that's not to say that It'd never happen..

i would have said the same thing about my window net. i'll just suggest to you that i watched a lot of racing from grand am to the nascar series and you dont see those drivers racing with their visors in the up position unless its under caution.

there are reasons for that and i can only suggest that you take that into account. all i can tell you is that i used to feel the way you do and after the on incident and a serious talking to from my mentor when i got out of the car, i put my visor down. by the next time i went to the track i was so comfortable that way that i wondered why i was against it before.

its safer.

 

[David Hester]

I've vacuumed a handful of tire boogers and gravel out of my last 3 cars after every weekend.
BTW SA2005 and SA 2010 open face helmets, hybrids are and continue to be legal in SCCA closed cars. I have used both the past 15 years, with and without goggles. I do use a balaclava.

 

[TroyV]

I was at local shop that sells HJC, Zeronine, and Stilo helmets over the weekend. The guy there also has the AR10 and had the fogging problem. He told me the only thing that worked for him was the anti fog stuff that paint ballers use for their tactical helmets/face masks. Apparently there is some heavy duty additive that makes it easier to get the paint off of the mask in addition to its anti fog capability.

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Extreme-Rage-Paintball-Anti-Fog-Cleaner/dp/B0009NEOZU"]Amazon.com: Extreme Rage Paintball Anti-Fog 2-oz Lens Cleaner: Sports & Outdoors[/ame]

I'll let you know how it works after I receive it.

...and btw...the Stilo helmets they have are frickin incredible.

 

[99COBRA2881]

For what a Stilo hat costs it should be "frickin incredible!!"

haha

 

[David Hester]

Yeah, you can a decent helemt and a couple of tires for what they cost.
I like my head AND MY SMILE, but.....Jeepers!

 

[TXPD]

B.e.l.l.

 

[TroyV]

I could never buy a Stilo.

As good as they appear to be, there is a supreme douche factor to overcome....considering that their midrange CF helmet is literally worth more than my car.

 

[99COBRA2881]

Haha, so true!!! I have enough of a self perceived douche factor with all my Simpson stuff, but I got $100 off the new helmet I have to have for '12 when I bought a Hybrid rage from them on top of the 10% SCCA member discount. Gotta take what you can get in this hobby.

Better than the snafu that Impact went through recently with their phony stickers. I will never buy anything from that company. Ever.

 

[TXPD]

where i come from you need that euro puma or alpinestars stuff before you end up in the douche catagory. i do have an omp firesuit but the bell helmet and the sparco gloves even it out. the piloti shoes are too cool to matter where they come from

 

[David Hester]

LOL You fashion ho, you. ;-)


I wore Al Peen star boots when I ran enduros years ago. Best boot you could buy back then.

Yeah, I've seen how you NC folks dress. ;^)

 

[TroyV]

I have a hard enough time beating back the douche factor with my suit. It is an nascar Sparco suit originally worn by Joey Fellores. It fits great and I got a good deal on it.....but it is laden with sponsors.. The main sponsor: Great Clips... LOL I was trying to find one that had a cigarette company on there....I don't smoke, but a Marlboro suit looks cool.

 

[gcassidy]

LOL You fashion ho, you. ;-)


I wore Al Peen star boots when I ran enduros years ago. Best boot you could buy back then.

Yeah, I've seen how you NC folks dress. ;^)

Alpine Stars were quite the rage among the classier set at the bike races.
I had pretty much the cheapest boots that covered my ankle.

And when I started needing something other than my size 11 New Balances for in the car, I found some sweet inexpensive wrestling shoes that were just like Piloti's without the fire rating. I deemed them "worn out" when Piloti had a really good sale.

 

[David Hester]

Back then, there weren't a lot of choices for off road boots. Alpine Stars weren't real expensive, but lasted forever. I still have the pair I bought in '77 and could still wear them with a little shoe polish.... maybe. I move them around in the storage building every couple of years looking for other stuff. Scott had a plastic boot for awhile, but they held water and didn't last. High zoot for the motoX crowd, but not practical for woodsy folk.