Motor trend-Viper vs GT vs Z06

[Formula51]

Nurburgring times are as follows:

7:28 Porsche Carrera GT
7:32 Pagani Zonda F
7:34 Koeniggsegg CCR
7:40 Veyron
7:40 Benz SLR McLaren

Where did you get your times from? I know for a fact the Pagan Zonda F and the Koeniggsegg CCR you have listed there are not production stock. I am not sure about the Veyron and the SLR was originally tested at 7:50 and that is why the Z06 was called the 2ND FASTEST production car ever to run the ring. The SLR has since been retested and ran the 7:40.

I can't remember what it is about the 7:28 Carrera run, but I believe that car was not stock either and I think the 7:32 run is considered the best stock Carrera run.

You have to be very careful where you get ring times because they dont always tell you who had race tires, engine mods, suspension mods, etc.

 

[elitewolverine]

You cant go by that..
You have to go by how the cars compare to eachother, when they are runing against eachother, on the same track, at the same time, with the same drivers..

They are usually within a tenth of eachother in the tests that I have seen. M/T for instance (I have the article in front of me) the ZO6 was a tenth slower 1/4 mile.

That is a difference that is hardly worth noteing.. The cars are very equal.

no worth noting is the fact that the GT traps at a higher speed, meaning only one thing, if both cars exit at same speed in a turn the GT will outrun the Z by the next turn....that simple.

Also the GT shines after 90mph because of the long first two gears, and of course keeping it hooked up.

But also, you can use two different tests, because if two different tests use pro drivers its very valid, and its not like 11.2 for the Ford GT was not done at a drag strip on a cold morning, it was done at AFPG, which usually hits 100+ degrees...something which is horrid HP as everybody knows...

im not saying the z06 is not a good car, hell it has surprised me, but on any given day i would expect the GT to outrun the z06. Not kill it but win, i dont care if it wins by .1sec or 2secs, winning is winning.

 

[elitewolverine]

Where did you get your times from? I know for a fact the Pagan Zonda F and the Koeniggsegg CCR you have listed there are not production stock. I am not sure about the Veyron and the SLR was originally tested at 7:50 and that is why the Z06 was called the 2ND FASTEST production car ever to run the ring. The SLR has since been retested and ran the 7:40.

I can't remember what it is about the 7:28 Carrera run, but I believe that car was not stock either and I think the 7:32 run is considered the best stock Carrera run.

You have to be very careful where you get ring times because they dont always tell you who had race tires, engine mods, suspension mods, etc.

all these are from mags, and no the z06 is not hte second fastest, even the Ford GT did the ring in 7:42 under octane magazine. Maybe second fastest for that mag but definately not the fastest....at any rate come in a month or two the GT is being retested at the ring by another mag

7:28 --- 166.652 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, Walther Roehrl,(Autobild 07/04)
7:32* -- 164.071 km/h – Pagani Zonda F, 650 PS/ 1230 kg, (*mfr.) www.autodrome-cannes.com/index-eng.asp
7:34 --- 163.586 km/h – Koenigsegg CCR, 806 PS/1180 kg, Horst von Saurma (sport auto), oct,17-18 05
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h – Bugatti 16/4 Veyron, 1001 PS/1980 kg (Wheels magazine Australia, 12/05)
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h -- Mercedes Benz SLR McLaren, Klaus Ludwig (AutoBild 07/04)
7:42* -- 160.519 km/h – Ford GT, 550 PS/ 1521 kg (*as indicated by Octane magazine, 11/05)
7:42 --- 160.519 km/h -- Mosler MT900S Photon, Joao Barbosa, (04) (according to dailysportscar.net)
7:42 --- 160.519 km/h -- Radical 1500 SR3, 230 PS/510 kg (02)
7:42.9 - 160.207 km/h -- Corvette Z06, 500 PS/1319 kg, Jan Magnusen, (Sporbilen, jun,26 05)

yes the Ford GT was .9seconds faster....like we have all said, although close, it is still faster.

and with another retest for the GT times are expected to go lower. At any rate the z06 was a test mule and like you have stated there is no indication as to what was done or missing in that z06, hell a non-airconditioned test mule could have run that track giving it a effective 15hp upgrade kinda of thing....remember fords GT test mule hitting 3.3 0-60? A full production model has yet to hit that again, closest being 3.4 and the average is 3.6

also compare that the z06 at the ring was done none other by their own c5r lemans winning driver dont expect much quicker if at all quicker by another driver at the ring with a full blown production vehicle. The GT on the other hand didnt have such high honours at its wheels for its 7:42 run to my knowledge

 

[elitewolverine]

Thank you. Just to clarify, the fastest time for the Z06 so far is 11.5 and the little wonder boy, Evan Smith, has not put his hands on one yet. It WILL run faster than 11.5 with Evan Smith driving. So again, even the fastest times of each will end up very close.

Hey BmoseleyINC, since you and I are both being good sports. Do you remember that time when you told me the Ford GT against the Z06 on a road course would be a "bloodbath" and I told you that you were full of you know what? The Z06 certainly proved you wrong, but did it earn your respect? I am just curious.

a bloodbath could be as close as .5secs, depending on the speed at the line length of track etc...

but there have been tracks where the Ford GT has outdone the z06 by 2seconds, so yes a bloodbath can happen and on some courses will happen. Other, imo tighter courses, the z06 has the better chance at staying even or close.

 

[50 BMG]

7:42* -- 160.519 km/h – Ford GT, 550 PS/ 1521 kg (*as indicated by Octane magazine, 11/05)

Thats news to me, never even heard of that result...not that I care about keeping up with flavor of the month magazine results;-)

Have a link to/scan of the article?

 

[elitewolverine]

Thats news to me, never even heard of that result...not that I care about keeping up with flavor of the month magazine results;-)

Have a link to/scan of the article?

unfortunately i dont, ive been trying to find a pdf article, but so far nothing, i probably know where to ask for the scanned ones...

although i have found another track test done by automobile of the Viper C6Z06, and GT...

1:33.95 Viper
1:32.75 Z06
1:32.45 GT

and this was a tight course, where i expected the z06 to outshine the GT, and the Driver had a hard time putting the fords power to the ground threw a few of the turns, hell during the exit of a turn he let off the throttle considerably, probalby costing him a good .3secs in the long run...top speeds for each i think were 110-113mph on the track, GT i think had the higher trap before braking

 

[elitewolverine]

but on a nice side note, or funny note...

during a recent test of the 430 vs GT, around hockenheim, the 430 won, but by default, heres the default, and the funny part imo..

a C6 corvetter not z06 i know but still funny, ran the Hockenheim short course in 1:14.8 lap time...not bad considering the faster 430 did it in 1:12.7. thats only 2.1seconds, not a bloodbath but a clear dominating win over a normal vette...ready for the funny part?

on that same test the Ford GT broke the gearbox and only ran the track in first gear, which i remind you is 61mph...the GT broke a time of 1:14.1 on the track with only first gear...

but at any rate i sat in a c6 this morning and if i could sell my family car for one, i would have done it right there, to bad i need four seats

 

[Captain Beyond]

Thanks elitewolverine for the info. :beer:

 

[50 BMG]

on that same test the Ford GT broke the gearbox and only ran the track in first gear, which i remind you is 61mph...the GT broke a time of 1:14.1 on the track with only first gear...

lmfao, if that's true...wow

 

[Purvis]

no worth noting is the fact that the GT traps at a higher speed, meaning only one thing, if both cars exit at same speed in a turn the GT will outrun the Z by the next turn....that simple.

Also the GT shines after 90mph because of the long first two gears, and of course keeping it hooked up.

But also, you can use two different tests, because if two different tests use pro drivers its very valid, and its not like 11.2 for the Ford GT was not done at a drag strip on a cold morning, it was done at AFPG, which usually hits 100+ degrees...something which is horrid HP as everybody knows...

im not saying the z06 is not a good car, hell it has surprised me, but on any given day i would expect the GT to outrun the z06. Not kill it but win, i dont care if it wins by .1sec or 2secs, winning is winning.

When the cars have been compared head to head, they are consecutively Extremely close in performance.. So close that the deciding factor would easily come down to the "driver factor".

Takeing best times from different tests proves little. Compare the cars head to head, in the same weather, track and with the same drivers.. Motortrend did exactly that, and the ZO6 was only a tenth slower through the 1/4 than the GT, and actually was faster than the GT around the road course.

 

[Purvis]

The ZO6 was the second fastest production car around the ring according to Motortrend....

Check the september issue of "Motor Trend" where they say the new z06 corvette did a 7:42:99 lap time on treaded tires. They rented the track all by themselves for an hour.They did four laps in the hour they had and the best time was set on the last one. They also gave a list of other fastest production times to put things in perspective:

Porsche Carrera GT 7:32
Chevrolet Corvette Z06 7:42
Porsche 996 GT2 7:42
Pagani Zonda S 7:44
Lamborghini Murcielago 7:50
Lamborghini Gallardo 7:52
Mercedes-McLaren SLR 7:52
Chevrolet Corvete C6 7:59
Porsche 911 8:07
Dodge Viper GTS 8:10

The only production car thats gone faster according to the magazine is the carrera gt.

Here is the news article when it set the record:
http://www.domesticdisturbance.us/article_zo6nbr.htm

REad these articles..
Here the ZO6 runs a 7:40
http://www.racingsouthwest.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t17608.html

Here is another list that has the ?New ZO6 on top of just about everything else...
"Note that some of the cars in this list are modified and ran race tires. The C6ZO6 did not. This thing is faster around the track than anything Lamborghini or BMW makes, STOCK. It also outran every STOCK 996 based Porsche (996 Turbo, GT2, GT3, etc), the Mosler Photon, and the approximate time of the McLaren F1."
http://www.racingsouthwest.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t17608.html

Here is another thread devoted to the GT vs the ZO6 around the ring
http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/printthread.php?t=199110


And if Im not mistaken, the ZO6's fastest unofficial time was 7:40, which is faster than the GT unoffical time of 7:42.

 

[Force4.6]

Heck when did the GT run the ring? And damn I'm kinda shocked it was faster than the 7:42 posted by the Z. Got any proof to back that up?

 

[Purvis]

Heck when did the GT run the ring? And damn I'm kinda shocked it was faster than the 7:42 posted by the Z. Got any proof to back that up?

I wanst able to find anything on the GT running the ring, other than what has been stated in this thread by 1 or 2 people.. But I didnt see any proof offered.. Just hearsay.
AS it stand right now, the ZO6 is the second fastest production car around the ring.

 

[roushraven]

There's no proof because it didn't happen.

-RR

 

[DBK]

There's no proof because it didn't happen.

-RR

It has been around the ring, just never timed on a clean lap.

 

[BmoseleyINC]

Thank you. Just to clarify, the fastest time for the Z06 so far is 11.5 and the little wonder boy, Evan Smith, has not put his hands on one yet. It WILL run faster than 11.5 with Evan Smith driving. So again, even the fastest times of each will end up very close.

Hey BmoseleyINC, since you and I are both being good sports. Do you remember that time when you told me the Ford GT against the Z06 on a road course would be a "bloodbath" and I told you that you were full of you know what? The Z06 certainly proved you wrong, but did it earn your respect? I am just curious.

When those threads were going on, NOBODY knew what the Z06 was really gonna have as far as HP/weight, ANYTHING.

Does it impress me? Sure, it was always going to, I love fast cars. The GT is still faster, maybe not the amount faster than EVERYONE was expecting, but it still lays the smackdown.

It was over 2 seconds quicker at willowsprings last time I was there, and The GT driver had to pussy foot it around because he couldn't lay all the power down. This track is a 1:30-1:40 track. 2 seconds on a minute and a half track is 10 car lenghts. I talked to both owners.

Gt was bone stock, Z06 had a "fuse" mod, and some sort of intake.

 

[elitewolverine]

Heck when did the GT run the ring? And damn I'm kinda shocked it was faster than the 7:42 posted by the Z. Got any proof to back that up?

did the source is octane magazine, any more proof? Why shocked? Faster in a straight, more top end power, more top end speed, faster getting there, faster in almost all turns, runs a very fast slalom, able to top 200mph at lemans straight (current one), and 211 in nardo italy....the Z is very fast as well, but in every road test but one the GT has lost to the Z, and it was what? .1-.3secs, compared to the GT being able to rock the Z from .5-2full secs? yet your shocked?!?!?!

and no it wasnt 7:42 for the Z, its official, non-production time, is 7:42.99...

 

[elitewolverine]

I wanst able to find anything on the GT running the ring, other than what has been stated in this thread by 1 or 2 people.. But I didnt see any proof offered.. Just hearsay.
AS it stand right now, the ZO6 is the second fastest production car around the ring.

Already proved you wrong about second fastest production car! Need more proof! Carrera GT Zonda buggati slr mclaren...the z is fast, but its not anywhere near the second fastest, and in anyone elses hands besides lemans winner of the corvette team driver at its helms and see that time plumit to a safe 7:50, a 6 full seconds ahead of the c5 z06

each one of those times has the driver and magazine posted, the only one that doesnt is the GT because Octane magazine didnt provide it.

its october issue of the Ford GT, during a 3000mile test, starts on page 90 and goes on for 6 more pages...

the Ford GT also from what ive heard wasnt pushed to its limits, it was a no-name driver, and the test was more for longjevity reasons that to test it balls out at the ring...

making 550rwhp the GT is one tuff machine on tight tracks, "rumors"have said that 7:35 is possible in a GT, considering it wasnt that much slower than a Carrera GT in acceleration, in fact from 180-202mph the GT matched the Carrera GT in acceleration, thats matched it folks, thats the same car that runs the ring in 7:28

 

[Purvis]

Already proved you wrong about second fastest production car! Need more proof! Carrera GT Zonda buggati slr mclaren...the z is fast, but its not anywhere near the second fastest, and in anyone elses hands besides lemans winner of the corvette team driver at its helms and see that time plumit to a safe 7:50, a 6 full seconds ahead of the c5 z06

each one of those times has the driver and magazine posted, the only one that doesnt is the GT because Octane magazine didnt provide it.

its october issue of the Ford GT, during a 3000mile test, starts on page 90 and goes on for 6 more pages...

the Ford GT also from what ive heard wasnt pushed to its limits, it was a no-name driver, and the test was more for longjevity reasons that to test it balls out at the ring...

making 550rwhp the GT is one tuff machine on tight tracks, "rumors"have said that 7:35 is possible in a GT, considering it wasnt that much slower than a Carrera GT in acceleration, in fact from 180-202mph the GT matched the Carrera GT in acceleration, thats matched it folks, thats the same car that runs the ring in 7:28

You still havent answered the question of when/who tested the Ford GT for an official lap around the ring..
There are tons of unofficial lap times out there.. What matters are the offically posted times.. And so far the ZO6 is #2 for offically posted times for a production car according to Motortrend and several other trustworthy sources... :read:

If you have an OFFICAL source (such as motortrend), please link it so we can all see it.

 

[Force4.6]

When I say shocked I mean in a good way. I was hoping the GT would run the ring and put down a good time. But I didn't think anybody would actually do it. And with all the ZO6 guys talking about how the GT would never come close and then it runs .9 faster, I think its great if its true. I always thought if a real experienced driver got a hold of the GT they would show what it was really capable of.