More mach 1 cooling woezzzz

[kissmyAZZure]

Hey all I'm reaching out to get as many minds on this as I can. I'm wrapping up a custom turbo build and the cooling system is giving me issues.

A little history: I had a procharger D1 back in like 06 and the stock motor threw a rod. After rebuild I had a large air pocket and overheated enough to warp the heads. Had the heads resurfaced and ran thicker gaskets to keep compression the same. After that I had issues with the stock fan working intermittently so I replaced that wroth another factory unit. Once that was done I didn't have any cooling issues and in fact the car ran cool (around 180 with a gutted t stat).

Fast forward to now--- the procharger is long gone and a custom built turbo kit is in its place. I've also added the head cooling mod in the meantime. So while I'm coming to completion I can't seem to keep the car cool. I grabbed a mishimoto slim fan with shroud due to space constraints and the car would sit around 194 at idle. With any driving the temp climbs fairly rapidly and if it's under 40 mph the temp will climb to 220 before i pull over and turn on the heat. After some research I found that the fan was rated at a mere 1500 cfm, so I replaced it with a 16"slim fan that I had purchased years ago. I can't find specs on it but it seems 16" fans range from 1700-2200cfm. Today I modified the shroud and re burped the cooling system. There doesn't seem to be any improvement. I performed a compression and leakdown treat a few months back before the car was road worthy and everything was in order.

I contacted mishimoto (which is painful due to their email response system) and they suggested running two of their 11" h/o slim fans to bring the total air movement over 3000cfm. I've researched other 16" fan options and they seem to only support 2200 cfm. I'm already out a pretty penny so before dumping more I'd like to confirm this is the issue.

-I am running the stock rad tucked under the support.
-I have the MM crossover delete with filler cap
-head cooling mod routed into turbo with outlet of turbo into nipple on driver side top of rad
- t stat is gutted and housing is modified to only run inlet and outlet
- currently have 16"slim fan attached to aluminum shroud.

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[kissmyAZZure]

Head cooling



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[kissmyAZZure]

After some research.. is anyone running a crossover delete without an expansion tank? I really only have an overflow so maybe that's my issue?

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[kissmyAZZure]

Update: I received two 11" high output fans from mishimoto and installed them today. I re-bled the coolant and the fans actually cycled bringing the coolant temp below 185. (They turn on at 190).

Feeling much better I decided to go for a drive. The fans once again kicked on at 190 and the temperature stayed much more steady. However it consistently rose (driving under 35mph) and I pulled back into the driveway. The fans were running and held temp around 210 but wouldn't drop it.

I grabbed the rad hoses and the top one was definitely 210 but the lower hose was significantly cooler. I was able to grab hold and not have any discomfort.
Thoughts?

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[Packerfan88]

I'm having the same issue cruise temp is fine but idle is 210 won't go lower or higher

 

[static74]

I have a few suggestions. First thing I noticed about your setup is your downpipe is completely free to heat soak everything around it, including your coolant hoses and radiator. You really need to wrap that thing with header wrap. I cant see any other parts of the hotside, but I assume its in similar condition. This is a MAJOR source of heat.

Second, you gutted your thermostat. The purpose of a thermostat is for water to stay in the radiator to exchange heat, and then cycle the hot water out of the engine and cool water in. What you've done is prevented the water from staying in the radiator long enough to cool. I recommend you replace the unit with a 160* at the very least.

Lastly, its been a long standing fact that nothing moves more air than the big ass stock fan. Many of us turbo guys trim, cut, move, and shuffle things around to accommodate it for that particular reason. This probably wont help you at this point, but its a thought.

 

[Mach828]

^^ I was thinking the same thing. Wrap that down pipe!

 

[kissmyAZZure]

I have a few suggestions. First thing I noticed about your setup is your downpipe is completely free to heat soak everything around it, including your coolant hoses and radiator. You really need to wrap that thing with header wrap. I cant see any other parts of the hotside, but I assume its in similar condition. This is a MAJOR source of heat.

Second, you gutted your thermostat. The purpose of a thermostat is for water to stay in the radiator to exchange heat, and then cycle the hot water out of the engine and cool water in. What you've done is prevented the water from staying in the radiator long enough to cool. I recommend you replace the unit with a 160* at the very least.

Lastly, its been a long standing fact that nothing moves more air than the big ass stock fan. Many of us turbo guys trim, cut, move, and shuffle things around to accommodate it for that particular reason. This probably wont help you at this point, but its a thought.

I appreciate the input as I need someone to bounce thoughts around with. I plan on protecting everything from heat but I'm not sure that's my entire issue at this moment. I'm not getting into boost so egt's are very low. Also many Mitsubishi evos have the turbo and manifold inches from the rad and upper hose without issues

As far as the thermostat, I've run the car with the gutted stat before and did not have cooling issues. I'm probably going to put one in but again I'm not thinking this is the issue.

The fans I now have installed pull over 3200cfm which is more than the factory fan on high... I'm losing hair over this lol

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[static74]

I appreciate the input as I need someone to bounce thoughts around with. I plan on protecting everything from heat but I'm not sure that's my entire issue at this moment. I'm not getting into boost so egt's are very low. Also many Mitsubishi evos have the turbo and manifold inches from the rad and upper hose without issues

As far as the thermostat, I've run the car with the gutted stat before and did not have cooling issues. I'm probably going to put one in but again I'm not thinking this is the issue.

The fans I now have installed pull over 3200cfm which is more than the factory fan on high... I'm losing hair over this lol

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Sounds like you have it figured out then.

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

definitely update us on this, hope it fixes your issues. I havent had a chance to drive my car since addressing a bunch of little things but I have a feeling a change of fans is likely in order

edit: are you running 2 of their fans with their fan shroud? I see they have a kit for a little over $250 on their website. The description says 2 fans but picture shows one so just curious

 

[kissmyAZZure]

definitely update us on this, hope it fixes your issues. I havent had a chance to drive my car since addressing a bunch of little things but I have a feeling a change of fans is likely in order

edit: are you running 2 of their fans with their fan shroud? I see they have a kit for a little over $250 on their website. The description says 2 fans but picture shows one so just curious

No, I purchased the shroud from them initially. It is just 1 14" fan. I modified it to fit a 16" but still had issues. I have two 11" high output fans now without a shroud but they cover pretty much the entire rad. They are rated to 1100 cfm each. With them wired up the temp goes down instantly when bleeding the coolant. It's just when driving. I'm currently flushing the rad to make sure there's no clogs as it did sit for years. I'm really trying to get to the bottom of this. If you want to try out the shroud I'll sell it to ya cheap lol


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[DSG2003Mach1]

appreciate the offer but I think if I do anything fan wise itll either be a Mark 8 fan or some smaller dual fans that are a little over 3000cfm each

 

[kissmyAZZure]

Next update.....

My own mind has deceived me. Somewhere in the 10 years it's been down, I put a thermostat in it. So what I thought was a gutted stat, is actually a 180*. I also found that it was sticking closed in my modified housing. I remedied the issue, tested the thermostat in hot water, drilled a hole for bleeding assistance, and re burped the cooling system. I ran the car and cycled the fans multiple times waiting for the bubbles to completely stop.

I then let the car cool overnight and then topped off the level in the morning. On a short test drive, temperature seemed to stay much better. Temp was around 195-200 in this 100 degree heat.

This is where the problem Continues. I pulled in the driveway and let it idle. Temp climbed to 212 and I shut it down. I once again let it cool for a few hours before taking it on a longer drive. About two miles in, temp was already nearing 210. I returned home and temp was at almost 220 before I shut down. Upper hose was significantly warmer.


Thoughts ? At this point I'm thinking stubborn air pocket or maybe I need an expansion tank? I have an overflow and I've seen other machs setup this way without issues but I'm running short on ideas

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[DSG2003Mach1]

This is with the dual fans now, correct?

 

[kissmyAZZure]

This is with the dual fans now, correct?

Yes. And while burping they were able to cycle the temperature within about 30 seconds. I'm feeling that they have sufficient flow at this point

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