Help--arh lth install

[04Beasst]

Need some help please! I had Bassani mid-length headers & Bassani X-Pipe on my car. Wanted LTHs instead…little x-tra hp! Ordered ARHs from Lethal P, size: 1 & 3/4 with 3" collector & 3" X-pipe w/cats....real nice. Just had them installed last night and ran into a few issues. Can someone please help with the following:

1. Driver Side header is rubbing against the Cross Stabilizer???...connected to the plate under the engine. Ground clearance is good otherwise! Anyone run into this problem?

2. Top tube on the driver's side header is almost rubbing the steering column...possibly rubbing when turning. Should I heat up the pipes and bend for clearance?? I'll touch base with ARH tomorrow…

3. Does the car need to be re-tuned or do I just need to drive it? Idle is fluctuating and is cutting off sometimes...running real rough. Car’s battery was disconnect for 24 hrs, should I just reload the tune? I have a lifetime mail order tune with Amazon but I don't think the tune need to be updated…maybe 15 hp gain. Thoughts? I’ll get with Rick tomorrow.

4. If the O2 sensors are not put back in the same order/same location as original x-Pipe, does that matter?

Lastly, its just freaking loud (Stinger Catback)...didn't think it would be that loud. I can deal with that though. Appreciate any help/advice. I'm in a small town (to say the least) and one mechanic. Thanks.

 

[02reaper]

Need some help please! I had Bassani mid-length headers & Bassani X-Pipe on my car. Wanted LTHs instead…little x-tra hp! Ordered ARHs from Lethal P, size: 1 & 3/4 with 3" collector & 3" X-pipe w/cats....real nice. Just had them installed last night and ran into a few issues. Can someone please help with the following:

1. Driver Side header is rubbing against the Cross Stabilizer???...connected to the plate under the engine. Ground clearance is good otherwise! Anyone run into this problem?

2. Top tube on the driver's side header is almost rubbing the steering column...possibly rubbing when turning. Should I heat up the pipes and bend for clearance?? I'll touch base with ARH tomorrow…

3. Does the car need to be re-tuned or do I just need to drive it? Idle is fluctuating and is cutting off sometimes...running real rough. Car’s battery was disconnect for 24 hrs, should I just reload the tune? I have a lifetime mail order tune with Amazon but I don't think the tune need to be updated…maybe 15 hp gain. Thoughts? I’ll get with Rick tomorrow.

4. If the O2 sensors are not put back in the same order/same location as original x-Pipe, does that matter?

Lastly, its just freaking loud (Stinger Catback)...didn't think it would be that loud. I can deal with that though. Appreciate any help/advice. I'm in a small town (to say the least) and one mechanic. Thanks.

1. Check to make sure that the motor isn't cocked in the engine mounts. when doing my headers, I had the whole k member out and had to lift and lower the motor quite a few times to be able to get to all of the bolts. Sometimes the engine doesn't sit down in the mounts just right, and may be cocked to one side a little bit. I also changed K members at the same time, so I don't know about the fit with the stock K member.

2. Don't bend any of the tubes for the steering column. The stock steering column has a huge rag joint, and I hear headers will eventually heat the rubber peace in it making it squishy and all. I would just change it out with the solid steering shaft from maximum motorsports.

3. You really need to have the tune checked. Sometimes it affects the AFR, sometimes it doesn't. It did on mine (tune went from 11.8 afr to 12.4 afr), and the 02's are also further away from the engine now and need to heat up sooner also. This has to be changed in the tune.

4. You need to make sure that the 02 sensors are located in the collector and not in one of the primaries on the headers.

Headers are really loud over the stock log configuration. I went from stock headers, magnaflow catted x pipe and magnaflow exhaust to the same setup you have (ARH 1 3/4 longtubes with 3" collector, catted 3" x pipe reduced to 2.5") and its a lot louder. The ARH cats are 200 cell instead of 300 cell or so that the magnaflows are, and are 3" instead of 2.5", so they are less restrictive and much louder. I bought some Bassani baffles to put in my exhaust tips just to try to quite things down a little. Hope this helps.

 

[04Beasst]

02Reaper,

Tks...appreciate the info. We'll relook the postion of the motor and look into ordering the steering column from MM.

Took the car out for a quick spin and punched it just a little, 80 MPH max. While shifting, there was hesitation during each shift...car cut off once at the light. Turned around, tried punching again 60 mph, car ran real rough, started smoking from the rear and I shut everything down...called a tow truck. Passenger side exhaust was leaking antifreeze...sucks. See below. Dropped it off at the local dealership...mechanic that install the headers will take a look tomorrow. He's puzzled as well...freggin pissed!

Blown gasket on the passenger side head???

Seems like quite a bit going on with the car...see pics below:

ARH LT Headers:

ARH X-Pipe:

Both:

Install:

Rubbing on cross member/front stabilizer:

Breakdown/Leaking:

 

[02reaper]

Dang that sucks. I had a little antifreeze leak on the passenger side right after my install, well, actually before I even drove it. Looked like it was either coming from the bell-housing or above the starter. I did a pressure test on the cooling system with dye and couldn't find a leak, even though when the vehicle was dead cold, it would drip about an ounce or so of antifreeze out from somewhere. A buddy advised me that he had the same thing happen to him when he had to change the oil pan on his motor. Apparently lifting and lowering the motor with all of the coolant lines still attached made the front coolant bar where you fill the coolant from the top leak down where it goes into the head at the front and it runs back and down the back of the engine. I figured thats probably what had happened to mine, and the leak finally went away after a few starts. Good luck, and please post back what the installer finds.

 

[02reaper]

Also, is there some type of different bracing on the front of your car where the K member is, or is that part of the tow trucks stuff? I'm talking about the part that runs right up under the oil pan.

 

[04Beasst]

Reaper,

Its got to be part of the Tow Truck mechanism. Good tip on the coolant drip...already passed on to the mechanic. He's planning on doing a compression check as well...I'll post results tomorrow. Hopefully I don't need to take the head off. Really appreciate the info.

Plan is to get an updated tune from Rick (Amazon), retweak the motor mounts, adjust header clearance and I'm hoping the head gaskets are GTG.

Thanks again.

 

[99BOSS]

Hope all checks out well. Stories like this will keep me from ever doing headers!! lol

 

[02reaper]

Updates please?

 

[03Cobrra]

Thats strange I didnt have any fitment problems with mine at all, I also havent gone for a retune but I have a wideband and its not going lean.

 

[sassafras]

Dang that sucks. I had a little antifreeze leak on the passenger side right after my install, well, actually before I even drove it. Looked like it was either coming from the bell-housing or above the starter. I did a pressure test on the cooling system with dye and couldn't find a leak, even though when the vehicle was dead cold, it would drip about an ounce or so of antifreeze out from somewhere. A buddy advised me that he had the same thing happen to him when he had to change the oil pan on his motor. Apparently lifting and lowering the motor with all of the coolant lines still attached made the front coolant bar where you fill the coolant from the top leak down where it goes into the head at the front and it runs back and down the back of the engine. I figured thats probably what had happened to mine, and the leak finally went away after a few starts. Good luck, and please post back what the installer finds.

Had the exact same thing happen to me when I installed my headers and it leaked in the same place. Kinda sucks and freaks you out when you haven't witnessed it before.

 

[02reaper]

Had the exact same thing happen to me when I installed my headers and it leaked in the same place. Kinda sucks and freaks you out when you haven't witnessed it before.

Ain't that the truth. I was freaked out for about a week trying to figure out what was going on.

 

[04Beasst]

Think I’ve had enough of Ford…love the car but I’m just fed up.

Update: Ford dealership conducted a leakdown test, compression, etc. all poor results. Cylinder shutdown (#6). Gave permission to pull engine to ID exact what’s going on and maybe see if the warranty would cover. After pulling the engine and removing the passenger side head, has a blown gasket, antifreeze/coolant everywhere to include the block…see pics. One cylinder is scratched pretty good. Off course Ford said the warranty doesn’t cover the damage…DAMN, so friggin pissed.

Car was running fine before the LTHs were installed…just a slight tapping from the header leak. I believe coolant backflow into the passenger side head because the front of the car was raised higher than the rear during the install…was in that position for 24 hours. I think he also rotated the motor to fit the headers. What’s worst, this was at the mechanic’s private shop, not the dealership (he also works at the dealership). I was just trying to put some money in his pocket.

Next step: I’m ordering an ALUMINATOR tomorrow morning from TOUSLEY Ford (Steve) for $6,100 and upgrading my clutch assembly while the tranny is out. By the way, labor is approximately $2,500. Once the car is running good again and the new engine is broken in, I’m going to sell and start over…probably NOT with a FORD. Maybe a Viper or ZO6! Love this car but this experience has been an eye opener.

Went from this:

To this:

 

[02reaper]

04Beasst, I hate to hear that, but I understand your frustration. I read your post, but I didn't quite understand what the mechanic thought caused this to happen. Can you explain it again please?

 

[04Beasst]

Sure:
Top mechanic from the local dealership also have his own shop...works on a few GT500s and performance Mustangs. To put some $$$ in his pocket, decided to have him install the headers at his private shop vs at the dealership...first mistake.

Dropped car off Friday night so he could start installing the LTHs Saturday morning...gives the ride a chance to cool as well. Expected to take 4-5 hours. Stopped by about noon and notice the front of the car was signifcantly higher that the rear. Didn't finish the install until about 8 pm. Went to pick up the car, pulled out of garage (car running real rough) and coolant sprayed everywhere. The coolant line junction near the overflow tank (head cool upgrade) came apart...wasn't too concerned. shut car down, tighten all hoses, refill with coolant and started car...still running rough.

Headed home and car cuts off once. finally got home, called him and he mention the computer needs to adjust. Took it out early Sunday and you know the rest.

The mechanic haven't commented at all on what he thinks happened...personally I think he feels guilty about it. He hinted it was a failed head gasket. There was a decent crack/crimp in the head gasket but that couldn't of been done after the gasket was taken off. Even so, doesn't really explain why there was so much coolant in the head. I'm meeting with him and the head service tech to discuss their plan after the longblock gets here. Lots of upgraded parts and want to make sure they know what to put on the new motor.

Might do the EGR delete since everything will be out, new clutch, flywheel and bigger fuel rails.

I'll take pics of the whole process and a few videos. Talked to ARH today and they provided a few tips of proper position of the headers. Longblock should get here next week...more to follow.

 

[desert_gypsy]

Sounds like the mechanic got a little overzealous with either his torque wrench, or from the bottom side while trying to work the headers up into place. If you think of the headers as an enormous breakover bar (lots of leverage) bolted to the side of an aluminum cylinder head which is also bolted to a cast iron short block, a cracked head doesn't seem too far fetched. Just MHO.

 

[04Beasst]

Thanks. At this point, I'm dipping to investments and forking out the $$ to get the ride back up. I'm leaning towards a MMR longblock...should decide today.

 

[02reaper]

Sounds to me like whenever you had the coolant leak at first, there may have been air in the cooling system afterward. Also, it looks like there may have been some detonation in the cylinders on that side as well from the pictures, which could have been either caused by the tune being lean, or having too much timing, and or just from air being in the cooling system not allowing the system to take the heat out of the cylinders. All this is just a guess at things though. I am really interested in seeing what the final diagnosis is, with the videos and pictures. This has been a great learning experience for me too. Sorry for your misfortune.

 

[04Beasst]

02Reaper, you're probably spot on and I appreciate your comments. Its cobra owners like yourself that make me appreaciate my car. Thanks man!

If you were in my situation, what engine would you go with...keep in mind I'm trying to get my car up and running ASAP:

1. Rebuilt Engine (MMR, Mod Performance, Livernois, etc.) ($7000+/1yr limited warranty) Keep old Longblock.

2. Ford Racing Aluminator ($6100 / 1 yr warranty)...I keep my Longblock. Aluminum Block, same internals and updated heads.

3. Ford OEM ($3900 / 3 yr / 30K mile warranty)...ford keeps Longblock/core. Iron case block, same internals/updated heads.

I've heard negatives on option...what's your opinion? Do you know anyone that has the Aluminator...curious on durability of the block.

 

[02reaper]

04Beasst I appreciate your kindness. If I were in your position and was going to sale the car after I was finished fixing it, I would just go with the OEM Iron block from Tousley ford (option 3). I don't think that would devalue the car any for resale. If I were going to keep the car, I would definitely build or in your case, have someone like livernoise build me a motor. I still haven't grown to like the aluminator even with the weight savings. I hear that the ford boss block is the strongest, and that would be the one I would go with if I had one built. I just want to say, that I really feel bad for the mechanic that installed the headers. I installed mine myself, and it was the most aggravating mod I have ever installed on a vehicle, and even saying that, there's not much you can screw up installing them besides maybe stripping some bolt holes. I really think your issue stems from a tune problem, air in the cooling system, or just a fluke on the gasket from the factory. I really don't think the mechanic is at fault. Please keep me updated on this as you go along, even though I had a leak on mine at first, and think mine was from the metal tube on top of the engine that the coolant runs through, you never know, I could be in the same position as you and not even know it yet.