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SVTPerformance's Chain of Restaurants
The Distillery
E85 or meth?
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<blockquote data-quote="KEVINS" data-source="post: 15897228" data-attributes="member: 158789"><p>Most of the people you'll hear from have never used both systems and can give experienced comparisons between both but I've used Meth Inj on my GN (stock motor 91oct @ 35psi) , used it on my 2V 2002 Mustang (91 oct 26psi 720hp single M15 nozzle at full pump pressure) and still have it on my 2V but after installing a standalone computer it's now converted to a flex fuel car. Since I don't have the 91/meth tune done it's only tuned with E85 and has made 900+ @ 32psi on E85 but also spraying Meth. The reason for the meth on the E85 is b/c there's no way to automatically limit the meth depending on how much 91oct is in the tank. So the meth sprays for all shes worth no matter what fuel is in the tank.</p><p></p><p>My thoughts on both:</p><p>In order to have a solid and successful gas/meth car you need to have extra electronics installed for tuning and for the "oops" moments. YES! they do happen!!!! I'll say it again: YES THEY DO HAPPEN so don't be ignorant and think they won't happen to you.</p><p></p><p>When using meth with low octane fuel and you want to make a lot of HP you ARE using the meth as a fuel not just octane so you'll be spraying a lot of it. There is nothing wrong with this but you should design/build the entire system with this in mind and mine was:</p><p></p><p>1) Most important is a knock detector. GN's have them from the factory and I learned how valuable they are for tuning so I installed a J&S Vampire system on my Mustang before I ever got into boost. I actually learned that with 91oct I get knock at 7psi of boost! That's not much boost at all but it lit the knock gauge up like a xmas tree at 7psi. The tuner LOVES the vampire system b/c when he's making a minor tuning change he watches the knock gauge. If one single LED lights up he lets out of the throttle and changes the tune then makes another pull. So every bit of the RPM he tunes it for no knock. The Vampire system listens to each cylinder and if it hears knock it pulls timing until the knock is gone then it tries to add the timing back after 4 revolutions. VERY HI TECH stuff here but critical IMO if running meth!</p><p></p><p>2) Lean Protection Module. If at WOT and a lean condition is experienced (I have it set to anything leaner than 12.2) the ignition is shut off until I lift up on the throttle then the ignition starts up again so I can drive it normally.</p><p></p><p>With 91/meth @ 26psi and 720hp combo I started getting fuel distribution issues and started melting plugs on two cylinders on the dyno. This is when I chose to stop it at this power level and chose to switch to a standalone computer and flex fuel system.</p><p></p><p>Running E85 is the simplest cheapest way to go. IMO, both of the systems above are great to have but not necessary to have a safe system but I would still get the Lean Protection Module b/c if a lean condition occurs you'll never know it until BOOOM. Spend some $$ on electronics to monitor that expensive motor.</p><p></p><p>The easiest fuel system to have is a return style. When my Mustang was making 720 with 91/meth it was not a return system but after converting it to a return system for the E85 I realized how stupid I had been trying to make the non-return system work.. dumb idea due to the complexity of it.. Go with a return fuel system b/c it's much simpler.</p><p></p><p>Currently I use three 340 pumps, 160# inj and the meth pump runs at full pressure with a M15 nozzle. Two of the fuel pumps and the meth is activated at 7psi.</p><p></p><p>Fuel line is 1/2" feed and 1/2" return and a regulator that has a large 3/8" diameter check ball for the return line. During research on regulators I found out that some only have a tiny 1/8" hole for the return fuel even tho they are advertised with a -10 return line fitting.. Stupid...</p><p></p><p></p><p>ks</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="KEVINS, post: 15897228, member: 158789"] Most of the people you'll hear from have never used both systems and can give experienced comparisons between both but I've used Meth Inj on my GN (stock motor 91oct @ 35psi) , used it on my 2V 2002 Mustang (91 oct 26psi 720hp single M15 nozzle at full pump pressure) and still have it on my 2V but after installing a standalone computer it's now converted to a flex fuel car. Since I don't have the 91/meth tune done it's only tuned with E85 and has made 900+ @ 32psi on E85 but also spraying Meth. The reason for the meth on the E85 is b/c there's no way to automatically limit the meth depending on how much 91oct is in the tank. So the meth sprays for all shes worth no matter what fuel is in the tank. My thoughts on both: In order to have a solid and successful gas/meth car you need to have extra electronics installed for tuning and for the "oops" moments. YES! they do happen!!!! I'll say it again: YES THEY DO HAPPEN so don't be ignorant and think they won't happen to you. When using meth with low octane fuel and you want to make a lot of HP you ARE using the meth as a fuel not just octane so you'll be spraying a lot of it. There is nothing wrong with this but you should design/build the entire system with this in mind and mine was: 1) Most important is a knock detector. GN's have them from the factory and I learned how valuable they are for tuning so I installed a J&S Vampire system on my Mustang before I ever got into boost. I actually learned that with 91oct I get knock at 7psi of boost! That's not much boost at all but it lit the knock gauge up like a xmas tree at 7psi. The tuner LOVES the vampire system b/c when he's making a minor tuning change he watches the knock gauge. If one single LED lights up he lets out of the throttle and changes the tune then makes another pull. So every bit of the RPM he tunes it for no knock. The Vampire system listens to each cylinder and if it hears knock it pulls timing until the knock is gone then it tries to add the timing back after 4 revolutions. VERY HI TECH stuff here but critical IMO if running meth! 2) Lean Protection Module. If at WOT and a lean condition is experienced (I have it set to anything leaner than 12.2) the ignition is shut off until I lift up on the throttle then the ignition starts up again so I can drive it normally. With 91/meth @ 26psi and 720hp combo I started getting fuel distribution issues and started melting plugs on two cylinders on the dyno. This is when I chose to stop it at this power level and chose to switch to a standalone computer and flex fuel system. Running E85 is the simplest cheapest way to go. IMO, both of the systems above are great to have but not necessary to have a safe system but I would still get the Lean Protection Module b/c if a lean condition occurs you'll never know it until BOOOM. Spend some $$ on electronics to monitor that expensive motor. The easiest fuel system to have is a return style. When my Mustang was making 720 with 91/meth it was not a return system but after converting it to a return system for the E85 I realized how stupid I had been trying to make the non-return system work.. dumb idea due to the complexity of it.. Go with a return fuel system b/c it's much simpler. Currently I use three 340 pumps, 160# inj and the meth pump runs at full pressure with a M15 nozzle. Two of the fuel pumps and the meth is activated at 7psi. Fuel line is 1/2" feed and 1/2" return and a regulator that has a large 3/8" diameter check ball for the return line. During research on regulators I found out that some only have a tiny 1/8" hole for the return fuel even tho they are advertised with a -10 return line fitting.. Stupid... ks [/QUOTE]
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