Detecting improvised explosive device

[Tx_Diablous]

I got out of the Army in 86 and in my day we did not train on IED detection. I have been thinking about how they can be detected and have an idea I think might work but not sure who to talk to or how to pass the Idea along to DOD. Before I do any more about this Idea I thought I would ask the AD guys of SVT some in country experience with IED and how are they being detected now? Where are they planted most and are you guys finding most of them before they go off? Jim Snover and I have talked about this a lot and we really think this is a good Idea and I think I should pass this on to someone smarter than I about this.

 

[FX4 SAPPER]

lol man, not to brag but my unit to my knowledge still holds the record for most IED finds in country. My company alone which was two platoons found 639 in one year in Mosul and our BN total had close to 1000.

I was on a route clearance team and i can answer some of your questions. For starters, IED's are being detected by various means, visual contact, thermal sights, pop and no blows (blasting cap detonates but not the charge) and of course an actual IED strike. The most effective way right now is for personnel to visually look for them, when you first get out on the routes you know nothing but after a few weeks you start to remember every pothole, every crack in the street, where most garbage should be and you will notice if a bag of trash looks cleaner than the rest in a pile. If anything looks suspicious of an IED whomever spots it will call a stop to the patrol, cordon off the area and allow the Buffalo to come and investigate with its arm. If you are not familiar with the Buffalo it is a heavily armored vehicle with a hydraulic arm with a camera attached to it which is used to investigate IED's. If in fact it is confirmed an IED we will either blow it in place or call EOD if it is something too large for us to do, or if there would be extensive collateral damage etc. For emplacement most IED's you will find in urban areas will be on a curb line or right off the road on what would be a sidewalk here in the states, hidden in some garbage, a box, fire extinguishers, propane tanks, concrete blocks, porcelain bowls etc basically everything and anything. IED's can be small enough to where they can be emplaced rather quickly withing a minute or as complex as a few days work. then you also have the buried IED's. Most of the time a buried IED will be emplaced in a pothole, a blast crater from a previous IED detonation or from actual construction. A lot of times these will be what are called "shape charges" which are extremely dangerous. Even though most of our vehicles have the 'v' shape hull to deflect most of the blast such as in an MRAP, a HMMVW does not. A shape charge is an explosive that concentrates all of its energy into a small area like a cannon. very powerful, easy to make, and easy to hide in a buried situation. Then you have what they call EFP's. Explosively Formed Projectile. This is our biggest threat as these are highly technical, require very little explosives and are very easy to make a majority of the parts for. Most EFP's will use an IR sensor such as an automatic door opener used in the front on a store. EFP's are basically an extreme version of a shape charge on steroids, instead of one large blast like a cannon, you are getting a larger blast through multiple areas like a shotgun. These can punch through some thick shit. I know for us we were lucky enough to find most before they hit us, but we still got hit A LOT. Some units are not as lucky. We were trained to find these things as it was our job as Combat Engineers. If you need any more information, pictures etc PM me and i will save the bandwith lol. Good luck

 

[MWR]

You shouldn't be discussing this on a public forum!

 

[FX4 SAPPER]

You shouldn't be discussing this on a public forum!

All of the info i disclosed is public information, hell you can download the Route Clearance handbook from armystudyguide.com

 

[Tx_Diablous]

You shouldn't be discussing this on a public forum!

Ok then where? Lots of good info to think about in his post hell he is not saying anything but it takes a good eye so what is the enemy going to do with that? Now what drop it? With all the computing power of the US all we can use is a good eye? Just my point, there must be a better way.

 

[Eagle24]

Currently in Afghanistan, over 300 IED's have been found, 25 have went off in my platoon so far. The only way we have found them, is finding the command wire when we do a dismount clearance. I'm infantry, so no hightech gadgets for us, just visual findings.

 

[Tractorman]

If something blows up, you found one!

Slightly off topic, but one time we had to secure the route to our place for a resupply. We went out, parked the vehicle, dismounted and checked around for IED's, nothing found. Mounted back up as the convoy got closer.

Route clearance comes, start yelling at us to back up, so we did. Out comes the robot. It starts moving in on some random trash pile, then blam! No more robot. No one ever said if it was an IED it hit, or if the charge it had blew up on accident.

 

[mysticsvt]

I only play with really big ones...on the ocean floor. So pretty sure my intel isnt what you want to hear..lol.-Shane

 

[99navert]

I was in Iraq in 2005 & the best way we had to detect IED's were dismounted patrols. We never had access to any technology or even a US EOD unit, we had to go through British EOD in the southern portion of the country.

 

[Steve03SVT]

Visual! As mentioned earlier, after a short time, you know where everything is and if something is out of place. Dismounted or mounted, you're constantly scanning. In southern Basra, it wasn't so much IED's, but EFP's. MRAP armor doesn't do well against those. Up around HIT, it was IED's and the cowardly RKG3 attacks that were chopping us at the knees.

 

[Steve03SVT]

I was in Iraq in 2005 & the best way we had to detect IED's were dismounted patrols. We never had access to any technology or even a US EOD unit, we had to go through British EOD in the southern portion of the country.

We worked and lived with the Brits in Basra, those guys are freak'n NUTS.

 

[99navert]

I was always amazed by them running around in their Land Rovers Snatchs with no armour to speak of, they said it gave them "great visibility".

 

[bettner12]

You shouldn't be discussing this on a public forum!

Seconded! just because it's publicly available information doesn't mean that you should make it more plentiful. And as far as specifics about vehicle armor and construction, yeah keep that hush hush too...:bash:

 

[99navert]

Seconded! just because it's publicly available information doesn't mean that you should make it more plentiful. And as far as specifics about vehicle armor and construction, yeah keep that hush hush too...:bash:

Here is a great example of OPSEC, lets follow the example set by the DOD: oke:

IEDs in Afghanistan: The Deadliest Weapon - 60 Minutes - CBS News

 

[D's01Snake]

^ lol

 

[Smileyboy]

Me and one of my buddies were wondering, would a radar detector be of some possible use? Mine likes to go off alot around houses with the same motion detection system you can get at wal-mart. Just wondering if it would work over there as well.

 

[FX4 SAPPER]

Me and one of my buddies were wondering, would a radar detector be of some possible use? Mine likes to go off alot around houses with the same motion detection system you can get at wal-mart. Just wondering if it would work over there as well.

Not all IED's are detonated like that. Some are command detonated and some are victim detonated.

 

[Smileyboy]

Not all IED's are detonated like that. Some are command detonated and some are victim detonated.

I know that, im just saying for the ones that are detonated by motion detection if that would work.:beer:

 

[FX4 SAPPER]

I know that, im just saying for the ones that are detonated by motion detection if that would work.:beer:

There are jammers that block signals from certain electronic devices and they are pretty reliable now, but the insurgents wised up and now a good chunk are remote operated with a hard wire secondary or some other form of secondary initiation.

 

[NxCoupe]

Uhm, yeah. I currently work as a trainer for CIED and other route clearance units. I can't talk about squat other than I teach how to operate Buffalo A2's and HUSKY units. As for detection, operation, etc. I don't know what i can and can't comment on, so I'll just keep my mouth shut. I am currently in Afghanistan, I am in Bagram, have been over in country for a year this march. I am the Sharana region trainer, permanent tdy here in Bagram, lol.
If the OP wants to pm me a rough idea of what you are talking about, I might be able to stear you without divulging any info. willing to do that. there are some new things out now that are just killer for our side, should help a lot. As for IED's, Afghanistan is much different from Iraq. The design and placement are different. Thanks to all you guys who get out there and do this stuff, you guys have brass balls.