Compund Boost setup questions.

[BlkVnm512]

I have been looking into a Compound boost setup, and still can't get that many answers. I was hoping that I could get way better answers on here than I could get at shops who seem to be inconsistent with pricing. I've gotten $6,900 for a full build once then i got about $15,000 from a different one.

I'd like about 800-900 hp, with the capability to turn it up to 1000 for a dyno just to show off and say that it can make that much, if possible.

My questions are the following:

Is it possible to build an IRS to handle that much? Or would it be better to do an SRA

What motor work should be done? Looking at buying another stock motor right now for a future build, possibly this one.

And what kit would be used? I know that Hellion sells there kit but I wanna know what else is out there...

What Drivetrain work would be needed?

and Lastly, what Fuel system recommendations?





Thank you in advance for any advice you can give me.
-Ryan

 

[SPoole]

Man that is a lot of questions that all have a lot of options. If someone was going to build a turn key compound boost setup with all the absulutely necessary components to support that power level for $15k you would be getting a bargain.
The shop that quoted under $7k either did not understand the question or would be building it with PVC pipe and duct tape.
My build was only a single turbo system with 95% of the labor done for free and I have around $7k in it so far.

 

[InvisibleBlade]

I would imagine an upgraded clutch and input spline would be good thing. I plan on going with the McCloud twin disk RXT and 26 spline input shaft. I can't help ya too much on the fuel since I plan on switching to E85, but it seems like when you get to a certain HP that it's easier to switch to a return system. I'll let the people who know their stuff to chime in on specifics.

What motor work should be done?

Im curious on this too cause this is the same thing I wanna do. Would forged pistons be all you would need?


Paging Digital! lol

 

[TerminatedSVT]

If you're starting at stock, or anywhere near stock, 7k will not get you anywhere near 1000hp. Just the custom fab work for the compound turbo would be costly. You may want to compile a parts list, and take to a shop who will help you design it better.

 

[gabe1530]

head studs at a minimum. the rest of the engine build is up to you and how far your wallet can stretch.
irs... i would recommend the full tilt boogie bushing kit. choosing between solid and irs is up to you and your intentions.
drivetrain is another question in itself. do you want to stick with the 6 speed or go auto. with manual i woulg go with the mcloud rxt, ditch the 10spline, etc, etc.
fuel also depends on if your running pump gas or e85.
do some research and im sure youll find all the answers to your questions.

 

[ruthless]

1000rwhp for $15,000 or less? Sign me up for some of that! 1000rwhp is harder to make than most people seem to think. I wouldn't do it on a factory engine and expect it to live long.

 

[BLK_03]

The IRS will be fine. Upgraded shafts and full tilt boogie for peace of mind.

It's the T-56 you'll have trouble with, holding that much power.

 

[Digital]

I have been looking into a Compound boost setup, and still can't get that many answers. I was hoping that I could get way better answers on here than I could get at shops who seem to be inconsistent with pricing. I've gotten $6,900 for a full build once then i got about $15,000 from a different one.

I'd like about 800-900 hp, with the capability to turn it up to 1000 for a dyno just to show off and say that it can make that much, if possible.

My questions are the following:

Is it possible to build an IRS to handle that much? Or would it be better to do an SRA
SRA would be ideal but you can invest almost as much as you'd spend on a built SRA into the IRS and hope you don't snap a half shaft on launch

What motor work should be done? Looking at buying another stock motor right now for a future build, possibly this one.
For the numbers you want you just need better pistons. Ideally you'd get a 5.4 modular and work with that but you can stroke the 4.6, get cams, rods, pistons, crank, etc and build a machine.

And what kit would be used? I know that Hellion sells there kit but I wanna know what else is out there...
Every turbo kit I know of moves the alternator to the top and runs turbo piping in the old location. They also get rid of the heat exchanger which you'd want to keep. You would need to modify a kits piping to make it fit around the alternator and the "intake" pipe to make the eaton bend vs the 01 cobra bend. Also you'd have to move the intercooler forward so it sits infront of the heat exchanger. A turbo kit is just a bunch of pipe really. Any decent muffler shop can in theory build you a turbo kit with minimal effort. or for that matter modify an existing one.

What Drivetrain work would be needed?
You'll need a clutch, preferably a mcleod twin, 26 spline input, you'll break the shift forks in your tranny and possibly the output shaft, we touched on the SRAvsIRS earlier.

and Lastly, what Fuel system recommendations?
triple GS's as in my sig or a single sumped in-line unit of your choosing. The cost is almost the same if not slightly cheaper to go in-line. Obviously return and 100+ # injectors with rails etc.




Thank you in advance for any advice you can give me.
-Ryan

Those numbers they quoted you to have a kit made and installed at 15k with full supporting mods and all that jazz was a good deal.

Man that is a lot of questions that all have a lot of options. If someone was going to build a turn key compound boost setup with all the absulutely necessary components to support that power level for $15k you would be getting a bargain.
The shop that quoted under $7k either did not understand the question or would be building it with PVC pipe and duct tape.
My build was only a single turbo system with 95% of the labor done for free and I have around $7k in it so far.

+1 Reinforces my above comment.

I would imagine an upgraded clutch and input spline would be good thing. I plan on going with the McCloud twin disk RXT and 26 spline input shaft. I can't help ya too much on the fuel since I plan on switching to E85, but it seems like when you get to a certain HP that it's easier to switch to a return system. I'll let the people who know their stuff to chime in on specifics.

Im curious on this too cause this is the same thing I wanna do. Would forged pistons be all you would need?


Paging Digital! lol

I'm here lol. Yes everything you said is good info.

If you're starting at stock, or anywhere near stock, 7k will not get you anywhere near 1000hp. Just the custom fab work for the compound turbo would be costly. You may want to compile a parts list, and take to a shop who will help you design it better.

+1. It's very important you have a complete list and order sheet signed by a shop of what they will buy and what they will install for what price.

head studs at a minimum. the rest of the engine build is up to you and how far your wallet can stretch.
irs... i would recommend the full tilt boogie bushing kit. choosing between solid and irs is up to you and your intentions.
drivetrain is another question in itself. do you want to stick with the 6 speed or go auto. with manual i woulg go with the mcloud rxt, ditch the 10spline, etc, etc.
fuel also depends on if your running pump gas or e85.
do some research and im sure youll find all the answers to your questions.

I would run E85 on this setup and just up the fuel system to 1500hp. Very easy to do with a in-line pump and 150+ # injectors.
the FTBR kit for the IRS won't save your half shafts but at least you can control the car.
Personally I'd go built 4r70w. But that'll cost almost as much as the parts for the kit.

1000rwhp for $15,000 or less? Sign me up for some of that! 1000rwhp is harder to make than most people seem to think. I wouldn't do it on a factory engine and expect it to live long.

Factory engine is fine. Just need some tweaks.

The IRS will be fine. Upgraded shafts and full tilt boogie for peace of mind.

It's the T-56 you'll have trouble with, holding that much power.

QFT

 

[ruthless]

Factory engine is fine. Just need some tweaks.

BS. How many compound boost cars are still running after putting 20k miles on them?

 

[Digital]

Factory engine is fine. Just need some tweaks.

BS. How many compound boost cars are still running after putting 20k on them?

Are you referring to block damage? Because the rods are rated plenty high. The only damage I've seen with these engines are the pistons. Maybe a bent valve or a spark plug got tagged. But 90% of the time it's a melted piston. I consider 8 new pistons a "minor" tweak. What do you consider it?

(P.S. I love ruthless, he makes me work for my opinion)

 

[ruthless]

Are you referring to block damage? Because the rods are rated plenty high. The only damage I've seen with these engines are the pistons. Maybe a bent valve or a spark plug got tagged. But 90% of the time it's a melted piston. I consider 8 new pistons a "minor" tweak. What do you consider it?

(P.S. I love ruthless, he makes me work for my opinion)

My screen names fits what can I say. LOL :beer:

I am just saying that I dont think everyone will consider swaping pistons a "minor tweak". In my book a factory engine is one that has never had the valve covers lifted. I thought thats what you were refering to and I know I would NEVER push my setup on my factory engine that hard with just turbos. Now take into consideration how much more stress a compound setup puts on it. OUCH!

I know one thing...If I go into my engine I am not going to stop with new pistons. :rockon:

 

[Digital]

My screen names fits what can I say. LOL :beer:

I am just saying that I dont think everyone will consider swaping pistons a "minor tweak". In my book a factory engine is one that has never had the valve covers lifted. I thought thats what you were refering to and I know I would NEVER push my setup on my factory engine that hard with just turbos. Now take into consideration how much more stress a compound setup puts on it. OUCH!

I know one thing...If I go into my engine I am not going to stop with new pistons. :rockon:

Indeed. My personal opinion is these engines are maxed at 750-800rwhp on a "healthy life" basis. You can probably see 900-1000 for a bit with lots of cooling and lower boost.

I believe anyone who wants to make serious power and takes short cuts is going to get a real bad wake up call. Don't plan a build like this with short funds. This isn't a simple port and fuel pump swap. We're talking big money here. Like 3-5 grand being the norm for an "oops" or "extra".

Can you do the block .020 over and slap in some CPs and call it a day? Sure. Have people done it? Sure. Would I do it? No. Not everyone has 7-8 grand to build a 5.4L motor but if you want the power you need to pay.

Same goes with the fuel system. Go big or go home. Get some low imp 175# injs and a big ass in-line pump with a gregs sumped tank. Then you don't have to worry about anything, ever.

Drop 2 grand on a SRA and 7k on a 4r70w. Walk away knowing your drive train is solid.

Get the eaton ported, get a killer chiller setup and delete the heat exchanger, then put a huge ass FMIC on the car and slap some turbos, piping, wg, and bovs on and tune the bitch.

Sounds simple but I just quoted about 25 grand in parts right there, no labor. (Granted you'll be good for +1500rwhp)

(I'll let on a little secret. I've ridden in some really fast cars, faster then mine. You're going to run into a traction issue unless you tub the car and put 15-17" rims back there with sportsmans at anything under 100mph. It really isn't that much fun driving at 200mph on public roads, they just aren't maintained properly for those speeds. You're better off buying a 1000cc bike and tuning it for that. Just stick with ~750rwhp. Anything over that is getting to be useless and will get you into a lot of trouble, or killed.)

 

[ruthless]

See Digital knows his stuff. Some times it just takes a oke: to get it all out of him.

 

[Digital]

See Digital knows his stuff. Some times it just takes a oke: to get it all out of him.

This is true. Sometimes I get lazy. That's why I said you make me work for my opinion. Kinda like slowsvt. lol.
To me all this stuff is just "matter of fact." It all just make sense and is very "obvious" since I've been there. I can relate to threads in my mind where all these questions have been answered. I forget that not everyone is like that and just assume they know so I don't go into detail very often. Takes some prodding some times or very exact detailed questions. I think it's that way for a lot of the other guys here. They see the same broad questions so they give very short dull answers. The precise questions invoke a very detailed reply though.
If the OP has a more detailed set of questions that will greatly aid in the responses he'll receive.

 

[black03_cobra]

get a foxbody and build a single 88 or 94 turbo Windsor with a glide. talk to proline they will hook you up and you got a beast ass mother fr

 

[InvisibleBlade]

Great info Digital! I'm sure many people, including myself, appreciate those who take the time to come up with informative, well thought out answers/responses.

 

[BlkVnm512]

Digital,
Thank you very much. I know in my mind I was thinking like 40k, but after actually checking some places out, It made me really wonder if I was just not doing my math right, or something a long those lines. I mean, $6900 for twin 66mm and custom piping installed, made me second guess myself even more after being told $15,000 about 2 hours earlier. I appreciate your thought out, detailed, and even personal experience of other cars.

-Ryan

 

[Digital]

Digital,
Thank you very much. I know in my mind I was thinking like 40k, but after actually checking some places out, It made me really wonder if I was just not doing my math right, or something a long those lines. I mean, $6900 for twin 66mm and custom piping installed, made me second guess myself even more after being told $15,000 about 2 hours earlier. I appreciate your thought out, detailed, and even personal experience of other cars.

-Ryan

The kind words are very welcome.
A big difference is kit prices will be pipe type, "cleanness" of install, and if they coat it, and/or wrap it, or not. As well as quality of the actual moving parts.

If it was me I would get a kit made of aluminized steel. It has a very good cost vs life ratio. Get the entire kit wrapped with header/turbo wrap.
Go tial bov and waste gate, and grab some $1200~ (x2) turbos of your choice. I figure about 3500$ after bov, wg, and turbos. You'll want to pick a decent FMIC. They are all more or less made equal. Anything around 400$ will work with a good air flow design.
"Custom" headers which is really just a plate they drill out and weld some bends to shouldn't crack a grand. So you're at like 5 grand right there. The piping is more time sensitive to getting the bends laid out and mounted where you want vs actually cutting and welding it. That's where the shop is going to come in. But I say 1500-2500 is fair number assuming aluminized steel and solid welds.
After you get all that you're already in the territory of a online pre-made kit.

If it was me right now and I had to do it over I'd get a big single fuel pump, go return, get the supporting fuel mods, get a on3 type turbo kit and just upgrade the WG and BOV to a tial unit and tune it. 750rwhp should be easy on pump and you don't have to worry about the motor. You can do all that for 5-6 grand. It'll also last as long as you own the car, long as you don't plan on putting 200k on it lol.
You can spend the rest fixing the tranny and rear end when ever it breaks and doing cool stuff like full length subframes and rims/tires and all the other mods people forget about when they are sinking their 401k into going fast.