Hey fellas
I am posting a pm that Jimmysidecar and I had recently and I wanted to get a little more input here as to what you prefer and WHY. I am especially looking to see what the Whipple & Kenne Bell guys have to say....Thanks !
-tomcat
Original Question:
Hey Jimmy
I am a (usually) silent fan of yours here at SVT who enjoys reading your posts and you are definitely one of the guys who make this forum worthwhile. I noticed in your sig a phrase that makes me want your opinion on something. I am referring to the "say no to rotating mass" statement. It is time (actually, way past time!) for me to upgrade the tranny on my 03 cobra (26 spline input shaft, Spec 3+ clutch, LP retainer sleeve, FRPP pilot bearing & throwout bearing) and, of course, the flywheel. The question involves aluminum vs billet steel. So yes, I did do my homework and search the forums for similar questions, but I don't think every point was covered, at least not for my set up and type of driving. I have the whipple 2.3 & supporting mods putting down 612/556 SAE corrected,and I use this car for street driving only - no 1/4 mile track type of stuff. I am more of the 60 -130 type of guy (yes, in Mexico ). I fully understand the benefits of minimizing rotating mass, but I also see some potential negatives as well, namely 1) billet steel is much stronger than Aluminum, and 2) rotating mass may actually be your friend when changing gears say from 2nd to 3rd or 3rd to 4th (basically anything BUT from a dig) as the rpms won't fall as quickly. I would value your thoughts on this, as I will be purchasing the parts soon. Maybe this can also be moved over to the driveline section as well if you feel that any discussion here is of value for others . Thank you! -tom (tomcat)
Response:You pretty much described above all the conditions validating a decision to use an Aluminum flywheel.
You are not doing dig runs. Even then my view is they are of extremely limited benefit.
The steel flywheel being stronger is almost comical, sorry. I am not you it's just that you are not going to break our flywheel.
The guys talking about how much more enjoyable the steel flywheel car is to street drive, coming off stop lights and stop signs, I believe are trying to cover up and are compensating for their mistake and loss of power. I have a real hard time taking those posts seriously.
High mass flywheels are for getting heavy sedans moving in the first ten feet, after that they rob power and slow acceleration.
High mass large diameter wheels also rob large amounts of power but don't contribute inertia.
I also don't think they would be worth the power loss while delivering a slight bit of inertia on shifts.
The inertia advantage would be delivered and over in milliseconds and then the mass would turn back into drag.
The high mass would also make spinning on shifts easier, and contribute to more down stream drive line breakage.
You can get replacement friction inserts for our stock Aluminum flywheels and fix them even if they are really trashed.
Our OE flywheel is a McLeod unit and they sell the replacement inserts for our flywheel. I plan on keeping mine when I finally get slippage on my stocker and replace it with an RXT twin. Currently everything from the clutch pedal to the ring and pinion is still stock and working fine. I do have a different diff and bushings back there but except for the MGW shifter and R/P fluid everything else is stock and living.
Lift shifts and almost no drag racing makes stuff last though. You have a lot more power and different usage.
Less rotating mass is nearly always an improvement in this hobby. The energy of a high mass flywheel is released so fast, the advantage is probably more like the first two feet. After than it is the worst form of drag, and in a rather large diameter. Nope, not liking it.
If you want to start a thread in Driveline on this feel free. You can copy and past this PM if you want.
Though I'm sure the steel flywheel guys are going to bust my balls for sure[/I][/I].
I am posting a pm that Jimmysidecar and I had recently and I wanted to get a little more input here as to what you prefer and WHY. I am especially looking to see what the Whipple & Kenne Bell guys have to say....Thanks !
-tomcat
Original Question:
Hey Jimmy
I am a (usually) silent fan of yours here at SVT who enjoys reading your posts and you are definitely one of the guys who make this forum worthwhile. I noticed in your sig a phrase that makes me want your opinion on something. I am referring to the "say no to rotating mass" statement. It is time (actually, way past time!) for me to upgrade the tranny on my 03 cobra (26 spline input shaft, Spec 3+ clutch, LP retainer sleeve, FRPP pilot bearing & throwout bearing) and, of course, the flywheel. The question involves aluminum vs billet steel. So yes, I did do my homework and search the forums for similar questions, but I don't think every point was covered, at least not for my set up and type of driving. I have the whipple 2.3 & supporting mods putting down 612/556 SAE corrected,and I use this car for street driving only - no 1/4 mile track type of stuff. I am more of the 60 -130 type of guy (yes, in Mexico ). I fully understand the benefits of minimizing rotating mass, but I also see some potential negatives as well, namely 1) billet steel is much stronger than Aluminum, and 2) rotating mass may actually be your friend when changing gears say from 2nd to 3rd or 3rd to 4th (basically anything BUT from a dig) as the rpms won't fall as quickly. I would value your thoughts on this, as I will be purchasing the parts soon. Maybe this can also be moved over to the driveline section as well if you feel that any discussion here is of value for others . Thank you! -tom (tomcat)
Response:You pretty much described above all the conditions validating a decision to use an Aluminum flywheel.
You are not doing dig runs. Even then my view is they are of extremely limited benefit.
The steel flywheel being stronger is almost comical, sorry. I am not you it's just that you are not going to break our flywheel.
The guys talking about how much more enjoyable the steel flywheel car is to street drive, coming off stop lights and stop signs, I believe are trying to cover up and are compensating for their mistake and loss of power. I have a real hard time taking those posts seriously.
High mass flywheels are for getting heavy sedans moving in the first ten feet, after that they rob power and slow acceleration.
High mass large diameter wheels also rob large amounts of power but don't contribute inertia.
I also don't think they would be worth the power loss while delivering a slight bit of inertia on shifts.
The inertia advantage would be delivered and over in milliseconds and then the mass would turn back into drag.
The high mass would also make spinning on shifts easier, and contribute to more down stream drive line breakage.
You can get replacement friction inserts for our stock Aluminum flywheels and fix them even if they are really trashed.
Our OE flywheel is a McLeod unit and they sell the replacement inserts for our flywheel. I plan on keeping mine when I finally get slippage on my stocker and replace it with an RXT twin. Currently everything from the clutch pedal to the ring and pinion is still stock and working fine. I do have a different diff and bushings back there but except for the MGW shifter and R/P fluid everything else is stock and living.
Lift shifts and almost no drag racing makes stuff last though. You have a lot more power and different usage.
Less rotating mass is nearly always an improvement in this hobby. The energy of a high mass flywheel is released so fast, the advantage is probably more like the first two feet. After than it is the worst form of drag, and in a rather large diameter. Nope, not liking it.
If you want to start a thread in Driveline on this feel free. You can copy and past this PM if you want.
Though I'm sure the steel flywheel guys are going to bust my balls for sure[/I][/I].
