New vehicle sales pace...unsustainable?

[Tractorman]

Look at how loaded the vehicles are. I looked at new '15 F250 with a diesel and 4x4. It was 43k as an XL, but had power window, cruise, ect. Also a crew cab long bed, so its going to have a higher price.

I remember my dad's old trucks. Hand crank windows, 4 speed manual, manual hubs, and regular cab.

You don't have to drop 50k to get a nice pickup. Nice half tons are low to mid 30's.

 

[CompOrange04GT]

At some point in your life income stops but your need for shelter does not. Renting your way through life is very short sighted imo.

And you may die before your need for shelter stops. And for years you "hoped to buy" that car, but too bad so sad. You died.


So many people telling people how to spend money.

Do I pay too much for my cars? Sure.

Can I afford them? Yup

Will I die tomorrow? Who knows

Notice the definites in those 3 questions. Today I can afford them, Tomorrow I can afford them too, but tomorrow isn't guaranteed to me.

Sure it's nice to set yourself up for future 30 years from now, but 30 minutes from isn't guaranteed

 

[Buckwheat 1]

And you may die before your need for shelter stops. And for years you "hoped to buy" that car, but too bad so sad. You died.


So many people telling people how to spend money.

Do I pay too much for my cars? Sure.

Can I afford them? Yup

Will I die tomorrow? Who knows

Notice the definites in those 3 questions. Today I can afford them, Tomorrow I can afford them too, but tomorrow isn't guaranteed to me.

Sure it's nice to set yourself up for future 30 years from now, but 30 minutes from isn't guaranteed

 

[Steve@TF]

Look at how loaded the vehicles are. I looked at new '15 F250 with a diesel and 4x4. It was 43k as an XL, but had power window, cruise, ect. Also a crew cab long bed, so its going to have a higher price.

I remember my dad's old trucks. Hand crank windows, 4 speed manual, manual hubs, and regular cab.

You don't have to drop 50k to get a nice pickup. Nice half tons are low to mid 30's.

i just inherited my fathers 94 CK1500 Silverado extra cab. has V8, ac, power windows, door locks (not mirrors!), tow package, etc... NO airbags lol. he paid $20k for it in 1994. using an inflation calculator that would be $33k today.
i just went to chevy's website. the cheapest extra cab Silverado with no extras added is ........wait for it.........wait for it..........wait for it..........














wait for it......











$33k. with waaay more bells and whistles. not bad at all. of course, nowadays everyone wants a crew cab (which is great) and tons of other features that you dont really need but are nice to have. heated/cooled, seats, touch screen radio with nav, big alloy wheels, and much more. which then makes the vehicle jump to $40k - $50k. back then you could add the one option you want for X amount of dollars. want ac, add $1k to the sticker price. leather seats? add $1200. etc... nowadays the manufacturers package the options they hook you into add another $3-5k onto the price. just for the one option you really want but have to get a bunch of other stuff with it.

i grew up in the era where everything was optional. a/c, power windows, power door locks, a RADIO! lol, carpeting on the floor (for trucks). my first vehicle was a mazda B2000 with no ac, roll up windows, manual locks and mirrors, and about 80hp. it didnt even have power brakes or power steering. and i loved it! lol.
back then my dad said you dont need all that junk (even ac) and always opted for the cheapest version of whatever vehicle he was buying. we bought a 1990 honda accord brand new and they opted for the DX with roll up windows, manual mirrors and locks. had a/c though thank God.

so even today, with my dads 94 silverado it has everything i need in a vehicle. except power mirrors which i hate not having! as old as that truck is it keeps on going and is very cheap/easy to fix. and the mpg isnt that bad because its so light.

my dad almost died from laughing when he heard how much a new beetle cost. he said he bought his for like $500. im like, that was a lawnmower with multiple seats and a roof. todays beetle is a real car. but we have a hard time grasping how much cars cost due to inflation. same thing with a house. my dad said there's no way he would pay $500k for a house which is what i paid for mine. the cheapest houses in my area, at the time (3+ years ago) were $400k and much smaller.
he was just telling me the other day that his first job out of the service sucked and paid only about $7 an hour. to which i responded "yeah but minimum wage was $2.30 an hour (1977). unfortunately wages have not kept up with inflation which makes everything seem so much more expensive.

 

[Blown 89]

There was a radio interview on the BBC a few weeks ago that talked about how the American auto market is being held up with sub-prime loans right now. I'm too lazy to find it but looking around the road I'd believe it.

 

[Gravik]

They need to lower prices.

A basic f150 with leather seats is 50k new....

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[13COBRA]

They need to lower prices.

A basic f150 with leather seats is 50k new....

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

A "basic F-150" with "leather seats" is not a basic F-150 lol

 

[Gravik]

A "basic F-150" with "leather seats" is not a basic F-150 lol

Should be. Should be able to get a bare bones f150 with leather seats instead of having to spend 50k to get leather.

The only way f150s now are actually affordable is a stripped out regular cab with zero options.

The cheapest build your own 4x4 f150 crewcab is 38k. Only options selected were 4x4. And that's with the na 3.3 v6

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[13COBRA]

Should be. Should be able to get a bare bones f150 with leather seats instead of having to spend 50k to get leather.

The only way f150s now are actually affordable is a stripped out regular cab with zero options.

The cheapest build your own 4x4 f150 crewcab is 38k. Only options selected were 4x4. And that's with the na 3.3 v6

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

A basic F-150 should include leather? lol

 

[Gravik]

A basic F-150 should include leather? lol

Should be an option.

Right now you have to get a lariat just to get leather.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[13COBRA]

Should be an option.

Right now you have to get a lariat just to get leather.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

The 2013/14 had the leather option in an XLT and it didn't sell for shit.

 

[DHG1078]

I do agree that it can be annoying when you want 1 piece of an option bundle, and can't select it on its own. Ford, and others, do it because their studies show certain combinations increase both sales and profit margins. They don't just do it on a whim.

 

[Stanger00]

Should be. Should be able to get a bare bones f150 with leather seats instead of having to spend 50k to get leather.

The only way f150s now are actually affordable is a stripped out regular cab with zero options.

The cheapest build your own 4x4 f150 crewcab is 38k. Only options selected were 4x4. And that's with the na 3.3 v6

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Guess you missed those STX rebates. A crew cab 4x4 were selling for around 32. I could be wrong and scabs were under 30.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[phillycobra99]

I get that and understand the psychology of wanting to get a deal.

My point was directed at new vehicles, specifically full size trucks. Right now, it isn't a "deal" to get $10K off a new 1/2 ton truck, it's normal and expected as has been said by others in this thread. I guess my point was if a truck is truly priced reasonably at $45K, the manufacturer wouldn't need to give $10K in incentives so people buy it at $35K. Although it is a specialty truck, this is shown with the Raptor not having huge discounts. People are willing to pay msrp for those trucks and incentives won't start unless the demand drops. Same goes for midsize trucks such as the Tacoma. You won't see huge discounts on those anytime soon.

I've never bought a new vehicle, but it's normal to get 10k off of sticker price?

 

[DHG1078]

I've never bought a new vehicle, but it's normal to get 10k off of sticker price?

It is not unusual for trucks to get major rebates in the 7-10k range.

 

[Balt21]

I've never bought a new vehicle, but it's normal to get 10k off of sticker price?

On trucks, yes. Pretty much any other vehicle, no. Go to the Ram or Chevy site. The first thing that pops up on both home pages are $11K+ incentives on select 1500 series trucks (the Silverado specifies $1000 of that is loyalty though, so there is fine print to get the total amount).

 

[Never_Enough]

I do agree that it can be annoying when you want 1 piece of an option bundle, and can't select it on its own. Ford, and others, do it because their studies show certain combinations increase both sales and profit margins. They don't just do it on a whim.

Well, obviously all manufacturers do it to increase profits...

 

[LogiWorld123]

I skimmed so this might have been mentioned but, cars last quite a bit longer nowadays than even 15 years ago. Is anyone scared to buy a 100k car anymore? My car has 200k miles and I get unsolicited offers to buy it occasionally from friends and family.

Long term notes make more sense now because the collateral isn't going to just literally fall apart. Consumers get way more car with far lower payments.

 

[nickf2005]

Long term notes make more sense now because the collateral isn't going to just literally fall apart. Consumers get way more car with far lower payments.

Even if vehicles are lasting longer, long-term notes don't make sense when little is put down, and the new owner is instantly upside-down the moment they drive off the lot. One accident (auto or medical that leads to loss of the ability to work) or downturn in economy leading to a job loss puts the owner in a bad financial situation. The probability of something like that happening increases when you're paying on a vehicles for 6-7 years versus 2-4 years.

These long-term financing options are making people think just the way you are stating it. It'd be the same as saying that it would be wise for mortgage lenders to make 45 year notes an option to the public so people can afford more house than they can truly afford.

We saw the pop on the housing market, I feel the same will come with auto loans. If that's the case, I'll be looking for a good deal on repossessed vehicles here in a few years.

 

[DHG1078]

Even if vehicles are lasting longer, long-term notes don't make sense when little is put down, and the new owner is instantly upside-down the moment they drive off the lot. One accident (auto or medical that leads to loss of the ability to work) or downturn in economy leading to a job loss puts the owner in a bad financial situation. The probability of something like that happening increases when you're paying on a vehicles for 6-7 years versus 2-4 years.

These long-term financing options are making people think just the way you are stating it. It'd be the same as saying that it would be wise for mortgage lenders to make 45 year notes an option to the public so people can afford more house than they can truly afford.

We saw the pop on the housing market, I feel the same will come with auto loans. If that's the case, I'll be looking for a good deal on repossessed vehicles here in a few years.

I don't think mortgage lenders will go for loans longer than 30 years. That's 75% of the working career of a college graduate already, and people tend to buy more than one house.