Question about denying orders?

[svtfocus2cobra]

I need the lowdown on this process and the outcome to expect.

I'm currently in a 5 year Security Forces contract in the Marines. I'm with RTT which most don't know, but it's probably the best job you can have in the Marines. Security Forces is always hurting for bodies so I've already been extended here 6mo past the 2 years I was supposed to be at this command. I should have left in June but now it's going to be more like Jan 2013. My 3 year mark comes up in October this year.

Hearing from most of my buddies that have left for the fleet, word is that it sucks balls right now with the war being drawn down. One said Pendleton is literally losing its mind. Inspections like crazy, haircuts are either high and tights or completely shaved, drilling, etc. This is the kind of stuff I simply do not care for, especially in comparison to what I'm doing now.

So with all that, myself and quite a few of my guys that leave the same time I do are considering denying orders to stay at our command since it doesn't look like they will extend us any longer. How does this process work and what outcome should I expect? Those of us considering it don't plan on re-upping after our contract is up which we understand you are allowed to deny orders once but when you're contract is up they more than likely will force you out. If I deny am I guaranteed to stay where I am for the remainder of my contract, or will they come back with some new orders that send me where I absolutely don't want to go?

I'd appreciate the info from anyone in the know. I want to get some info before I go to my platoon sgt and present him with the idea. It would actually help my unit if some of us could stay because when 12 of us leave all at once they are going to be really hurting.

:beer:

 

[USMC53CHIEF]

Every Marine is entitled to deny orders, without repercussions....on an official level. Denying orders will only effect you if you are going to reenlist really. When it comes time for you to reenlist you wont get any say in where you are going basically. I f you are not planning on reenlisting you will be fine.

 

[Fuerza]

Every Marine is entitled to deny orders, without repercussions....on an official level. Denying orders will only effect you if you are going to reenlist really. When it comes time for you to reenlist you wont get any say in where you are going basically. I f you are not planning on reenlisting you will be fine.

Granted I'm in the Army so I can't comment on how the Marines works, but your use of the word "entitled" is really confusing me. He is on official orders to PCS, my point is that Marines are telling it's time to move so how is he entitled to deny?

In the Army you can turn down an assignment but the big Army will put you out of service quickly. That is a scenario of flat out refusal, you can call your MOS branch and attempt to get your assignment changed but nothing is guaranteed.

 

[svtfocus2cobra]

Granted I'm in the Army so I can't comment on how the Marines works, but your use of the word "entitled" is really confusing me. He is on official orders to PCS, my point is that Marines are telling it's time to move so how is he entitled to deny?

In the Army you can turn down an assignment but the big Army will put you out of service quickly. That is a scenario of flat out refusal, you can call your MOS branch and attempt to get your assignment changed but nothing is guaranteed.

I've heard we're "allowed" to deny orders once but of course I haven't heard that from anything official. I'm confident you can do it without getting in trouble but what I'm curious to know is if they'll turn around 2 or 3 months later and issue me new orders. If I deny my orders I want to be able to stay where I am until EAS.

Edit: After doing a little searching it looks like you can deny orders but only under certain circumstances. Simply not wanting to go to your next unit because it's lame is not a good reason. There is a chance that because my unit is tight on bodies that our CO might permanently extend us. It's a long shot but it's possible from what I hear. It looks like denying orders can cause a lot of unwanted negative attention so you better have a good reason for doing it.

 

[Mach1USMC]

Usually denying orders is bad juju. ESPECIALLY considering the drawdown. They are looking for any excuse to not let you re-enlist. This could be the one. Like 53Chief said. If you aren't going to re-enlist then don't worry about it. My question is if you like the kind of stuff you are doing now why not just do MARSOC? I have a few buddies in MARSOC and they love it- they also don't play the "games" you alluded to. Other options would be lat move. Counter Intel, SigInt, Force Recon, and EOD are ALWAYS looking for talent and don't usually play the games the regular FMF plays. Why not do one of those?

 

[svtfocus2cobra]

Usually denying orders is bad juju. ESPECIALLY considering the drawdown. They are looking for any excuse to not let you re-enlist. This could be the one. Like 53Chief said. If you aren't going to re-enlist then don't worry about it. My question is if you like the kind of stuff you are doing now why not just do MARSOC? I have a few buddies in MARSOC and they love it- they also don't play the "games" you alluded to. Other options would be lat move. Counter Intel, SigInt, Force Recon, and EOD are ALWAYS looking for talent and don't usually play the games the regular FMF plays. Why not do one of those?

Those were actually all things I was looking at and considering, but I just don't think I want to stay in. I'm turning 27 tomorrow so I want to settle down and get married and start some other kind of business endeavor. I don't want to drag my family around while I'm gone 2/3 of the year out training or on deployment. If I was younger I'd have been all over it, but I just don't want to extend my contract to do any of those anymore.

 

[Mach1USMC]

Those were actually all things I was looking at and considering, but I just don't think I want to stay in. I'm turning 27 tomorrow so I want to settle down and get married and start some other kind of business endeavor. I don't want to drag my family around while I'm gone 2/3 of the year out training or on deployment. If I was younger I'd have been all over it, but I just don't want to extend my contract to do any of those anymore.

I hear ya - those MOS's deploy and train more than the majority of others. You wouldn't see your family much at all. Well make sure you get some education while your in- that shit is expensive. Save your GI bill for when you get out!!

 

[F1reStart3r]

Jon if your unit is hurting for bodies typically your CO will call the monitor and deny for manpower on his own. It happened in my old unit because there were no replacements inbound and you have minimal staffing requirements by PPOP. I'd talk to your SNCO about it. Unless you are a shitbag, which you aren't, they will likely keep you. Especially when NCOs because you can't replace experience.

 

[svtfocus2cobra]

I hear ya - those MOS's deploy and train more than the majority of others. You wouldn't see your family much at all. Well make sure you get some education while your in- that shit is expensive. Save your GI bill for when you get out!!

That's definitely my plan. Being from this state and being stationed here it would be nice to stay because I've been looking at property which is something I've been wanting to do and have some experience working in that field so it would be really convenient to stay here. But of course I can't plan on getting my way, I'm in the wrong place for that! :lol1: :beer:

Jon if your unit is hurting for bodies typically your CO will call the monitor and deny for manpower on his own. It happened in my old unit because there were no replacements inbound and you have minimal staffing requirements by PPOP. I'd talk to your SNCO about it. Unless you are a shitbag, which you aren't, they will likely keep you. Especially when NCOs because you can't replace experience.

I think they've already taken this route in which they extended everyone 6 months which is supposed to be our max but we've got guys who have been here longer. They said they won't keep us past the point where we have 17months left on our contracts, but I have a feeling that's just a general statement for the masses because there's still all those guard guys that want out so they're giving them that hope. They keep telling us they have a plan but we're looking at it and shaking our heads because we're going to lose pretty much all their leadership in RTT, and my friend in guard is saying the same thing for them. I'm hoping they'll consider keeping a few of us for this reason alone because we simply don't have enough time to get our junior guys spun up to our knowledge level before we leave.

 

[Dragu1a]

are you on your first enlistment? is rtt the same thing as cqb and what base are you on? i was in kings bay, ga.

i don't blame you on not wanting to go to the fleet with deployments dying down. working the guard is pretty skate, especially if you're an nco. i lucked out when i went to the fleet. went on pcs leave, checked into 1/1 while they were at cax so we just hung out at the barracks. they came back, we went on pre-deployment leave, came back from iraq and got fap'd to hq about a month later to make room for the boot drop and eas'd about 2 months after that. got out of all the stupid games.

didn't do shit in hq.

 

[svtfocus2cobra]

are you on your first enlistment? is rtt the same thing as cqb and what base are you on? i was in kings bay, ga.

i don't blame you on not wanting to go to the fleet with deployments dying down. working the guard is pretty skate, especially if you're an nco. i lucked out when i went to the fleet. went on pcs leave, checked into 1/1 while they were at cax so we just hung out at the barracks. they came back, we went on pre-deployment leave, came back from iraq and got fap'd to hq about a month later to make room for the boot drop and eas'd about 2 months after that. got out of all the stupid games.

didn't do shit in hq.

On first enlistment and yes, CQB is the main school we attend for RTT. I'm at Bangor right now. It is really skate here and Wa is where I'm from so it's even more convenient. Not wanting to leave here is the hardest part.

I've pretty much given up on trying to stay here but anything could happen from now until Jan that could keep us here. I am looking forward to the fleet a little bit more now as most of us leaving at that time are really considering trying to get into a STA platoon when we get there. Our Plt. Sgt is a SS and he's all about getting us the hookup to try and get us into there or to any indoc whether it be Recon or Marsoc. The nice thing about being here is that it really sets us up for success if we want to join any of those down the road.

I'm just at the point where I want to do something different with my life now so I'm eager to get out, but still want to get as much out of my last 2 years as I can. From everything I've heard from old RTT members was to get to a STA platoon so that's my plan as of now.