Official GT 5.0/Boss 302 UOA thread

[cheeser]

I have been using Amsoil SS 5-20 in my 2013 GT. This is my first report with 2,646 miles on this oil. I have taken the car out to the local road course (High Plains Raceway) this summer, and after reading this and other threads, looks like I need to bump up my oil to 10-30 or 10-40. The only issue is this car is driven in the winter when the roads are fine.

 

[UnleashedBeast]

Cheeser, do you have the bottom half of that report which shows viscosity and TBN?

 

[cheeser]

Cheeser, do you have the bottom half of that report which shows viscosity and TBN?

Sorry, cropped a bit too much.

Sus. 55.3
Cst. 8.86
Flashpoint. 455
Tbn. 1.7

 

[UnleashedBeast]

TBN only 1.7 after so few miles? That's not good.

 

[SirJAG]

W

 

[cheeser]

TBN only 1.7 after so few miles? That's not good.

I wonder if that is from the approximately 50 laps (2.5 mile laps) from three separate sessions that I have taken this car out to the road course? From the recommendations, looks I should bump up to 10-30 or 10-40. As this car is driven occasionally in the winter (when roads are good), I wonder if 10-40 is too much though? I guess we could just run the 5-20 in winter, and 10-30/10-40 in summer.

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

Unleashed, when I get some leave time and get out of Japan I plan on doing an oil change of the first fill of amsoil we did. Ill get it tested and send you the results.

 

[UnleashedBeast]

SirJag,

Thank you!

I wonder if that is from the approximately 50 laps (2.5 mile laps) from three separate sessions that I have taken this car out to the road course? From the recommendations, looks I should bump up to 10-30 or 10-40. As this car is driven occasionally in the winter (when roads are good), I wonder if 10-40 is too much though? I guess we could just run the 5-20 in winter, and 10-30/10-40 in summer.

Woah, you did 50 laps on 3 different sessions on the same fill of Amsoil Signature Series 5W-20? Wear metals look amazing for that kind of action. Results like these do not support Grant808's concerns of too little viscosity for road course racing.

Even with that abuse, I would not have expected TBN to be that low. Guess we can wait to see the next sample from next year. I'd consider a bit more viscosity for road course racing. Perhaps 10W-30 ATM next fill.

Unleashed, when I get some leave time and get out of Japan I plan on doing an oil change of the first fill of amsoil we did. Ill get it tested and send you the results.

Thank you, will add it to the list.

 

[Grant808]

Woah, you did 50 laps on 3 different sessions on the same fill of Amsoil Signature Series 5W-20? Wear metals look amazing for that kind of action. Results like these do not support Grant808's concerns of too little viscosity for road course racing.

Even with that abuse, I would not have expected TBN to be that low. Guess we can wait to see the next sample from next year. I'd consider a bit more viscosity for road course racing. Perhaps 10W-30 ATM next fill.

:rollseyes There you go again. It's a GT, and that's only an hour and a half to two hours of run time tops. BFD.

 

[UnleashedBeast]

:rollseyes There you go again. It's a GT, and that's only an hour and a half to two hours of run time tops. BFD.

You mean, experience learning sessions.......not serious road course racing. Yep, got it.

So what in your opinion makes the boss require a 50 grade lubricant for street and "learning the course" when the lil' ol' GT did it with exceptional results only using 5W-20?

 

[Grant808]

You mean, experience learning sessions.......not serious road course racing. Yep, got it.

WTF are "experience learning sessions"? Where do you come up with these terms? It's like talking to an alien. And how do you define "serious" vs. not serious road course racing?

You keep trying to make the argument for your qualifications and you just don't make any sense.

So what in your opinion makes the boss require a 50 grade lubricant for street and "learning the course" when the lil' ol' GT did it with exceptional results only using 5W-20?

7,500 RPM and lack of piston cooling jets. And the oil cooler for discussion sake.

 

[_Snake_]

Like Grant, I'm underwhelmed by these "exceptional results," especially considering they're in a GT.

 

[cheeser]

SirJag,

Thank you!



Woah, you did 50 laps on 3 different sessions on the same fill of Amsoil Signature Series 5W-20? Wear metals look amazing for that kind of action. Results like these do not support Grant808's concerns of too little viscosity for road course racing.

Even with that abuse, I would not have expected TBN to be that low. Guess we can wait to see the next sample from next year. I'd consider a bit more viscosity for road course racing. Perhaps 10W-30 ATM next fill.



Thank you, will add it to the list.

Unleashed,


In looking at my records, looks like it was about 60 laps on three separate days...about 20 laps per day. I typically ran about 6 - 8 laps in a session. As fyi, I didn't wind it up to 7000...I think my max was around 5500 after looking at the data. The daily temps for two sessions were in the 70-80s, while the last one was from 50 - 70, so it wasn't hot out. Was planning on bumping up the viscosity next year when I try one of the HPDE events with the instructor in the car.

I was thinking about putting in the oil cooler and maybe the better radiator next summer....can get warm out on the plains.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9P56BL_SGE4

 

[Grant808]

Unleashed,


In looking at my records, looks like it was about 60 laps on three separate days...about 20 laps per day. I typically ran about 6 - 8 laps in a session. As fyi, I didn't wind it up to 7000...I think my max was around 5500 after looking at the data. The daily temps for two sessions were in the 70-80s, while the last one was from 50 - 70, so it wasn't hot out. Was planning on bumping up the viscosity next year when I try one of the HPDE events with the instructor in the car.

I was thinking about putting in the oil cooler and maybe the better radiator next summer....can get warm out on the plains.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9P56BL_SGE4

Woah, you did 50 laps on 3 different sessions on the same fill of Amsoil Signature Series 5W-20? Wear metals look amazing for that kind of action. Results like these do not support Grant808's concerns of too little viscosity for road course racing.

UB, Do you still stand by your 'analysis' above? :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

 

[darreng505]

I have been using Amsoil SS 5-20 in my 2013 GT. This is my first report with 2,646 miles on this oil. I have taken the car out to the local road course (High Plains Raceway) this summer, and after reading this and other threads, looks like I need to bump up my oil to 10-30 or 10-40. The only issue is this car is driven in the winter when the roads are fine.

View attachment 28497

Why are you trying to outsmart the cars engineers? You cant. And neither can UB.
All you've done here is hurt your motor and voI'd your warranty.

Like a brilliant insight from the other thread here (lpheaven) "we're not launching the space shuttle here".

Why create a bad solution to a problem that doesn't exist.

The spec oil and viscosity works fine. Is safe. And performs. Its only drawback is off the shelf availability. Any other brand in the spec is also fine. But tampering with viscosity is a recipe for disaster....

 

[UnleashedBeast]

Darren, from his UOA.....he hurt nothing. Looks great. Why the dooms day speech? Bean counters chose Motorcraft 5W-50, not engineers. It's a Ford exclusive, of course they will recommend it.

WTF are "experience learning sessions"? Where do you come up with these terms? It's like talking to an alien. And how do you define "serious" vs. not serious road course racing?

You keep trying to make the argument for your qualifications and you just don't make any sense.

Well, since he didn't take it over 5,500 rpm......wouldn't that make him a "learner" trying to get "experience"? He is driving a car built for the street, so I doubt he was there for serious competition.

7,500 RPM and lack of piston cooling jets. And the oil cooler for discussion sake.

The cooler helps to decrease oil temps, that's a positive.

Like Grant, I'm underwhelmed by these "exceptional results," especially considering they're in a GT.

You are also the guy who told me I "settled" for the Armageddon twin turbo kit. Bwahahahahaha! It's an upgrade to the Fluid kit. Most people don't have the "coin" to upgrade, I do.

UB, Do you still stand by your 'analysis' above?

I'd bet everything in my bank account, which is significant, on this bet....

Identical cars, driven by the same person, around the same track, the same # of laps, on any chosen day. One car with Amsoil 10W-40 XL and one with Motorcraft 5W-50. The car with Amsoil would have a UOA as good, or better (most likely), than the car using Motorcraft.

Sure, you will fight me tooth and nail on this, but it's whatever. Science has proven you wrong before, and it will again. All you know is "what I am told to use", not what science has shown superior.

 

[cheeser]

Darren, from his UOA.....he hurt nothing. Looks great. Why the dooms day speech? Bean counters chose Motorcraft 5W-50, not engineers. It's a Ford exclusive, of course they will recommend it.

Well, since he didn't take it over 5,500 rpm......wouldn't that make him a "learner" trying to get "experience"? He is driving a car built for the street, so I doubt he was there for serious competition.

The cooler helps to decrease oil temps, that's a positive.

QUOTE]


Yes, I am out there for fun. If I was out for competition, doubt I would be using our daily driver car Any mods I make (oil cooler, maybe a radiator, brakes, etc) are simply to make the car a bit better. I tried looking for track pack cars in our area, but nothing was available in the color we liked.

 

[Grant808]

There you go again talking out of both sides of your mouth...

Wear metals look amazing for that kind of action. Results like these do not support Grant808's concerns of too little viscosity for road course racing.

Even with that abuse, I would not have expected TBN to be that low. Guess we can wait to see the next sample from next year. I'd consider a bit more viscosity for road course racing. Perhaps 10W-30 ATM next fill.

First, you think it's 'road course racing' and 'abuse'^

You mean, experience learning sessions.......not serious road course racing. Yep, got it.

Well, since he didn't take it over 5,500 rpm......wouldn't that make him a "learner" trying to get "experience"? He is driving a car built for the street, so I doubt he was there for serious competition.

Then you think it's only 'experience learning'^ Which is it? Did you realize your mistake yet? :rollseyes

So what in your opinion makes the boss require a 50 grade lubricant for street and "learning the course" when the lil' ol' GT did it with exceptional results only using 5W-20?

The cooler helps to decrease oil temps, that's a positive.

So you agree about the 7,500 RPM and the lack of cooling jets? That's why you only point to the cooler, right? So you'd also ignore the effect of heat transfer to the coolant side? This is why your analysis and arguments are always so one-dimensional.

Why do YOU think Ford recommends 5W-50 on the Track Pack GTs?

I'd bet everything in my bank account, which is significant, on this bet....

Identical cars, driven by the same person, around the same track, the same # of laps, on any chosen day. One car with Amsoil 10W-40 XL and one with Motorcraft 5W-50. The car with Amsoil would have a UOA as good, or better (most likely), than the car using Motorcraft.

Sure, you will fight me tooth and nail on this, but it's whatever. Science has proven you wrong before, and it will again. All you know is "what I am told to use", not what science has shown superior.

So, what, send you a PM anytime I need an extra 40 bucks? :rollseyes

Only a FOOL would place such a bet when car to car sample variation could totally screw with the results. You sir are that fool. :rollseyes

Take that 'significant' amount in your bank account and DO the virgin and used HT/HS test on your beloved 10W-40 and MC 5W-50 that I mentioned in one of your other threads.

You've claimed in the past MC 5W-50 to be HT/HS as low as 2.9 and sometimes 3.1, IIRC. If it's 2.9 or below, I'll pay for the testing. 3.2 and above, and YOU buy 20 Amsoil changes for SVTP members and post about how wrong you are in 4 of these oil threads.

It's put up or shut up time.

 

[UnleashedBeast]

You're a "fool" for thinking HT/HS doesn't decrease when the formulation shears. Do you NOT understand how Viscosity Improving Polymers work? They expand when heated to maintain a higher viscosity at engine operating temperatures. When they wear out (shear), the formulation returns to the characteristics of the native base oil without polymers. Therefore HT/HS also decreases. It's a known proven fact Motorcraft 5W-50 shears rapidly to a light SAE 40 grade, within the first 1,500 miles. However, you continue to play devil's advocate for proven science.

I don't have to do anything. Amsoil 10W-40 does not shear like Motorcraft 5W-50, maintaining its virgin specification throughout the oil change interval within 10% or less. People track the Boss 302 and Track Pack GT all the time with Motorcraft 5W-50 when it has sheared past 1,500 miles. Therefore, they are tracking the car with a light SAE 40 grade lubricant, NOT a 50 grade.

You say the results would be insignificant between two identical factory Boss 302 cars. Oh geez, you talk about how Ford engineers know best, but at the same time downplay their quality control. Yet I am the one "talking out both side of my mouth". You would argue with the wall.

 

[VTBoss302]

5W50 Alterntives

UB is obviously not a fan of the Motorcraft 5W50, but I'm curious as to what people might think about the some of the other 5W50 oils available

Redline makes a 5W50 which seems to be aimed at WSS-M2C931-B applications

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=135&pcid=21

Driven Racing Oil makes a 5W50 "Formulated Specifically For Ford Coyote Engines"

http://www.drivenracingoil.com/dro/fr50-5w-50-synthetichtml/