KB vs. Whipple superchargers.

[03Red10th]

03red10th stated that the Steeda 2pt may fit but I honestly can't tell you for sure, but Steeda has installed some SC's so they should be able to answer that for you.

The 3.25" should be running approx. 15lbs of boost on a stock engine, approx. 16lbs with CAI, large TB, stock exhaust, back to 15lbs with x pipe, headers, cat back.

Thanks,
Dustin

Here's the emails I got from MM and Steeda:

MM,
Question: Will the MMSTB-7 stb fit with a Kenne Bell or Whipple blower for a 2003 mustang cobra?

Answer: Yes, it works great with any blower that has equal or smaller dimensions than stock. The Kenne Bell blower sits a bit lower than the stock 03-04 Cobra unit, so this will not be a problem.

Steeda,
Question: Will your 2 point and 3 point stb fit with a Kenny Bell or Whipple
blower for a 2003 mustang cobra?

Answer: Our 2 point brace will fit with a Kenne Bell, but not the larger
Whipple. Our 3 point brace has yet to be test fit with either....

 

[Tex Arcana]

Wow, this is absolutely amazing. One, that a pair of manufacturer representatives would actually go at it like this; another because of the information this is dusting up.

However, mike69440 said it right in his post, and I have yet to see the answer to his question:

One question for both:
What is the first critical speed of the rotors?

KB's flunkies posted some information, which was based on some tests he claims as having been done, and they show what he wanted them to show. Now, of course, we all should konw that a test can be designed to play to the strengths of a particular item; we also know that there are "lies, damn lies, and statistics", meaning that statistics can be twisted to say anything you want them to.

To be honest, it's good that Dustin chose to post up himself, even if he has a paucity of numbers to back himself up: his information parallels that I found independently a few years ago (when the Lysholm design started showing up) and I went looking for the source of the design--and my research showed that Lysholm was the originator of the twin-screw design, and that they are the primary licensers of said design to both Whipple and to Kenne Bell, and that neither are true originators of the design. My research also showed that the Whipple was ISO 9003 certified (IIRC--it was a couple years ago, and I can't find any information now about this), thanks to their association with Eaton and the use of their drive internals, which KB couldn't claim at the time.

KBs are popular because for a while there they were the only game in town for Ford products, both Mustangs and Lightnings. One of my Cobra compatriots (name withheld here for obvious reasons) has an early KB on his '03 Cobra, and he STILL has issues with the oil blowby (an issue which, to me, should've been dealt with by KB not only under warranty, but immediately with a mod to repair the issue, not a kludge--the oil recovery system--to get by the problem, which really never solved the issue), which KB never made good on. His beast makes 600+ at the wheels now, which is a good thing, but if it were me, KB would never have gotten away with telling me to "live with it".

Now that Whipple is in the game, it seems that anything coming from KB is negative and makes claims and posts numbers which are not independently verifiable, at least by consumers. And when they get more and more stridently "propagandizing", to the point of pulling minor parts to show that "the KB is superior because the widget is BIGGER" (not a direct quote, just an example of how the PDF reads), that tells me that the "data sheet" is nothing more than a propaganda sheet, with numbers throw in to make it look legitimate.

In defense of KB, Dustin definitely needs more raw "numbers" to back up some of his claims. He already posted the info needed to clarify the relationship issue; I can also understand why he felt he needed to defend his company (just look at the "comparison" PDF from KB, which is definitely a shot at Whipple). However, they both need to step back a bit and be a bit more professional--and Jim Bell should either step in and help defuse this, or tell his flunkies to tone down their rhetoric; Dustin, so should you.

Now, to the issue of which is better: I propose a truly independent test, and I offer up my 2001 Lightning as the test bed. Both of you send me equally-matched blower kits for my truck. I will take each kit, hook it up to a flow test bench, test each one for maximum flow. Then, I will install each unit on my truck, and run a dyno in a controlled-environment dyno for each one. The one that flows the most and puts out the most power, wins. However, these kits must be off-the-shelf, if either one looks like a "ringer" (and I'll look!), the test will be invalidated, and the other will be the default winner.

So, what say y'all??

 

[rezcobra]

So, what say y'all??

I say use a Cobra thats set up to wind up to about 8000 rpm's and wind the heck out of both blowers with max boost. :thumbsup:

 

[bobbywayne21]

Hey Mike,

A year and a half? Jeez!! That positively sucks!!

I think I speak for Jim by saying yes to Afghanistan!

Again, we appreciate the sacrifices all of you are making for this great country!

Regards,

Ken

This might be a little late but I just bought the 2.2, 20050330 and throttle body, intake and My wife told them that I was in Irag and the sales man said NOTHING about the discount. She also emailed them and nothing. I am not complaing but if there is a discount why can't I get it. anyways I have wanted the kb for ever and I finally got one :rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

 

[bobbywayne21]

Is this discount still going on.... Please Please Please let it be.

 

[bsb4svt]

I am looking at replacing my 04 Cobra supercharger with either a KB or Whipple. I am leaning toward the Whipple. I want as much power at the track and still maintain an everyday driver. Any comments on either?

 

[DaleM]

I am looking at replacing my 04 Cobra supercharger with either a KB or Whipple. I am leaning toward the Whipple. I want as much power at the track and still maintain an everyday driver. Any comments on either?

I don't think you will be disappointed with either. I have the Whipple and Dustin has answered all my forum questions and PMs. Just make sure the snout issue has been addressed with the Whipple before you order!

 

[nugen]

Mr. Bell, thanks for your 10% discount for deployed soldiers. I think I can speak for everyone when I say how much your support means to us. Now is that 10% per deployment to Iraq? Is that based on a 6 or a 12 month tour?

I recently moved from NJ to Colorado and I've been looking for something to make up the power loss due to the elevation. I've considered some cam and ported blower setups. While they would probably maintain 500 horsepower at altitude, they would be more expensive than a new blower while delivering less overall performance. I want to make my engine appear as stock as possible, but this discount may put me over the edge. Thanks!

 

[bsb4svt]

By "snout problem", are you talking about the STB? I would get Steeda to install it so I will make they can get one on. I have a convertible, so I need all the bracing I can get.

 

[LightningFast00]

Whipple the king of ghost products.... Try making the damn super charger before you accept orders on them.... Heck the Lightning Whipple install instructions aren't even done yet and the kit was promised to be out in January.... Every one still waiting.... Whipple is a joke in my book and Kenne Bell has provin itself for many years...

see sig for the release date on any Lightning Whipple product.

 

[CobrABoZ]

i have a whipple and im very happy with it thus far havent had the snout problem or whatever has been going on. MY buddy has a kb 2.4 shooting oil everywhere,also have a friend with a lightning who had to send his kb back as well as another lightning owner same story. Not saying kb is bad or anything just sharing the storys around these parts.

 

[dgussin1]

see sig for the release date on any Lightning Whipple product.

lmmfao

 

[static1117]

Hmmm.....I was doing a search on the 2300ax for my 02 GT. This is interesting indeed. If I can get it to fit on my stang, I think im going whipple.

Josh

 

[Tex Arcana]

Hmmm.....I was doing a search on the 2300ax for my 02 GT. This is interesting indeed. If I can get it to fit on my stang, I think im going whipple.

Josh

Ya might want to hit the MMFF site, and do some research first. I saw a blower kit for 2-valve GTs, made by FRPP, that sets the blower under the intake runners, that was prety effective; and in this months MMFF, they test a Saleen unit for the '05 (bet they'll make a retrofit unit someday) that takes a screwblower (2300cc) and slings it upside down under the intake runners, with intercooler, and MMFF got some 120hp with the stock pullies and only 3.5psi.

 

[static1117]

Thats pretty impressive, does anyone know if the series V takes care of this airflow "restriction" of the saleen intake (i know it isnt a whipple design)