Gen 3 Install - Major Trouble

00Whitey

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OK guys Ive got a large issue going on. I finished up installing a gen 3 on my 14 manual and was in the process of data logging a 3 gear WOT pull from the vendor supplied initial tune. It started to break up a bit around 6k and all of a sudden it sounded like a something let loose (sounded like a separated exhaust boom), immediate blue smoke out the back. CEL flashed for a bit then went off. I drove it another 3 or 4 miles home and pulled the codes, P307 and P308. No visible issues going on so I checked compression and looks as though cyl 7 is dead. I did a bore scope look and no signs of any damage to the top of the piston, but the top of the piston was discolored with an apparent oil film. The plug also looked fouled, no holes in the block, no contaminated coolant and no oil underneath. It starts and runs but I am afraid of the worse as something is majorly wrong.

So at this point my head is spinning trying to plan next steps in determining next steps here. I should note that prior to this it was running fine and AF appeared as good monitoring from the stock cluster gage pack.

If I fried the piston or rings can I replace the single piston, can it be done in the car if dropping the K member, I'm just sick at this point. Any further diagnostics suggestions ?

Sorry for the long rant, but any feedback is appreciated.
 

CobraBob

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Wow, that sucks. I can't offer any suggestions based on your initial findings, but I do pray that there is nothing major going on.
 

89 T-trim

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When you did compression test on #7 was it zero? Is this a Gen 3 long block or short block? With rocker cover off check #7 rockers, if looks ok start motor and see if all four valves are moving.
 

01yellercobra

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When you did compression test on #7 was it zero? Is this a Gen 3 long block or short block? With rocker cover off check #7 rockers, if looks ok start motor and see if all four valves are moving.
It would be better to turn the engine by hand as opposed to starting it in this condition.

Sorry OP, but it sounds like the engine is coming out. And no, you can swap a piston/rod from the bottom.
 

00Whitey

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The test compression on 7 was zero. and its a gen 1 motor. I got another set of eyes to have a look with the bore scope, looks like damage at the edge of the piston. So its going in to have a further look and pull the valve cover and check valves and also drop the motor and pull the pan. Not good !
 

me32

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The test compression on 7 was zero. and its a gen 1 motor. I got another set of eyes to have a look with the bore scope, looks like damage at the edge of the piston. So its going in to have a further look and pull the valve cover and check valves and also drop the motor and pull the pan. Not good !

Detonation?
 

Riddick

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Sorry to hear, this is everyone's worst nightmare after installing new mods on a car. Since you verified compression and saw visual damage to the piston the motor needs to come out. To fix it properly you will need to either bore the block or purchase a new block and start new. Even if you dont see any damage on the cylinder walls dont take any chances, bore the cylinders to ensure they are true. Your cheapest option is picking up a used Gen 1 short block and throwing that in there. I am not sure what your budget is so its hard to recommend a course of action.

Im curious to what caused it, my initial guess is you went super lean. Did you install a new fuel system or at least a boost a bump? If the latter, did you verify the booster was working? Since the tuner is left out of this thread will you post the log for us to look at? Best of luck

Leonard
 

00Whitey

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A bit of an update, pulled the valve cover and no signs of damage up on top. Motor is getting dropped this coming week. Anyone have any leads on a Gen 1 built shortblock or a factory shortblock ? I've seen plenty of built Gen 2's available but the Gen 1 heads are not compatible from everything I see (piston to head clearance). Trying to keep the costs down if at all possible.
The install did include the boost a pump and have not verified the voltage increase. That def. needs to be done once it gets back together. As for the log, I was not able to get it saved when things went south :-(.
 

CobraBob

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Sorry to hear that your further investigation is pointing to an engine rebuild/replacement. Sounds like your budget is somewhat limited, and that sucks, too. :(
 

7998

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Well look on the brightside, when you rebuild it you'll have one bad ass ride. Your cheapest bet is a Gen 2 short block. Actually your cheapest option is to order a rotating assembly and do the work your self.
Just curious, what injectors are you running? And what's the voltage coming out of the BAP?
 
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stang910

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Make sure to identify the problem so your new engine stays together. I’d label the injector that came from the failed cylinder and have them cleaned and flow tested.
 

00Whitey

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Injectors are new DW95's. And for sure the BAP needs to be checked out. What's the best way to check the BAP, any writes ups on that ? Its the VMP plug and play unit. I'll be pissed if that BAP caused this whole situation. Rather odd that the original codes were just cyl 7 and 8 though, if the BAP is the culprit.
 

7998

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Injectors are new DW95's. And for sure the BAP needs to be checked out. What's the best way to check the BAP, any writes ups on that ? Its the VMP plug and play unit. I'll be pissed if that BAP caused this whole situation. Rather odd that the original codes were just cyl 7 and 8 though, if the BAP is the culprit.

Use a multimeter and check the voltage coming out of the BAP with the key forward. 7 & 8 might've been the weak link. I had a brand new BAP not work, it happens.
 

Sgthooligan

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A bit of an update, pulled the valve cover and no signs of damage up on top. Motor is getting dropped this coming week. Anyone have any leads on a Gen 1 built shortblock or a factory shortblock ? I've seen plenty of built Gen 2's available but the Gen 1 heads are not compatible from everything I see (piston to head clearance). Trying to keep the costs down if at all possible.
The install did include the boost a pump and have not verified the voltage increase. That def. needs to be done once it gets back together. As for the log, I was not able to get it saved when things went south :-(.

You can put Gen 1 heads on a Gen 2 block. And you can also put a Gen 2 long block in but you’ll have to use the cams from the Gen 1 with the rest of the running gear.


Sent from my iPhone using the svtperformance.com mobile app
 

00Whitey

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Update - Ended up with a Gen 2 Short block installed with the Gen 1 Heads. Had the valve seats gone thru and checked out, put ARP studs and good Cometic head gaskets. Dyno'ed at 640 on the original tune with DW95's, no adjustments needed, go figure ? So apparently my original motor had already some issues going on that we were not aware of. It ended up being a blown head gasket and piston damage on #7.
As an FYI, for those getting a Gen 2 short block, beware that the oil pan does not have provision for the oil level sensor. So you either have to swap pans or get the FOMOCO jumper harness to disable the pop up low oil indicator, pn is HU5Z-14A411-F for those interested.
 

crjackson

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beware that the oil pan does not have provision for the oil level sensor. So you either have to swap pans or get the FOMOCO jumper harness to disable the pop up low oil indicator, pn is HU5Z-14A411-F for those interested.

Thanks for the tip. I take it that the Gen1 pan fits the Gen2 block?
 

CobraBob

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Well, that's at least good news that you found out what happened to the original engine and you now have a solid replacement going forward. I hope the cost of the replacement was within your budget.
 

fishinjeff

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Update - Ended up with a Gen 2 Short block installed with the Gen 1 Heads. Had the valve seats gone thru and checked out, put ARP studs and good Cometic head gaskets. Dyno'ed at 640 on the original tune with DW95's, no adjustments needed, go figure ? So apparently my original motor had already some issues going on that we were not aware of. It ended up being a blown head gasket and piston damage on #7.
As an FYI, for those getting a Gen 2 short block, beware that the oil pan does not have provision for the oil level sensor. So you either have to swap pans or get the FOMOCO jumper harness to disable the pop up low oil indicator, pn is HU5Z-14A411-F for those interested.
Thank you for that part #-tired of clicking off that warning every time it is fired up


Jeff
 

00Whitey

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Installed the $9 jumper from the moco, works like a charm and no more idiot warning.
 

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